Forestluv

@Shadowraix Last week a freshman student asked me if I was a *real* scientist. He immediately apologized. . . I smiled as I realized that I have been Deepak'd by @Leo Gura

I love contemplating words. When you say "everything that exists as it is " - consider what "as it is" means. Imagine looking at a red apple. What is the red apple "as it is"? As a starter, ask yourself if the red color actually exists. There are no external colors. There are just wavelengths of light. Your brain adds in the color. So, is the apple actually red? A Mantis Shrimp would see dozens of colors on that apple - colors that you don't even know exist. . . What does it mean for a red apple to exist as it is?

@SoonHei I would consider losing one's self into an experience as a form of nonduality. For example, a person experiences a moment of such profound love that there is no time or self. Only the experience of love. This is one of multiple manifistations of nondual experiences I've had.

My phd was in molecular biology. I am currently a bio professor. Universities can be delusional and corrupt. I work at a small liberal arts college that supports multi-disciplinary / integrative teaching. I'm currently teaching a course on consciousness. At most liberal arts colleges, you can elevate to green or yellow without problem. Yet, I don't think I could go Turquoise without push-back. Yet, that is prolly true in most careers in an Orange centered country.

@MM1988 Social conditioning during childhood and adolescence runs deep into a personality structure. Now that you are aware of it, you can start deconstructing it. Rather than identifying with it "I'm this way because I was raised this way" - try taking a step out of "the story" and loosening your attachment and identification with it. Ask contemplation questions "Who am I?". Challenge your beliefs "Where did this belief arise from? Is it true?". Get some distance from beliefs through mediation. It's not easy and can take a long time to deconstruct deep social programming. I spent years working through some conditioned beliefs from my upbringing. There has been stuff that I intellectually understood and let go of - yet I would still get triggered emotionally - 20 years later!! Awareness and letting go is key. In addition to looking at things intellectually, you may want to also consider emotional work. There are mental memories and body memories. For example, let the emotions get out. The deep emotions upset that you were conditioned this way. Let them loose - punch a pillow and scream. Hit a wiffle ball bat against a tree. Try shamanic breathing. It's not necessary against your parents. It's just letting go of repressed emotion from the conditioning.

I don't know much about Kanye's larger persona, yet this video is centered in green (with a little bit of orange and yellow). Introspection for personal growth is green. He emphasized *we* and *collective* which is Green. The idea that God exists within us is Green. Notice how an audience member said "But, that would be the ego". That perspective is Blue looking up at Orange. Further, Kanye brings up the relativity of words such as "help". Cultural relativism is green, yet he seems to be glimpsing at higher-level Yellow relativism. Yet, I don't think he is proficient in this area yet. Also notice how Kanye mentions *collective* God and a woman mentions *duality*. They are getting close to glimpsing Turquoise, yet still using Green framework. Speakers like Adyashanti or Rupert Spira at Turquoise have much deeper understandings. It would be cool if Kanye had some Yellow and Turquoise teachers. I hope he continues to evolve. He can reach communities speakers like Adyashanti cannot.

There are an infinite number of perspectives. I would be cautious about assuming you now have the "right" perspective. I have a habit of doing this myself. It leads to a contracted view and inhibits a holistic view.

@Hellspeed Yes, I just wrote it now. I didn't read the other post you refer to. It all just popped into my mind from some mysterious source

@Ampresus I've heard spiritual teachers say that young children are enlightened, in a sense and unenlightened in a sense. Often, young children are living in the moment, just being themselves. They don't have a "story" or a timeline of past and future. They live in the moment, fully aware of the present moment. Yet, on the other hand - young children are not aware that they are enlightened. So, perhaps your brother is enlightened in a sense. He hasn't been programmed with what everything "means". He doesn't have a complex story about who he is and how everything in life *should* be. He doesn't have to spend years trying to deconstruct all the stories and beliefs we have been programmed with. It sounds like he simply experiences and expresses joy in the present moment. On the other hand, he might not be aware that he is enlightened. I'm curious what you mean by this sentence "Can Truth with the capital T solve maybe some problems for him? ". . . I would recommend contemplating what you consider "problems". Are these things that *you* think are problems for him? Sometimes caring people try to help others with good intentions, but the actual impact is not always helpful. (sometimes it is helpful, it just depends on the situation). Sometimes genuinely caring people assume they know what is best for someone and it is not always true from the other person's perspective. Teaching your brother to use some language may be beneficial to him - it may greatly increase his quality of life. Yet, I would be careful assuming that. From your brother's perceptive and experience there may be other things he values more. I would still consider what is problematic for him from your perspective. Yet, I would encourage you to also let go of your perspective and try to enter *his* world. Try to see things from his perceptive, try to experience his world with him. From your brother's perspective, what is important to him? What does he value? What does he want? What does he consider his problems? What is he trying to communicate he wants help for? You may find you and your brother become great teachers to each other, each with your own perspective. For example, humans rely heavily on language and we have low nonlanguage social and emotional intelligence (compared to language intelligence). Language is limited. Your brother's nonlanguage communication mode is normal relative to him. It's people around him that may think and tell him it's abnormal. By entering his nonlanguage world, you may develop your empathetic and intuitive modes of communication. As well, the two of you may be able to create new forms of nonlanguage communication that lead to deeper levels of human connection and love.

