Heart of Space

What are chakras relating to your actual experience of reality? I've always kind of seen them as just another belief that could potentially limit your growth. For example, like I can't feel the feelings related to the heart chakra until I believe it's open. I'm totally ignorant about this stuff. Like what does the actual chakra feel like?

Did he kill anyone though? Or did he just attract crazy people who did? You should look into this case. His trial was a witch hunt. I'm not saying Manson was a spiritual role model or anything, but you should look at the facts of this case you may be surprised. He literally used LSD as a means of killing the ego in the consciousness of his followers in his commune. The word enlightenment is very relevant here. You guys really should look into this case, it's really interesting.

I had an insight about him recently, I don't know how accurate it is, but yes he is actually enlightened to some degree. He's dead inside, which is why if you listen to him talk you can almost get this ineffable feeling that he is. But he's filled his consciousness with complete trash though, so he's definitely not someone to get spiritual advice from.

Very well put, friend. I was trying to make that point a little earlier in my discussion with @Outer. Great points.

Oh ok, I actually think we're in agreement, at least with that last statement regarding IQ and the speed of learning. That absolutely effects your ability to do this work and the speed at which you progress. You're totally right, it does make a difference in that regard.

So, I take it you disagree with Leo and the majority of major spiritual teacher's on their idea of what enlightenment is? I'm not chastising you, I'm genuinely asking. Correct, it is. No doubt, some brains definitely have a higher processing power, that's very true. Still, you haven't explained what your definition of truth is and then how this higher processing power is somehow necessary to get to that truth.

But, just saying 'knowing truth' as your definition is too vague. What is truth? Is it not what I've been talking about this whole time? Then you say you agree with my definition of awakening, which is seeing reality as it is, as in lack of separation of ego and world. Again, if you truly understand what this means you would know that intellect is not necessary for this and is in fact actually one of the primary culprits for why you have to start enlightenment work in the first place to uncondition your mind. Like I said previously, I think that intellect could help with your ability to more effectively uncondition the mind, but it is not a prerequisite.

So, your definition of enlightenment is 'knowing truth?' So, what is truth? Is it not that your ego creates an illusion of separation from the world? That's always been a major facet of every school of spirituality I've studied. Then again, I won't pretend like I know everything, because I definitely do not. What's your specific definition of enlightenment, or awakening? How do 'you' use the word? Isn't being 'more awake' as you say simply just seeing reality as it is to a higher degree than you did previously? As in ultimately seeing more of the one-ness of reality? This does not require the type of intellect that IQ measures my friend. I could see how, once you have been conditioned into illusion, that intelligence could aid you greatly in your ability to effectively uncondition yourself out of illusion. But ultimately, intelligence is not a prerequisite.

If there is no separation of an individual self and the world you are enlightened. Cows are enlightened. Lizards are enlightened. The most mentally handicapped person in the world can be enlightened as long as they have consciousness. The problem is that you're conflating states of the human mind with 'higher' or 'lower' consciousness. This has almost nothing to do with enlightenment. Ironically, it's our modern sense of intellect that moves us more into the illusion of being separate from our world.

Prerequisites for enlightenment: 1) Have consciousness 2) That's it

@egoless You're giving something attention that is the opposite of productive with this thread. You're feeding into a negative aspect of a certain mind. Sorry for the vague-ness, trying not to make anyone feel bad.

You're not looking past to what the words are pointing at. Rupert Spira is correct in the sense that enlightenment is the most ordinary thing. Leo's experience could also totally be authentic and not contradictory. Ever heard people say that there is no enlightenment to work for because you are already are enlightened? Ever heard people also say the seemingly very contradictory idea that you have to work very heard in meditation practice for enlightenment? If you understand what enlightenment is, you see very clearly, that they are both 100% correct. They're just talking about aspects of enlightenment in different ways. Don't focus so much on the petty content of people's words when they talk about this stuff. Try to see where they're pointing. There's a really good quote I heard somewhere that says something like "a wise man points at the moon, the ignorant person looks at the finger." You're looking at the finger, which is why you're so confused. You'll understand better as you progress.

Thanks for not torturing us all the way till Sunday. Appreciate ya, Leo, hope it's all going smoothly so far.

I approve of the shit posting in this thread.

It's important to understand the nature of ego and that it can be pervasive in spiritual practice as well. But you absolutely cannot meditate too much as long as you are doing it correctly. I wouldn't worry about it.

Open mind, but skeptical. Nothing wrong with that, seems like you have the correct attitude. I think other people here could learn from this.

Thanks man, we getting there. <3

Point taken. Consider my previous posts invalid. <3

Ah, you're upset. Sorry, friend. But, food for thought, one liner's to enlightenment are not original, nor have they ever worked for a single person ever.

Do you understand what I'm saying? Your one word response seems angry, but this is an important point. If you have built up constructs of self, they take time to deconstruct. That process is very slow. Are you new to this stuff?

That's actually pretty wrong. If you build up mental constructs over many years of your life, they take time to deconstruct. Yes, you are already enlightened, but to be actually realized you have to uncondition yourself and that can take a lifetime depending on the person.

You're a boob. Be quiet lol.

+1 In the worst case it's temporary and the insights he'll have for us will still be great. His talent lies in articulating this stuff to the modern western logical mind. Like my ass. Can't wait for his next video. Don't wait till Sunday Leo! This is important!

Psychedelics brah, the effects are real. Cheat code. I know some goofy anime video game nerd who has died temporarily on LSD and became everything. It's no joke.

Holy shit, congrats on dying Leo. I wonder though if he just got done tripping or something though. Pupils be dilated as eff.