Faceless

Lol. You are not attending to what’s has been said. I am not a teacher, thankfully . This can not be taught. People can only point one in a direction. You are responsible to make the climb yourself. That’s why liberation from the self is the ultimate freedom and so sacred. This can not be taught. This is not the cultivation of thought. This is the understanding the underlying substance of time/thought/self. Wisdom can not be taught. Truth can not be communicated to another.

You can’t learn about yourself according to another. This would be learning about yourself according to what another says, which is absurd. Known one knows you like you do. This would be a second hand type of learning. From what I see this is common. I have said multiple times to not accept anything, but to go into it yourself. This only comes from knowing yourself and thought. You are your own teacher. Again never accept but go into it yourself. But to simply accept or disagree is irresponsible and foolish. This is why freedom is necessary. Freedom to inquire without a compulsion to accept or deny, but just to inquire without any particular goal or motive of personal gain. To be objective. That’s order/freedom. We can never know what was meant by the ancients for sure. We can speculate, assume, and so on. But this is a setup for deception. Accepting what is not understood is dangerous. Plus with time through the generations knowledge becomes distorted by the interpreters. This is obvious in the Bible for example. If you are not free from what others have said how can you inquire freely without forming a certain point of view. Also by going it alone and staying avoiding an authority of past knowledge prevents certain projections from being established and believed as independent of thought. Again do not ever accept anything without questioning for yourself if what is said is sound. I never accepted anything anyone said neither should anyone else. But to accept or deny without even investigating for oneself honestly is denial and prevents one from ever understanding anything. When one relies on an authority it is because one is afraid to stand alone. The capacity to stand alone implies a mind that is free/orderly.

Any designated path by past knowledge and it’s descriptions of what ‘enlightenment’ is a myth. Only when there is freedom from others and your own bias/prejudices is one free from authority. Where there is authority freedom is not. Especially the authority of thought. Never accept any authority, especially the self/thought. Order only comes with freedom. Now are you actually interested in this? Or are you playing the game of measure?? Lol

A barrier in communication for sure. But important in communication to. Can’t commune without common ground. I am seeing this more and more ever day?

I understand my friend??

That’s just for others who might be fulled by the false myths of ‘enlightenment’..not directed towards you my friend. I see you ??

It seems this topic title should be called, Post liberated realizations.. As liberation is an action that enlightens the movement of the doing and becoming to simply ‘being’ or ‘isness’...freedom from the illusion of psychological time. enlightened state: a sense of clarity and understanding. To me there are only enlightening states of perception. For me to ever imply that I was enlightened would have no meaning whatsoever. This is how I understand this of course. Others may see things differently.

I agree?? And yeah we can’t change Sanskrit lol root meanings are important

If we were aware of the movement of thought this accumulation/attribution would cease.

Yeah except with the identification to past memory, knowledge, experience of course. Lol this is where thought attributes to itself the existence of ‘the self’ as being independent/sepertate of thought. Tricky lol

Who is this sad guru ?? ?

An orgasm of an organism. Lol eww?

If you don’t recognize an experience it is not an experience. You can only recognize what you have already known. Every experience has already been recognized as an experience or you wouldn’t recognize it. This recognition is a remembering of past knowledge and past experience ‘what is known’ Question is can the past ‘memory, knowledge, experience’, ‘the me’ meeting the present end there instead of being continued as a projection or carried on into the future? Freedom from the past is freedom from the self.

Lol ? Like I said freedom is essential. This is very simple, just have to go into it. If we don’t understand something how can we know it’s not true or false.

I understand. I don’t know what this word sponda implies thought? But yes I think I understand you my friend. That’s why I think it’s necessary to understand the very barrier preventing freedom from self. If we see that any attempt by the center ‘mechanical movement of fragmentation being demand, effort, and will/volition/desire’ in a particular direction only leads to contradiction and neccesitates further divisive patterns of fragmentation, therefore prepetual illusion and deception, then maybe this ‘seeing and understanding’ will become its own action to freedom to go beyond. Then this seeing/understanding/perception, becomes its own action of order that can straighten up the already occuring disorder or thought. If we don’t see a problem then we can never be free from it?? I’m sure you see the significance of this. I like what u said here about “This infinite motion-Karma is driven by desire”..... Desire ‘the center’ must be constantly be paid attention to. This is where the self learning never ends. This attention without the center is the beginning of intelligence/meditation. Only then might there be this timelessness with its beauty, joy, and creativity. Until we understand/comprehend thought/reality we are blind. As far as being caught in desire/fragmentation, to see, realize, and grasp with ones whole being that we are blind is truth. Again, the very motion/movement of fragmentation must end in order for intelligent action without the movement of thought as it’s influince, distorting that action. It’s not action according to thought, true action is free of thought, that is an action of wholeness. Thank you for bringing desire and motion/action into the this sharing @cetus56. I’m sure others appreciate your participation in this sharing. Wouldn’t be as helpful without your involvement. ??

Without freedom from my past ‘ the self’ nothing new can be grasped.

That’s the point about a debate. Debate doesn’t solve anything. There has to be a ceasing of ones bias/prejudices. Unless this happens there is no chance. This is why debate in politics is useless. Lol I had gone into this before any prior knowledge, experience was accumulated. So I went into it as if I knew nothing. I was free to investigate. Free from myself.

Lolo?

Oh lol..nahm and I have not met on this yet. We have gone through this before. Its ok this is complex. And I don’t expect people to just believe what I say anyhow. I don’t think I would have accepted this from anohter either. It’s got to be seen for ones self. You know? Isn’t that what freedom from the self implies? Self learning, not according to others.

Total perception meaning not a fragmented, partial, segmented, limited false perception, which is thought. Perception being not of thought.

I understand we have not met on this in past discussions. That’s ok maybe someone else might see somthing in it. Right? ? ??

I know the majority of people will not accept this and will want to debate about it. But it has to be gone into vary carfuly without bias. If one goes into it slowly without there own projections interfering they will see the truth of this. Its up to you guys if you want to find out. I’m just presenting something to be inquired into. Don’t accept it blindly. See for yourself. It’s the only way to see anyway. Light your own way.

Perception is not yours. Total perception is only when ‘you’ are not. Thought/the self mistakes itself for perception or to have a perception that is independent of thought. But this is not the case. All experiences are of thought. Just like all thoughts are the result of the stream of thought, the old... As all experiences are the result of past experience, always old, slightly modified, of the past.

Investigate into it. It’s of great importance I assure you. If you see this for yourself you will avoid decades of illusion and deception. Unless you like illusion and deception of course. ? Just look into it. Might be worth your time, might not.?

This is to invoke interest to others who don’t see that experience implies nothing new. Do u see the significance of investigating this for ones self?