Forestluv

@Bluebird For me, the psychedelic experience is as real as the sober experience. It seems odd to me how people often have an "intention" heading into a trip. Their sober self wants to extract something from the "altered" psychedelic reality. Yet, this assumes the sober mindset is the "normal" one worth developing. The reciprocal question is "what aspects of my delusional sober mindset can be integrated into the normal psychedelic mindset"? This lessened my seeking energy to "make sense" of psychedelic experiences. It's like asking how I can integrate lessons from the movie "Crash" into the movie "Forrest Gump". It's fun stuff, yet not really the point of it all. The point is. . . the sober mindset is delusional. It's a dream. There is no need to try and make the dream seem more real. It will always be a dream regardless of how much one tries to fortify a foundation of realness.

@Mircan I would be aware of self improvement methods and self dissolution methods. It sounds like you are more attracted to self improvement. The forum is a mixture of both.

I would be mindful that SD is just one model - it can be a useful tool. Yet, I would not put all my eggs into the SD basket. I would complement SD with a few spiritual teachers outside of SD that resonates with you. In tier1, people can be a mixture of tier1 stages. Like a painting that has blue, orange and green colors. I like to think of it as being "centered" in one stage. As well, someone could be centered in stage green intellectually and stage orange emotionally. Rather than trying to evolve to reach a "higher" stage. I would be mindful of which stage characteristics I resonate with. As well, which patterns exist that no longer resonates? Which are conditioned patterns? For example, one of my patterns was logical / rational thinking. I took this to the end of the line and it no longer became satisfying or fulfilling. I noticed that I was a walking analytical brain and it was interfering with my ability to form human connections. My relationships lacked emotional depth and intimacy. I started craving that. Yet, it was still difficult to let go of logical patterns. That part of me wanted evidence to show that all this "whoo whoo" stuff green and above is true. . . One of the difficulties from evolving from tier1 to tier2 is that there are few tier2 teachers. One of the biggest traps of tier1 is attachment to personal needs. There is strong identification with a sense of self in tier1. In tier2 there is an awareness that the whole personality is just a conditioned construct - built over a lifetime of programming. This realization process can be uncomfortable and unpalatable to the self. Think about it. . . the Gig Is Up for the self. It will no longer be the main act. It just appears and disappears like dreams, bird chirps and thunder. That's a tough sell to a self. Yet, the liberation from the illusory self is indescribable. In tier1 - the self is the main act - even in stage Green. The energy of seeking is to meet personal needs. The view of life is through this lens. Everything and everyone is perceived through a lens of personal needs. That is "how will this situation or person affect me and my personal needs?". In tier2 there is an energetic shift from self seeking to meet needs, security and comfort to an energy that seeks being the human experience, truth. That is attracted to the magnificence of life. Much of this is nonverbal and post-rational. Through direct experience, there is a "knowing".

For sure. I would just add ". . . seeking security in the illusory static content of thought" for clarity. This goes for all thought. Including ideas that seem spiritual, profound or insightful. Including everything written in this thread. Including everything that has ever been written or expressed about enlightenment. Believing any of it is a limitation trap. Even very high spiritual masters get caught in this trap to an extent. There are spiritual masters that believe in spiritual ideas and concepts.

I'd say 15mg to get a feel for the sub ego-death zone.

@Kaity This realization is very insightful and profound. For me, the next step would be to become aware of how attached I am to this "Story". Yes, there was a lot of conditioning that constructed a personality afraid of exploring and expressing femininity. Yet, the self can attach/identify with this Story and create a strong belief that "I am blah blah blah". In this case' "I am resistant to explore, embody and express femininity". It's time to let go of that. Exploring femininity is a wonderful process. It's time to let go of all those limiting beliefs. When one arises, be aware of it. Perhaps ask "Where did that thought/belief arise from? Is it true? Is it serving me?". Then, let it go. I would explore various forms of femininity through music, art, writing, dress, expression. I would hang out with women and men that are open to expression of both feminine and masculine energy and don't play traditional gender roles.

Based on the bits you shared, it seems like predominantly tier1 energy to tier2. I sense a lot of Orange energy. I'd recommend watching Leo's video on Yellow. He describes the tier1 to tier2 transition as well as distinctions between Orange and Yellow. Evolving from tier1 to tier2 is enormous. It is a bigger jump than all the tier1 stages combined. One key feature is deconstruction and dissociation from the self. Another key feature is evolving from a rational to post-rational state of being. My sense is there is still a strong 1st-person identification going on here. I think music can be a tool toward transitioning to tier2 (as well as yoga, mediation, psychedelics etc.). You have likely experienced "micro flow" with your music - where you lose sense of your self and time. An experience of just being. Where you dissolve and become one with your instrument, the sounds, improvisation and other band members. It's not something one "figures out" - it is nonverbal, post-rational experience. I would be mindful of those states and let go / enter such flow with music, meditation, nature etc. As well, tier2 has a clearly defined "observer" position in which it can observe thoughts / feelings without attachment or identification. Those at entry level tier1 can play the observer, yet aren't aware they are doing it. In more advanced levels, there is awareness that the observer is observing. I would get space from thoughts/feelings during meditation by continually labeling thoughts / feelings and thought / feelings and returning to the observer (or simply back to what is actually happening). With time, the attachment / identification to thoughts / feelings will be weakened and there will be mature awareness that this "character" is just impulses appearing and disappearing in emptiness. For me, the hardest part of the Green-to-Yellow transition was letting go of the desire for inclusion and equality for oppressed and ostracized groups. It felt so heartless to me.

