Forestluv

I spent over 20yrs in meditation and buddhism and never got past the "witness + object" stage. The first ego death experiences came with a few solo psychedelic trips, which were so powerful that I took it to the next level by attending an Ayahuasca retreat with a tribe in Peru. It was really intense and beyond any description, yet it was non-abiding - what followed was a period of integration and gradual ego dissolution. Yet for me, the direct experience with ego death greatly accelerated the pace. Baseline consciousness level has increased with meditation, yoga, self inquiry and nonduality teachings. The nondual pyschedelic experiences opened up nondual experiences while sober. They can have anxiety/fear when the ego struggles for control. Yet, over time - they have become more common with less resistance. This is just one approach. There are many. It seems like winterknight's approach is resonating with you. If so, go with that. It just didn't get me over the hump until after a few psychedelic trips - then it started falling in place.

Of course, they are just words. We use words as pointers all the time and we use words for convenience in conversation. I'm not referring to intellectual and conceptual usages. I'm referring to direct experience. You appear to be at a "witness + object" stage. Your usage of the words, to me, suggest that ego death has not fully revealed itself through direct experience and has not been fully embodied. If it had, you wouldn't be asking the questions you are. This goes much much deeper than concepts and figuring things out. Facing the death of self through direct experience was by far the most terrifying experiences my mind-body has ever gone through. Thinking is a walk in the park vs. facing it through direct experience. I thought offering a pointer may help in your situation, yet your mind seems more open to winterknight's approach - which is fine, different minds resonate with different pointers.

The overall tone of your post suggested to me the terms "should", "my" and "response" were used with an assumption of a chooser / doer within a timeline. Without the assumption of a chooser / doer in a timeline, the post no longer makes sense to me.

This assumes the existence of a chooser / doer. . .

Of course. And after soup realization, the search for soup ends - yet the cooking goes on. . .

Yes. All "paths" lead back to the soup - which is Everything / Nothing.

Yes. The subjective experience feels like digging. Yet, from an ultimate perspective, distinctions collapse and there is singularity. I would be mindful of context for the phrase "outcome will be the same". That assumes cause and effect within a timeline.

This is digging into the heart of the soup.

@Quantum_fluctuations Asking if suffering is optional assumes there is a chooser. I would question this assumption and inquire: who/what is this chooser? During meditation, see if you can locate a chooser.

@Beeflamb I would recommend exploring a variety of techniques and teachers - and pursuing those that resonate with you. I’d recommend not becoming attached or identified with any one technique or teacher. Each provides a partial truth for you. People will resonate with different teachings and teachers, depending on one’s level of development.

The three things I find most helpful to relax the mind are: meditation, yoga, and time in nature.

The Buddhist heart sutra points to the Absolute.

It would depend on mind set, intention and setting. It’s like asking “how much should I drink tomorrow night?”. It would depend on several factors.

@Iksander Looks like you got some nice direct experience. Nice work.

To be honest, now that I am tenured the demands for productivity and promotion have decreased. My job is somewhat chill and I even taught a course on self-actualization this semester. More demanding stages of my life were as an undergraduate, graduate student, post-doc and tenure-track prof (my life from 22y.o. to 43y.o.). I went in and out of self-actualization work. Meditation helped reduce stress and helped me focus - so it helped in practical life. As well, my social groups involved self-actualization - so that helped me stay involved. During intense times at work, I would drift away - yet, there was always a call to return. As well, I decided as a graduate student that I did not want a high pressure and time demanding job. I turned down several offers that would have paid much more and given more influence, prestige and recognition - yet I didn't want to spend 60+ work weeks year round. There were other things I wanted to do in life and never got sucked into seeking that type of stuff. As a graduate student, I realized I wanted a job where I could have at least three months off a year to pursue other interests. I was willing to sacrifice a lot of income potential, social status and personal prestige for that time off. In academia, I am like the "6th man" in basketball - the player that comes off the bench to provide a "spark" to the team. I'm happy with that role as it allows me to do a lot of behind-the-scenes stuff in life I love to do and find meaningful.

Whooosh!!! I missed that part. @Cocolove I did an at-home "retreat" for a week last summer. I live alone, so there were no distractions. I structured time to include meditation, yoga, contemplative journaling, spiritual reading (e.g. the kriya yoga guidebook), spiritual nonduality video, self massage, breathing exercises, mindful cooking and eating and baths. I did not engage in social media. I checked my phone one time per day and I only responded to "necessary" texts (which turned out to be three texts during the week). It greatly relaxed my mind-body. My mind-body was as relaxed as if I was on a far away vacation in the Carribean. This not only allowed for awareness regarding how stressed and busy my mind-body was, yet the relaxation also allowed for integration of previous learnings/experience as well as for new insights to arise. I also get a break from school starting this Wednesday. I am planning to do another week long at home retreat.

@Cocolove Are you considering joining an organized retreat lead by a teacher? Or, setting up a solo retreat away from home, or at home?

@Amanaki You guys are good, no worries. A brief side exchange in the thread is fine. Winterknight has been diligently attending to the thread and keeping it on track.

Be mindful of unintentional thread hijacking. This is @winterknight‘s thread to answer question’s regarding enlightenment.

The brain dissolves into a nonlinear, multi-dimensional kalidascope of Turquoise, Coral and Teal Ox essence that is Eternal Everything and Nothing. ? From a materialist perspective, we don’t know. Brain scan technology is not sophisticated enough to obsrerve the phenomena.

Here is some Green from the 1960s. The song is about how a couple without material things can still be happy because they have something more important than material things: each other. At the end of the video they have fun joking at the ego’s desire for attention. The band, The Monkees were quite popular with Green hippies of that era. They also had a comedy show on television. I love how playful the band is in this video. (starts at 0:20).

IME: About 6,000 hours of dedicated meditation and introspection over 20 years => no ego death. About 2 hrs with 4-aco-dmt => ego death I can’t speak for others though.

That assumes a linear “path”. That is one perspective with some truth, yet it’s not necessarily like that for every being.

What wonderful imagery ? As I awoke this morning, I was in a lucid space with Little Jackie paper and Puff the Magic Dragon. There was beautiful creative love and imagination within this world of wonder. Then, the child is conditioned into the “real” grown-up world of responsibility, work, seriousness, right and wrong, winners and losers. The innocence dissolves and so does Jackie and Puff. A sense of sadness arises. Boarding a bus with no place to go is entering a magical space. A return to Honahlee. Yet, now the innocence has a more mature essence to it. It is not an escape into a fantasy world of pure imagination. Rather, it is a space in which actuality and imagination meet each other and dance to music others don’t seem to hear. The beauty and magnificence of What Is passes through the bus window. A clear window without filters of distortion. And this beauty merges with a mind of curiosity, wonder, creativity and appreciation. And as we gaze out the window at Honahlee, a form of sadness may arise if we reminisce about frolicking in the Autumn Mist. Then, a tear arises as we realize that sitting next to us is that rascal Puff. A Dragon lives forever and together we travel on a bus with billowed sail.