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@AMS I cannot tell if you're choosing to completely ignore the facts discussed in this thread, or if you're a shill intentionally trying to spread misinformation, Your perspective fails the first test of logic: the structure. I won't get into the second test of the details because you need to pass both tests first to have a valid argument. Why does it fail the first test, the structure? Because meat has a poor bowel-transit time due to its zero-fiber content, and stagnates in the digestive tract, putrefying and creating a highly acidic environment in your body. Simple chemistry my friend: Acids destroy, alkalies build. Fruits and vegetables are the most alkaline foods for the human species, and promote health. Dairy, grains, meat, and even nuts to a smaller degree, are acidic, and trigger mucus in the body. If you eat a diet exclusively of meat, you are eating a 100% acidic diet, and every-time you eat, you will trigger mucus in the body. Overtime, the mucus will accumulate in the body, and will plaque if the lymphatic system is overwhelmed, which it will if you follow the advice from the above. Meat is not intended to be in the human body. It's absolutely concerning that the above misinformation appears so convincing on the surface to a layman, yet fails to discuss the elimination process of meat, perhaps the most crucial process of digestion. The human species loves to hear all the reasons why it can continue indulging in its bad habits. Cheers!

@egoless If you want to talk about strength, research Dr. Nun Amen-Ra. World-Record holder in deadlifting. 100% Vegan. Strength is besides the point, however.

@Leo Gura Do humans crave meat? Or are they conditioned to eat it since birth? That is, are you under the hunger spell? Do you feel a morbid sensation in your belly whenever you're "hungry"? I did 136 days of 1+ gallons of raw, cold-pressed, fresh fruit/vegetable juice per day. A SOLID FOOD VACATION (SFV) or Juice FEAST. No solid food. Period. On day 7, the "hunger" feeling most people describe vanished. On day 136, I felt true hunger. True hunger is a watering sensation of the throat. "Whatever deceives men seems to produce a magical enchantment." -Plato I do not get "hungry" in the belly anymore. The hunger signal is obvious now whenever my throat and mouth pleasantly "waters." We're so misguided, we don't even know what hunger IS! I'm not the only one either. THOUSANDS know the truth now. Read the overwhelming positive testimonials in John Rose's YouTube comments sections. I cleaned my bowels out like a fontanal with juice. Why do we need to clean our bowels you may ask? When you eat an incorrect species specific diet, waste matter putrefies, and becomes impacted on the walls of our intestines. We're literally full of shit!!! This is a recipe for disaster and one of the true causes of dis-ease. Most people cannot believe the shit that's coming out of their bodies even on day 90 of ZERO solids. Next time you visit a doctor, ask them if they know what is causing your ailment. If they don't know, why are you accepting their solutions?? If you want to fix the effect, I think we can both agree you need to address the root cause directly. Back in the day, water fasting used to be the ideal preparation for a better way of life, but today, we're so toxic with chemicals and pesticides, juice fasting is the modern day water fast. Why do you think Jesus fasted for 40 days and nights? Why do you think Pythagoras fasted to study with the Egyptians? Even Plato, Aristotle, and Socrates mention achieving "mental efficiency" when fasting for days. They lacked the knowledge of how to live (what the species specific diet is), but they knew intuitively the power of cleaning their bowels. This is EXPLICITLY described in the dead sea scrolls, in the Essene Gospel of Peace (No, I'm not religious). Fats, I agree with, and are included in a Frugivore diet in the form of avocados, coconuts, durian, nuts, and seeds. Sweets come in the form of fruit of course! I'm telling you my friend, you are missing a HUGE puzzle piece if you choose to ignore this information. And unfortunately, most people will never come across this information in their lifetime, to their detriment.

