Brimstone

Exactly, how does one travel from A to B when there is no gap between them? It is impossible. That is why language is limited in interpreting non-dual concepts. It's just how it is. Personally speaking, questioning the idea of enlightenment is helping to erode residue as after realising Absolute-Truth, after some time the idea that I am enlightened arose which was an entirely different beast in itself, which I have been wrestling with. That is ego at its best creating a claim over Story. Enlighten me, and expanding on what egoless expressed, how can no-me become enlightened, when there is no-me, and where does that leave the 'idea' of 'enlightenment'? Can you see how asking the question then erodes the attachment to the idea that I am Enlightened, which is an idea that dictates the exact opposite. In reality my brain just has a bad case of flatulence so you should just take everything I say with a grain of salt. Much love

Language will always be limited pointing towards That @Serotoninluv so I wouldn't concern myself too much. The premise of what egoless is saying though is actually correct to a point, being that Absolute Truth is inaccessible. Truth is that Absolute is void, in other words there is nothing to know, which is what makes it inaccessible to knowing.

There is a lot of legitimacy to this question @egoless , as no one is known to have ever gone beyond the beyond that is beyond, beyond, as what is clear is that our conditioning is limited. Or in other words we just don't have the tools at our disposal. Just as interesting though is that is the idea itself the last breath of ego, the ace up the sleeve, to keep a hold of the castle? After all ego needs something to chase, a sense of purpose to attach itself to and gain legitimacy doesn't it? Further to that Enlightenment implies that there is no enlightenment without a doubt as the idea of an absolute dream caves in on itself once it acknowledges the absolute, as enlightenment can not be excluded. What is clear is that having mind conditioned by an experience of 'an absolute' or to become 'enlightened' in its purest form brings about a ' state' abundant in peace love clarity and compassion to those who have been afforded the gift of resting deep within. It is obvious. Although in saying that what is also interesting is that people who do not chase enlightenment and follow different doctrines of being also have the ability to tap into something that also produces the same fruits, which implies that the ultimate can be experienced wearing a number of masks, and again if you recognise The Ultimate as the base, wether seen as illusion or real, it is non exclusive from within the enlightened state. Who knows, perhaps The Absolute actually has a personality disorder and in actuality is really course and callous and enlightenment is only a smoke screen to mask that fact. I mean seriously look at the world we live in and the atrocities we see every day, if the Absolute is all, and is what is, then that is some pretty twisted shizzle right there, and to become enlightened we actually become ignorant to the reality of harshness, after all ignorance is bliss. Personally, I prefer the beauty and pureness of the enlightened notion of The Absolute, although any question that unconditions is a good thing. Namaste

Enjoy @gleb Very good posting @WelcometoReality , thank you

Got to love the isness business hey @Serotoninluv lol Keep digging and contemplating on those questions@Dodo some useful ideas there @Natasha nails it with the sense of self illusion, however what is it that creates the sense of self when it comes to the body? Would anyone argue with the fact that the senses play a significant roll? Whether true or not is arguable but physics argues you can never touch anything; https://futurism.com/why-you-can-never-actually-touch-anything/ I do not have a deep understanding of the theory, nor is my conditioning sciences based, but it is an interesting thought that definitely feeds the idea of Oneness doesn't it? @Naturalist although I agree with you as a pointer, isn't thinking it is all a delusion a delusion in itself? Uncovering the subtext of the game is kind of like removing thorns with thorns, lol

Thanks @Nahm , absolutely unconditional love beyond words indeed! If there is no me, how could they be my words though, lol, sorry to be cheeky. To be perfectly honest this idea helps me to maintain a degree of detachment so I don't get to caught up in myself as I try to scrape away unwanted residue, that has crept back in. In all sincerity the short time I have been a part of this community I have been humbled by all of you here, including you, which is a good thing.

It's true @Aimblack that which is absolute doesn't deny anything, including ego, although 'doesn't deny anything' is done without attachment. The crux is that to fully realise that you need to let it all go, although sure another path in is to accept it all which works as well. The is no correct path, only pointers and you have to enquire as to what resonates within you until there is nothing left, cause yeh the reality is that when you see who you really are, absolutely everything falls away, which is what makes everything so beautiful, that is how both paths work, that is the path less path.