Be aware of associating "progress" with "ecstasy". This was a major trap for me. Awakening has no preference toward bliss or terror. Awakening doesn't care if the personality feels good or awful. Also, the personality is not a static construct. It is dynamic - constantly evolving. There are methods that may resonate with a personality. Yet, the idea of a "correct" or "better" method is very subjective. If Byron Katie resonates with you and your intuition draws you in that direction - go for it. Yet, your personality may outgrow Katie. Things that seem spiritual or true today - might not seem spiritual or true next month. Neti Neti, Kriya Yoga may re-enter. Or a new method may enter. I observe a lot of suffering caused by the personality trying to maintain the illusion of a static personality over time.

@Merch IME, it is much more difficult to have direct experience with this realization via vision. Our visual system is by far the dominant sense and is conditioned to perceive as separation. I think it's much easier to start off with sound. Closed-eye meditation. Be aware of thoughts and sounds. Notice how they are both in your mind. They both appear in your mind. Thoughts about an upcoming birthday party appear in the same space as chirping birds. Observe closely: they both appear in the same mindspace. Your mind is conditioned to associate thoughts as "within me" and sounds as "outside of me". Let go of that and notice their similarity in your mind. . . The same can be done visually, yet I've found it *much* more challenging.

If the personality is still fully constructed, it can be a rough ride. Imagine going from 100% identified with the personality construct to 0% in 5 minutes. That's like decades of deconstruction work in 5min. It can freak out the personality. Especially for solid Orange rationalists. Yet, it can give breaktrhoughs for a personality that is partially deconstructed and evolving from orange to green or tier1 to tier2.

However you describe "Emotional Mastery", it is *within* everything. It is within "enlightenment". Could "Emotional Mastery" lead to this awakening? Sure, it could be one of many inputs that contributes to the awakening. It could also be a distraction to the awakening. In general, I've found that relaxing the personality allows for a mind in which the awakening process can flourish. I've found activities such as meditation, yoga and listening to nonduality teachers help to relax my personality. In contrast, attachments/identification to ideas, worries, analyzing, conceptualizing etc. stimulate my personality and is a distraction to the awakening process. The sneaky part here is that "spiritual concepts" can seem so "good", so "healthy" and it's easy to believe in them - which is a distraction. To me, "Emotional Mastery" has a control feature to it that I would consider a trap. Who is doing the "Mastering"? Well, probably a fragment of the self. I suppose it could lead to progress for self improvement or early stages of awakening. Yet, at intermediate and advanced stages, I would consider it more of a hindrance. One reaches a stage in which it becomes about self dissolution, not self mastery.

Enlightened beings will appear as strange to unenlightened beings. The strange could be experienced as fear or adoration. My awakening process has included direct experience with insanity and dementophobia.

This song has a wonderful interplay between masculine and feminine energy.

@SoonHei Image being in a restaurant with lots of background chatter. Can you take a step out and have a meta perspective? That is, a meta awareness that the background chatter is *within* something more holistic. Of course, because the mind is not conditioned to attach to, and identify with, background chatter in restaurants. You wouldn’t need all the patrons to stop talking to see the holistic picture. Trying to shut them up would actually interfere with seeing the holistic picture because the background chatter is part of the holistic picture. Thoughts in the mind are similar to background chatter in a restaurant. But here, the human mind is conditioned to attach to, and identify with, the chatter. Allow your thoughts to be background chatter. In a restaurant, we wouldn’t go from table to table trying to engage in their conversations. Why do we do so in our own mind?

Meaningless will have either view, depending on how the ego spins it. Meaninglessness is both and neither. To transcend, take a step outside both views and observe both views without logical analysis. Observe personal energy that gravitates and grasps for one view via thought and feeling. Let go and allow the paradoxical views to both exist simultaneously. It’s similar to quantum phenomena of superposition. Before measurement, both positions exist and neither pososition exists. After measurement, one position exists. What exists before your mind measures meaninglessness?

You are conflating post-rational magic with pre-rational magic. They both look irrational to you. If you want to know the difference between the two, you will need to transcend the rational mind - which the ego will strongly resist.

To me, it seems like he is moving in a new direction in his self interest. I don’t sense much “we” in your post. You’ve clearly expressed your discomfort and there doesn’t seem like there is mutual support and growth. There seems to be some co-dependency. I was in a similiar situation last year. I would consider taking care of yourself and cultivating self love.

Nice report. Similiar for me. A good insight tool in moderation. Very easy to be habit forming.

For me, the purity and intensity dies down, yet some of it remains and is integrated into baseline awareness

@Robert Stop being so rational ?

Cultural immersion is a highly effective tool to increase one's consciousness from blue/orange up to green. I love the effort of this project.

@Greatnestwithin

I love the top-right image Madness is hard to describe. Yet, I know it when I am experiencing it. . . And, I think there are fine lines between madness, genius and the process of awakening.

Well said. I would also say that dynamic appearances and flows integrating aspects of monogamy and polyamory is also natural. I remember 25 years ago when the big debate was whether human homosexuality was "natural". Scientists spent years studying many different species - looking for homosexual behavior. All species showed homosexuality and the scientists concluded that homosexuality was "natural". The official stamp of verification. Then, there was the search for the "gay gene". . . It seemed so reasonable at the time, yet now I look back and giggle

Yes, the appearance of monogamy is also natural. The OP asked if polyamory was natural - it seems that is what the topic is about.