@Leo Gura I agree with you, the human species is remarkably resilient, ingenious, and flexible. I won't deny the power of the mind either. After this intellectual debate, I can only conclude that the skeptic must test an idea whose time has come, that is, prove or disprove the theory for him or herself via direct experience. I invite you to try Raw Veganism Leo, with the deep understanding of what detoxification and regeneration is, if you haven't already of course From personal experience, in the non-ideal world we live in today, a diet consisting of 100% raw, fresh, living, enzyme-rich, organic fruits, vegetables, and some nuts and seeds is profoundly healing for the human being on every level: physically, mentally, emotionally, and spiritually. The anecdotal evidence, as flawed as the concept of anecdotal evidence is, of people healing themselves of diseases of all kind, from cancer, tumors, colitis, to persistent acne, is absolutely STAGGERING. What other diet claims to do that and has the results to back it up? Of course, you won't find these anecdotal reports on TV, for a reason The truth is, if you've never tried it, you don't know what you don't know. I invite you to test an idea whose time has come.

@Leo Gura Eskimos have short life-spans! Just because something is a calorie source, does not mean it's intended to be in the human body! Just because humans have been doing something for 10,000 years (i.e. tradition), does not make it right! I want to emphasize that our ideal diet is that of a Frugivore. Yes, we can survive on meat, and perhaps meat is the sole reason why this species exists today, but we cannot thrive on meat because it is NOT a part of our species specific diet. We're physically not designed to eat meat! Seriously? We're like bears?? You have sharp canine teeth and paws to rip open flesh?? Have you ever considered that human beings are not designed to live in cold climates? If we were, why don't we have fur to keep us warm like a bear?? Why do peoples of northern climates have chronic Vitamin-D deficiency and peoples of the tropics do not?? You're right, if I lived in the Arctic circle, I could not survive there on fruits and vegetables because I'm not designed to live there!! It's obvious when observing the anatomical limitations given to us since birth that we are NOT omnivores: Our digestive tract is 10x the length of our torso, like all other Frugivores, such as the Orangutan and Monkey All Omnivores + Carnivores have digestive tracts 3x the length of their torso, no exceptions [I made a mistake in my prior post, Herbivores have digestive tracts 20x the length of their torso] We REQUIRE fiber in our food to stimulate Peristalsis in our digestive tract. Meat has ZERO fiber! This means that meat stagnates in our systems and putrefies. This is HIGHLY toxic to our cells! All Omnivores and Carnivores do NOT require fiber in their food to stimulate peristalsis, unlike ALL Frugivores. That's where a 90+ day SOLID FOOD VACATION or Juice FEAST comes into play. Test an idea whose time has come! See John Rose on YouTube. Yes, you're right, right now it can be expensive. However, ever heard of supply and demand? How many people are seriously pursuing a Raw Vegan diet, let alone a Fruitarian diet??? Also, organic produce is NOT pesticide-free. "Natural" pesticides can and still are used. That said, if your body is running optimally (your lymphatic system isn't backed-up!), you'll have no difficulty dealing with a bit of toxicity, especially when considering the alternatives of anti-biotic and epinephrine-laden meat and dairy. Also, this goes without saying, but we're not granivores either (we're not birds!). I agree 100% with you my friend. 100%. It doesn't mean we shouldn't try to apply some common sense instead of waving our hands saying "just pick which diet is your favorite! They're all the same!" Cheers!

@Michael569 Interesting. How are you looking to shift careers? Are you taking any online classes or enrolled in a degree program? I'm curious because I'm looking to do the same