Watching thoughts without attachment is a great exercise for sure @Key Elements , so is practising just being. When you feel comfortable if compelled though try looking at the space between the thoughts (Leo mentions that meditation also) , which is powerful stuff as full recognition of the sky is enlightenment, the rest is just noise. The sky is purity beyond conception and the base of what we experience. To be honest though, I can't tell you what to do, no one can, as the narrative as you experience is yours alone at a micro level, so again it comes back to ownership and responsibility, it comes back to self and what you really want, what is important to you. In other words, find what works and go with it.

Resistance is to suffering what surrender is to freedom. There is so much beauty within existence, all one has to do is open their eyes. After all, something out of nothing is absolutely magical right?

Start by drawing the line within you @Key Elements , or whoever it is having the thought to be less specific towards any individual, as you are the story teller, and the character creator in your story on surface level. That is not meant to be offensive, although it is confronting, to recognise that to see ego is ego itself, or more broadly that you are the conduit for projecting illusion/duality into being. One of the biggest traps of a dualist mind, is to define oneself by what one is not, which is One of the infinite pointers that reveals a connection funnily enough. For example, when I see someone as egoic, it feeds the idea that as I see ego in you, I must be humble as I do not like that behaviour, thus perpetuating illusion of mind. This is a trap, as it feeds the narrative that we are seperate within creation, as it conceptualises an other, where there is no other at all. This brings you back to the point that everything that you see and perceive is you, it isn't the person you see, it is all you, end of story. You are the narrative that chatters in your mind, no one else. From that point it all becomes about ownership and responsibility, and if you are serious about going beyond the game, then you need to start being honest within yourself.

That is no good at all Nadosa. Depression is a painful ride. Have you tried any relaxation techniques to try and slow down a little? Is there anyone you can be with in your life that is in someway sympathetic? Did you look at the list that Elisabeth posed for therapists?

haha, now I am laughing my ass off, thanks again

You have friends here Nadosa. Is there anything that you do at the moment that makes you feel good?

Point taken @Key Elements I understand what you are saying completely and wasn't trying to be smart, or denote a higher level of anything, I was just posing a question in general pointing towards whether or not there is a point of equalisation that is all encompassing to every aspect, that goes beyond the differing sets of conditioning. Sorry if you took it otherwise

Yes, but what else is it? Peekaboo, hehe Is it possible that if I am being an ass that That is going to let me know that I am being an ass, whether that arises within myself, or it comes from an external source?

Right on HIP-star, lol Who do we fail when we fail to see through the cloud of bullshit to the Truth that rests in us all? And just as significantly what does it serve? Am also filled with gratitude for being able to recognise that within myself on this sight, so thanks for the light. In saying that and being completely superficial I have got to say that I am not a fan of the like button on this site as it promotes validation, which serves only one master.

@Edita continue to ask, am I going in the right direction? And what is That?

You got it @Nadosa Practically speaking what you are going through appears to be a common theme among people your age, I know I went through it at that age, and speaking to many on the spiritual path, many went through it to. I would even go as far to say that those who appear to not be going through it are going through it as well. This is telling and what currently has me so fascinated is that what people in this age bracket go through is actually very akin to the "dark night of the soul" as you framed it. But where is the guidance to help people get through it? It doesn't exist largely which is so saddening as so many people end there life as a result. Consider this if you want, although do not take it as gospel, as doing so actually defies the point. The reason people get so confused when they experience this is due to the fact that it is actually Truth banging on their door, calling loudly to wake up to True Self, yet through a life conditioned by external pleasures confusion reigns as you have 2 realities in direct conflict with each other, which no matter the age, will always confuse the mind as the conditioning is confronted by that which is unconditional, that which is Absolute. The crux of the Absolute is exactly that, there is nothing, it is void, which sounds daunting but in fact is the source of such a simple indefinable beauty that is at complete peace despite the at times ferocious nature of the storm. In other words it is unexplainable, and to try and do so will always fall short. The trick is that to truthfully and deeply realise this you have to leave absolutely everything at the bank to get across the other side, as any idea will actually weigh you down and see you fall short, including this idea. In a sense it is about surrendering completely to helpless, although that too falls short. Nothing that will harm you although you as you thought you existed ceases to exist as an idea. That is the beauty, you have die, to truly know life as it is. Is that such a bad thing? At the end of the day you are the only one that can realise this, with teachers and teachings only going so far. Anyways, like I said don't take mine or anybodies word for it as to what you need, find it within yourself as your path, is already paved perfectly for you to find what you seek. As I said above there are many here who will listen and be there for you, so if you need someone to talk to just come here and express whatever it is you feel like you need to express. Big ups