@Seiden Imagine that I came to visit Japan from the USA. I don’t know much about Japan, so I got a tour book. The tour book has Information about Japanese culture, temples to visit, and basic Japanese language. When I arrive to Japan, some of the locals are curious about my behavior and travel plans. I show them the tour book. They seem to think there is a lot of good info in the book, yet it’s just one limited perspective. For example, some of the basic Japanese words the book shows are not actually spoken on the streets and markets. Some of the customs the book describes only tell part of the Japanese history. Plus, the book was written by an American who doesn’t speak Japanese. I would realize that the tour book has some good info, but it is limited - Japan is much broader and deeper than the book describes. Realizing this, I would want to meet Japanese locals to take me around and show me what Japan is like from their perspective.

I’m continually amazed by how obsessed the human mind is with meaning and purpose. Some minds will cling to the notions of meaning / purpose into the gates of insanity and depression. Every other organism on earth is living in harmony without meaning or purpose. Humans realize there is no meaning / purpose and go into an absurd mellow drama. It’s like a bad soap opera.

Congrats on making it so far. My postdoc in Biology was awesome. What are you planning on next?

@gilded_honour You write that as if you have a choice in the matter.

@bejapuskas Personally, I can tell I'm not centered in Yellow yet, because I'm still concerned whether I am centered in Yellow. I have periods where Yellow is flowing - expressing itself, but it isn't maintained. I drop back down to Tier 1.

By the way you are using "I" to describe the experience, it doesn't sound like you went through ego death. 30mg could very well take you there (if that's where you want to go). You now know that the 4-Aco powder is legit and your sensitivity to it. A legit 275ug of LSD, is significantly stronger than 20-30mg of 4-Aco. You could cut the blotter in half - or dissolve it in ethanol. If you want to do strong/heavy doses, I would recommend getting a benzo or etizolam in case you need to knock down the intensity of the trip. As a novice, knowing you can kill a trip if you need to can reduce anxiety and increase confidence.

In terms of SD, McGregor is full-on extreme Orange. Money, personal glory, attention, partier, fancy clothes etc. His personality is great for promoting UFC fights and selling PPV. When he is matched up against another Orange (like Floyd Mayweather), they promote the fight by insulting each other (knowing it is part of the promotional game). McGregor and Mayweather both knew the insults and personal attacks were just part of the hype. After the fight, they are hugging and laughing with each other (after pulling off 100+ million dollar personal paydays and making all their coaches / managers wealthy). When McGregor has faced Blue-level competition in the UFC, he was the dominant personality and fighter and the other fighter backed down. Khabib is the first Blue-level opponent he has faced that is superior in the Octagon. Khabib is centered at Red / Blue. His homeland near Chechyna is filled with red-level warlords. As well, it is deeply blue regarding family structure, religion, nationalism, respect and honor. Khabib's reality is very different than McGregor's. When McGregor insults his father as a coward that supports warlords, calls khabib's family member a terrorist rat, insults his religion and nation - it is deeply personal. It's very difficult for a person conditioned as Orange to understand this perspective. It's hard to give an example of how personally repulsive McGregor's comments are to a Red-Blue level person. Remember, Red-level people respond to these types of insults by killing their adversary and their family members. For an Orange level person to understand the rage of red/blue, one must make the situation much more extreme (Red level) to push an Orange to Red level rage. Imagine that McGregor raped your sister and beat up your Mom - then he started mocking you as a coward because you didn't protect your sister and mother from him. This is red-level behavior that could bring an Orange person down to red-level rage. Blood-thirsty desire for revenge. McGregor's behavior was more mild, yet Khabib is blue-centered and knows Red well - it takes far less to bring him down to red. Khabib's behavior was actually high red behavior. Just generic violence. If they used weapons, it would have been a full-on red response. Given Khabib's red-blue background, his behavior (and family) is actually quite mild. They were restrained from red-level violence by there Blue makeup that values self restraint and respect.

Oh good, I can let go of it now ?

Cultural relativism is so interesting- especially when it’s relative to me ?

Are you aware that you are criticizing a model of consciousness with a model of consciousness? Don’t get too attached your model. ?

The self will do anything to stay in the game. The self says "Ok. Ok. This attachment thing is getting pretty bad. I better get busy trying to figure out how to let go. I'll do some research online and discuss it on the forum. It's a good thing I stepped up to take action before it got out of hand" The self is so sneaky.

IME, on lower doses there, the context still has some dream component. It's like being rocketed up to high Yellow and Turquoise. I've tried to push the dose higher beyond that. My first two attempts I blacked out when I left all dream state. The third attempt I went to absolute nothing. A null void.

Thank you. Relativism is liberating and opens so many doors. By acknowledging the deep connection and meaning in my non-committed relationship, the following statements now become true: Commitment in a relationship is not required for deep connection within the relationship. Commitment in a relationship is not required for deep meaning within the relationship. The next higher level is to integrate this with advanced Green egalitarianism. That would be: The deep connection and meaning in Serotoninluv's non-committed relationship is as true as the deep connection and meaning in Key Element's committed relationship.

My point is: for high level relativism, the details are irrelevant. You told me you experienced deep connection in a committed relationship. That is all the information I need. I don't need any details to judge if you actually did experience deep connection. I believe that is your experience. I told you I experienced deep connection in a non-committed relationship. You responded "I guess so" and "I don't have full details". My question is: What details do you need to judge that I actually did experience deep connection? What details would move you from "I guess so" to "I believe you"?

When you tell me that you have had a deep connection and meaning in a relationship with significant commitment, I believe you. It's hard for me to imagine how someone could have deep connection and meaning in a highly committed relationship. Yet, I don't deny your experience. I don't say "No, Key Elements you are mistaken: you have not had deep meaning and connection in a committed relationship". Nor do I challenge you and say "Well, I guess you might have experienced deep meaning and connection in a committed relationship, but I don't know what happened in the relationship, so I can't know for sure". If you tell me you had deep connection / meaning in a committed relationship, I trust that you did. What more information would I need to verify that you actually did experience deep connection and meaning? Would I try to quantify your depth of connection/meaning? Perhaps do some scientific studies on you to gather evidence that you are telling me the truth? If I question your experience I am questioning who you are, I am questioning whether your experience qualifies to what I believe is deep connection and meaning. And I would be putting the burden on you to prove to me that you actually experienced deep meaning and connection. I would want more information so I can judge whether you experienced "actual" deep connection and meaning. I told you that I had deep connection and meaning in a relationship with little commitment. Why would respond with "I guess so."? Why don't you trust that I am telling you the truth? What additional information from my relationship do you need to move from "I guess so" to "I believe you"? What additional information do you need to verify that my experience was actually deep connection and meaningful? This is subjectivism/relativism at a lower Green level. I have found it is the key to reach deeper levels of empathy. To take it one step higher on the Green scale toward Yellow. . . As hard as it is form me to imagine how you could have experience deep connection and meaning in a committed relationship, I trust that that was your experience. I am comfortable saying: Key Elements experience of deep connection and meaning within his/her committed relationship is as true as my experience of deep connection and meaning within my non-committed relationship. This level of consciousness was a huge jump for me and my breakthrough experience was only about six months ago. This has opened up indescribable depths of human connection and empathy. And not just with people that have a similar orientation to me. Everyone. IME this level of relativism is necessary to reach the broadest and deepest levels of empathy. This opens up a much deeper level of communication and bonding. Rather than debating about how to justify and verify that a personal experience qualifies as "actual", the discussion can move deeper into exploring both "actual" experiences. For me, I become curious and fascinated. Judgement and separation dissolves and there is a sense of oneness. A beautiful empathetic and loving interpersonal connection. A high stage Green experience. And for icing on the cake, I experience and learn about things I could never had imagined.

Ok. I took out the effort part. Can we now agree they are both true? 1. Serotoninluv has had deep connection and meaning in a relationship with little commitment. 2. Key elements has had deep connection and meaning in a relationship with substantial commitment. If not, which statement do you disagree with?