@Leo Gura [I forgot to apply the @ User function in my prior original post before editing it. Re-posting here because I am convinced that this a HUGE puzzle piece many people are missing that needs to be acknowledged] Diet is NOT an individualized thing. Human beings have a species specific diet. The optimal diet for Jim isn't ice-cream if ice-cream isn't optimal for human beings. While I acknowledge food preferences exist among individuals, this does not mean we can just pick and choose which diet is best for us. This is pre-determined by our biology, which is especially apparent in our anatomical limitations: All carnivores and herbivores have digestive tracts that are 3x the length of their torso, no exceptions. All frugivores have digestive tracts that are 10x the length of their torso. Human beings, like our close relatives the Orangutans and Monkeys, have digestive tracts that are 10x length of their torso. You are a fruigivore. Human beings are designed to eat FRUIT! Why do you think candy flavors are based on FRUIT? Bubble gum flavor is based on Jack FRUIT. Why do you think we crave sugar "sweets"? Fructose and glucose is the primary fuel for our cells. Hold in one hand fresh strawberries, and in the other, a McDonalds cheeseburger to a young child (who hasn't been completely indoctrinated by culture's way, yet), and which food will the child instinctually reach for? Hold in one hand fresh strawberries, and in the other, steamed asparagus to a young child, and which food will the child instinctually reach for? I think we can both agree the young child will instinctually choose the fresh strawberries, every-time! Some questions to contemplate: Which foods do we have a symbiotic relationship with? Which foods want us to eat it? Which foods don't require any processing (e.g. heat) to eat it? (because stove-ovens naturally exits in nature, right?) Cooking destroys 100% of the bio-photon and enzyme content in our food, 40-50% of the bio-available proteins, vitamins, and mineral content in our food, and caramelizes fat into acrylamides, a known carcinogen. Our ideal species specific diet is predominantly fruit in an ideal world. Of course, today, based on the damage we've done to our bodies and the environment due to our poor diet and lifestyle choices, we may have to modify this diet to include some leafy greens to compensate for the mineral-depleted soil producing today's mineral-depleted fruit. We are sick as a species (look around you! who do you see that is the pinnacle of optimal human health?), because we've strayed far from nature, and are so misguided that we prefer what a so-called expert nutritionist has to say on the subject than what our body instinctually calls for. As many of you can sense, humanity is currently headed for an ice-burg... If WE don't change, things will never change. That includes meeting our biological needs through proper diet and lifestyle choices, and regaining our bio-photon connection with the Universe. This is why spirituality is hypothesized to be a subsequent need, because human beings are supposed to be connected to source, effortlessly. We are so damaged today, and disconnected as a result, however, that no one can blame the other for pursuing some form of connection, whether it be spirituality, or religion. That is a larger discussion, however. P.S. For all those who are claiming they "tried" the raw-vegan lifestyle and it "didn't work," you must understand the sewer system of your body that is the lymphatic system, and how the process of detoxification, due to stagnant waste from prior poor diet and lifestyle choices, may manifest as flu-like symptoms. You cannot expect to just "reverse" the damage you've done to your body overnight or in a week, especially if we're talking about accumulated effects from 10, 20, 30, 40, or even 50+ years of eating an incorrect species specific diet. Please research Dr. Robert Morse and John Rose on YouTube to educate yourselves on this topic. A 90+ day Juice FEAST or Solid Food Vacation (SFV) is HIGHLY recommended for making a smooth transition from SAD to Raw Vegan / Fruitarian. From personal experience, my life was completely lifted to an entirely new plane, on every level: spiritually, physically, mentally, and emotionally. I saw the light--it's amazing what happens when you get reconnected! P.S.S. Leo, please research this topic, as well as John Rose on YouTube. He HAS a MASSIVE large-picture perspective on why we're living in the Hell we're currently living in. I know you in your wisdom can see the powerful link between dietary choices and your state of consciousness. What if you were hindering your growth because of ignorance in not meeting your biological needs? Truly, I hope, that you will experiment and see the profound effects of achieving optimum health, that is, meeting all your fundamental needs, and consequently, sharing the message with your enormous subscriber base so we can turn this planet around. Cheers! "Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain

@egoless This an excellent question and requires a deeper discussion (I'm not going to overwhelm this thread). Needless to say, I did not say solely fruits: No. This is a can of worms that I won't get into here. All I will say is that unfortunately, the medical industry has the tendency to favor economic wealth over human welfare, and there is a HEAVY bias to which study topics are funded. Lack of evidence ≠ proof of falsehood. We are using simple common sense here my friend, and basic understanding of anatomy, nutrition, biology, and logic. Notice I'm not throwing at you lists of scientific research articles and the like. Also, as I said prior: There's good, better, and best. Yes you can survive on meat, and perhaps it is the sole reason of why this species exists today. That said, what got us here today, isn't necessarily the ideal solution for what will get us through to tomorrow. Just because something is a calorie source, doesn't mean it's intended to be inside our bodies as human beings. If you want to thrive, and this is includes in your consciousness work, striving for the best diet possible, that is the modified species specific diet, cannot be ignored. Even the Buddha recognized that asceticism (depriving himself of food) would not help him realize enlightenment, because the body is the foundation of the mind and spirit. A weak foundation cannot support the highest pursuits of the spirit. Thus he allowed himself to "take the middle way," and have food for nourishment, which aided in his ultimate realization of enlightenment. Cheers my friend, great discussion!

You're right, my point that children instinctually choose fruit is limited to my observation. With regards to proof that a species specific diet for human beings consists of predominantly fruits, a fact that cannot be ignored: In addition: There's a reason why the brain kicks into ketosis when a shortage of food supply occurs (this is especially apparent during water fasts). Fat = backup fuel. If complex sugars are ingested, such as in sweet potatoes, the sugars must FIRST be broken down to simple sugars before the cells may utilize the fuel source. This is energy consuming and a highly inefficient process for the body. Why would the body be inefficient at utilizing a fuel source?? Whole fruits, on the other hand, are composed of simple sugars such as fructose, which are readily absorbed by the body. This is a highly efficient process. What about bowel transit time? Since human beings have unusually long digestive tracts, it is imperative that ANY food by-products as a consequence of digestion is exited from the body as soon as possible. Why? What happens if you leave raw meat on the counter on a hot summer day? It putrefies! This is highly toxic to your cells. Suppose this happens in your body, over the course of days after ingestion of meat. Why? Because meat has ZERO grams of fiber. Peristalsis of food, or the involuntary passing of food along the digestive tract, REQUIRES fiber to function. Fruit is HIGH in fiber. From personal experience, I can completely digest a fruit from mouth to bowel movement in less than 24 hours* (I've cleaned my bowels of impacted waste with a Juice FEAST, so results may vary nowadays). Most people are so backed up because of poor dietary choices that they need to shove more food down just to have "regular bowel movements!" I agree, other animals eat other animals (carnivores), however we simply do not have the short digestive tract / faculties to quickly digest and eliminate meat, which is highly susceptible to putrefaction due to its zero fiber content. This is not an ethical debate. Nor is this about "judgement." Human beings simply are not designed to eat meat on a physical level. Period. This is the danger of the human species... We want to hear all the reasons why we can continue indulging in our bad habits.

@egoless I don't believe we are disagreeing on these points? Skin reactions, while may be perceived as an individual issue, is not a random fluke. We live in a causal reality: cause/effect. The cause that creates skin reactions is the same cause cause that creates cancer in almost all cases. Genetics simply dictate how the degenerative effects will manifest, which DOES vary based on individual. This is why dairy for you may cause obvious skin reactions, while in a friend no obvious effects are observed (the in-obvious effect may be osteoporosis of their bones, or mucus build-up in their intestines). This is also why the accumulated effects can take longer to be obvious in some individuals over others, since some have weaker genetics. Make no mistake, however, everyone pays the effects from the actions they take, whether it is obvious or not. As for eggs, I agree, if our body is damaged and can no longer manufacture essential nutrients, non-ideal supplementation may be required. This does not change the fact that human beings are not designed to eat meat, grains, dairy, and a surplus of vegetables, and that "choosing" paleo over Atkins for example is a mistake. We need to meet our primary needs first, then any secondary needs as a result of the ripple effect (damage to our bodies) from making poor diet and lifestyle choices. Have you actually observed a young child and their preferences? My niece LOVES fruit. In grocery stores, children LOVE when their parents buy fruits, but hate when vegetables are bought ("I don't like broccoli!"). When I say diet is non-individual, I say that in the broad sense, which is that we can't just "decide" an ice-cream diet is best for us because we want it to be. This is where I'm not concerned with "belief." I'm just concerned with what IS the best diet for us by simple observation and empiricism.