As you can see there are quite a few people here for you if you ever feel like lessening the load and getting stuff off your chest. If you are looking for some other material apart what you have looked at look up Mooji, he is on point. The book below by Adyashanti might be useful as well; https://d1c742hwzmv7ke.cloudfront.net/library/The_Way_of_Liberation_Ebook.pdf What they expound is that you just need to look within to find that peace, and by the sounds of what you are saying some of the realisations that you are having have you heading in the right direction. Regarding the future, how can you be so certain that you will end up depressed? Most people expect that they end up happy but end up depressed, so is it possible that you are one of the lucky ones who imagines the self becoming depressed but they actually end up happy? The solution is inside you, and you are a lot closer to it than you think.

You are not alone @Tightrope Walker , it is a common plight. We live our lives conditioned towards being worthy, when in essence what we think life should be is actually worth-less. Your condition as such is simply a reflection of what is true and beyond value pushing up against your conditioning, which is false. If you are sincere and honest with yourself and others, you will look back at this time with fondness as you will see that it actually helped shape you. Just like the grand canyon, all change begins with a trickle until the true beauty of what you are is revealed, meaning no matter what you or anyone ever says about you, you will never be worth-less than anything else. On a practical level, exercise and meditation are useful tools in over coming the dread as they bring you out of your and into the moment.

We are all drops of water, and by our nature we gather in puddles to validate our existence which makes us feel as though we belong, yet we are all connected to Ocean, which is known in every drop and puddle, which in turn makes it so easy for a drop or a puddle to validate the-self that it is right and in complete alignment, which is not suprising given this is the natural state of the ocean. Being a drop or a puddle our instinct is to add our drop to Ocean or a puddle, so that we may get some form of validation as to the correctness of our being, yet it is so much harder to allow Ocean to completely wash over you so that every single drop, every single puddle is a validation to Being. Ask yourself honestly and sincerely, what am I?

Another question to bend the mind, is Enlightenment just another trap of the mind? Think about it, what philosophy, spiritual doctrine, religous group does not promote truth and in most cases it has a profound impact on the peoples lives. So what makes Enlightenment the be-all and end all, and how can you be certain that it isn't just another trick of the mind?

Compassion is a byproduct of enlightenment, as from the base of True being one recognises suffering for what it is. True awakening is to become a reflection of that which is unconditional in every single aspect, without question, without judgement, and if you fall short, then you have only been afforded a glimpse. The glimpse is dangerous as it causes one to stop, and think I have found Truth, which the ego loves, while clinging to the truths that sustain it for longer, thus birthing the super ego, that all actions are ok, as all is a reflection of that, which is true, without being Truth-full. I imagine that this post will ruffle a few egos, lol.

Ending your life isn't the solution Nadosa, you know that which is why you didn't do it. The problem is societies, not yours. There is no right of passage that explains and validates how you are feeling right now, that says it is ok to feel empty, it is ok to feel like there is no point, because in Truth there isn't, which is so soft and sincerely beautiful, it is beyond comprehension. Yet we are conditioned to think that there is a point, that we should fill our lives with this and that, and this is how we attain happiness. This is a false doctrine that leads to much pain and suffering, and why you can't accept what you are feeling. So in a sense you are actually getting a glimpse of Truth, which you have been conditioned to reject. To be perfectly honest, I don't have the answer for you, in fact no one does, as the only person that can dig their way out of this is you, with the benefits of doing so immense. Life is so precious Nadosa, and each breath a gift of immense beauty, try and hold onto that, and know that your suffering will pass if you hang in there. Namaste

Only through pressure is a diamond created @Nadosa so hang in there and don't give up. You would be surprised how common depression and anxiety is amongst people around your age, so you are not alone. What sort of thoughts do you have when you are feeling anxious or depressed if you don't mind me asking? As for tips to improve your general wellbeing excercise, healthy living, meditation and self enquiry are definitely useful. And remind yourself, when things appear most dark, the sun will soon rise.