Faceless

Yes. Any movement of conforimty to thought, (experience, knowledge, memory), is the same as clinging to the self/ego. The self seeks security in its own movement. But the self and it’s content (experience, knowledge, memory) is one and the same process of fear.

The self(time) attempting to use time (movement of self) to end time. The ultimate contradiction indeed.

Precisely

Indeed Thought is a self perpetuating process. And good call on identifying how explaining that process will seem circular ⭕️

This is to show that one cannot say if effort is necessary. Until you end attatchment, to say one must apply effort is an assumption. This implies fear is looking to escape fear, and that one is not investigating into fear without fear influencing that investigation. It may seem contradictory to one who is attatched. Just like it seems contradictory that fear is born of thought, and thought is born of fear. The cause is the effect and the effect is the cause. It‘s sublte and complex. And when we involve our own emotional attatchment to the investigation the investigation becomes corrupt by the very root of emotional attatchment, which is fear. Great question though. Such questions need to be approached.

These posts are not directed to anyone in particular, but to Us.

I’m not giving advice buddy. I’m pointing to the necessity of understanding attachment. When one is only interested in “how to remove attachment” one is not interested in understanding the problem. One is only influenced by fear to end it. Any movement of fear prevents understanding.

I understand what you are referring to quite well.

I like this thread you opened up by the way. The relationship of Memory and Mind are important to understand.

The mind cannot be focusing(concentrating) on the present moment. “Present moment” is the absense of focus, and mechanical movement of “training”... All that is the product of thought/the thinker. And when thought/the thinker is in movement the burden of time prevents the timelessness of the now.

I just mean until attatchment ends actually, one can not say if effort or no effort was a means to the ending of attatchment. Until the ending, There remains only assumptions. Im sure you see the point in this.

The scrubbing clean is a movement motivated by attatchment. This movement of volition is influenced by fear. Any movement of mind to end mind only perpetuates attatchment (fear) This will be clear when we see the whole of the self and how it moves in all it’s extremely subtle ways.

I’m talking about the root of attachment. All dependence to capture and maintain psychological security.

The question of whether or not it requires effort or not.

@Anna1 what I mean is it can not be answered by anyone but you. That is the beauty of it

Well with all do respect, until that movement of attatchment ends I would say that is still an unanswered question for you. Its only in the ending of that attachment that one could conclude upon that question.

Yeah lol Mind is very tricky. It tries to use mechanical action to get rid of mechanical tendencies. I agree indeed, mind is a rascal lol

Does not effort imply attachment?

Seems like this may be a treating the issue as it arises. Have you considered that attatchment has not been totally ripped out at its root?

If compulsive thoughts remain arising then there is still a deep rooted unconscious movement of fear taking place. If there is any inward movement in accordance to desire, pleasure, which is to escape what is, which implies fear, identification is taking place as the separate eneity. In this all such thoughts will continue to arise compulsively. As long as desire, pleasure, (fear) is, thoughts will continue to be expressed on there own.. Where there is fear there can never be order. It’s only in complete order that the cessation of fear(time), and therefore thoughts will stop moving unwillingly.

This relates to living ones daily life free of the limits of experience.

Thought arises when needed. But when not needed thought remains dormant. Thinking will happen when we need to use the mechanism of thought. But that mechanism no longer moves when there is no use in applying the mechanism. Its about giving thought it’s right place.

Love is not conditional, and never within the movement of time, causality.

Until fear ends, love is not. Love is only in the absence of fear.

Control is fear. And what would be the motive behind giving control up? If the motive is influenced by fear then that implies control.