@Leo Gura Diet is NOT an individualized thing. Human beings have a species specific diet. The optimal diet for Jim isn't ice-cream if ice-cream isn't optimal for human beings. While I acknowledge food preferences exist among individuals, this does not mean we can just pick and choose which diet is best for us. This is pre-determined by our biology, which is especially apparent in our anatomical limitations: All carnivores and herbivores have digestive tracts that are 3x the length of their torso, no exceptions. All frugivores have digestive tracts that are 10x the length of their torso. Human beings, like our close relatives the Orangutans and Monkeys, have digestive tracts that are 10x length of their torso. You are a fruigivore. Human beings are designed to eat FRUIT! Why do you think candy flavors are based on FRUIT? Bubble gum flavor is based on Jack FRUIT. Why do you think we crave sugar "sweets"? Fructose and glucose is the primary fuel for our cells. Hold in one hand fresh strawberries, and in the other, a McDonalds cheeseburger to a young child (who hasn't been completely indoctrinated by culture's way, yet), and which food will the child instinctually reach for? Hold in one hand fresh strawberries, and in the other, steamed asparagus to a young child, and which food will the child instinctually reach for? I think we can both agree the young child will instinctually choose the fresh strawberries, every-time! Some questions to contemplate: Which foods do we have a symbiotic relationship with? Which foods want us to eat it? Which foods don't require any processing (e.g. heat) to eat it? (because stove-ovens naturally exits in nature, right?) Cooking destroys 100% of the bio-photon and enzyme content in our food, 40-50% of the bio-available proteins, vitamins, and mineral content in our food, and caramelizes fat into acrylamides, a known carcinogen. Our ideal species specific diet is predominantly fruit in an ideal world. Of course, today, based on the damage we've done to our bodies and the environment due to our poor diet and lifestyle choices, we may have to modify this diet to include some leafy greens to compensate for the mineral-depleted soil producing today's mineral-depleted fruit. We are sick as a species (look around you! who do you see that is the pinnacle of optimal human health?), because we've strayed far from nature, and are so misguided that we prefer what a so-called expert nutritionist has to say on the subject than what our body instinctually calls for. As many of you can sense, humanity is currently headed for an ice-burg... If WE don't change, things will never change. That includes meeting our biological needs through proper diet and lifestyle choices, and regaining our bio-photon connection with the Universe. This is why spirituality is hypothesized to be a subsequent need, because human beings are supposed to be connected to source, effortlessly. We are so damaged today, and disconnected as a result, however, that no one can blame the other for pursuing some form of connection, whether it be spirituality, or religion. That is a larger discussion, however. P.S. For all those who are claiming they "tried" the raw-vegan lifestyle and it "didn't work," you must understand the sewer system of your body that is the lymphatic system, and how the process of detoxification, due to stagnant waste from prior poor diet and lifestyle choices, may manifest as flu-like symptoms. You cannot expect to just "reverse" the damage you've done to your body overnight or in a week, especially if we're talking about accumulated effects from 10, 20, 30, 40, or even 50+ years of eating an incorrect species specific diet. Please research Dr. Robert Morse and John Rose on YouTube to educate yourselves on this topic. A 90+ day Juice FEAST or Solid Food Vacation (SFV) is HIGHLY recommended for making a smooth transition from SAD to Raw Vegan / Fruitarian. From personal experience, my life was completely lifted to an entirely new plane, on every level: spiritually, physically, mentally, and emotionally. I saw the light--it's amazing what happens when you get reconnected! P.S.S. Leo, please research this topic, as well as John Rose on YouTube. He HAS a MASSIVE large-picture perspective on why we're living in the Hell we're currently living in. I know you in your wisdom can see the powerful link between dietary choices and your state of consciousness. What if you were hindering your growth because of ignorance in not meeting your biological needs? Truly, I hope, that you will experiment and see the profound effects of achieving optimum health, that is, meeting all your fundamental needs, and consequently, sharing the message with your enormous subscriber base so we can turn this planet around. Cheers! "Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain