Forestluv

There is a difference between criticizing green from above and criticizing green from below. A well-integrated yellow speaks Green's language, because they have embodied green. They are multi-lingual in a sense. A well-integrated yellow, understands Green beyond intellectual constructs. A well-integrated Yellow knows the beingness of empathy, heart awakenings, love, intuition, vulnerability, connection. A well-integrated Yellow will be oriented toward pulling Green up. Not simply criticizing Green through intellectual judgement and distaste. Imagine a loving parent giving advice to their child. They don't simply criticize the child. That creates toxic conditioning. The parent offers advice in a loving, supportive way that encourages them to grow. Yet such a parent isn't simply intellectual. They can relate to the feelings and experience of their child. They are empathetic, love and connect with their child.

To me, you seem to be conceptualizing Green - which has value, yet that aint Green itself. Green is not intellectualizing and creating concepts of emotions, intuition, energetics, empathy, vulnerability, surrender and love. It is the actuality / beingness of those emotions, intuition, energetics and love. These are very different orientations. Men in particular are extremely left-brain oriented and revert to intellect. In general, women can embody green much easier.

There are degrees. A common aspect of human behavior is taking shortcuts. For example, to become a science teacher, one does not need to know 100% of science. Yet there is a threshold of expertise one needs to be a science teacher. The tendency is that people don't want to spend the time and effort of the developmental path. They are too lazy and would rather fancy themself as understanding science after reading a few science articles. They don't want to actually years of effort reading and learning science. They don't want to spend years in a lab conducting research. It's much easier to be an armchair scientist and criticize science from a surface level. I've dedicated 25 years of my life studying science and it's easy to spot someone criticizing scientists and scientific research without having an understanding of the actual science they are criticizing or what it's like to be a scientific researcher. You've got to go into the lab and actually conduct science. . . I'm not saying criticism from non-scientists has no merit. Philosophical and mystical criticisms can have value. Yet they are limited. As well, there are many inaccurate criticisms of science that are made by people ignorant of what science is. Similarly, understanding Green takes a certain threshold. Being an armchair Green analyzer is a surface level. One actually needs to put down their intellectual analysis and judgement. They need to immerse themselves in Green empathy, love, connection, emotions, intuition etc. An intellectual critique of Green is not Green itself. Most people, especially men, are so caught up in their intellectual mind that they have very little understanding of the beingness and embodiment of empathy, love, emotions, intuition.

It depends on the level of resolution we use. If I have an insight of intuition through direct experience, that insight is complete as itself. Yet is is also a component of larger whole.

Yes, that is how I interpreted your meaning of "display". There are still deeper layers. Someone can demonstrate speaking English, yet understanding English goes much deeper than a demonstration of speaking. An "it" happening is an "it". That is wonderful and part of growth and development. Yet there are more "its" to realize. Any "it" is distinct form "not that it". I never said that. In the context of Green, there are many ways to learn to speak Green. There are many dialects of Chinese and Green. Yet to learn a language, someone has to actually go learn a language. I'm not going to learn Chinese by writing about Chinese in English on an internet forum. I'm not going to realize and embody empathic and intuitive essence by intellectualizing it.

You introduced the framework of "display", not me. As I've said, children raised in a high conscious environment are much more likely to develop high consciousness. Childhood environment has an extremely strong influence on development, yet it is not the only influence. And that is gaining understanding through direct experience. That person did not sit around and intellectualize. They were willing to be open, let go of resistance, travel to a new environment and immerse themself. In my own experience, I wanted to learn more about purple and green - so I decided to immerse myself in that environment. I spent weeks living with a tribe in the mountains of Peru. I was immersed in their culture - spending time with shamans and ceremonies. Yet this took some work and effort. Yes. Yet I would be mindful of judgement and purity standards. "Performs consistently" and "talking shit" are relative constructs. It is also delusional for someone to speak a few words of Chinese and think they are fluent in Chinese. Growth and development is unlimited. If you dedicated 10 years of your life to a thing, you will develop a deeper, broader understanding.

Yet that display didn't come from intellectualization. As well, understanding goes deeper than mere display. That is still at a surface level. Playing the piano is also a behavior! Deeper understanding and embodiment is an integrated whole that includes skill, behavior, experience, intuition, knowledge etc. That is a limited perspective. I see people speaking Chinese as a certain way. Yet I have a surface level of understanding. To gain a deeper understanding, I would need to travel to China, immerse myself in Chinese culture and learn to speak Chinese. Yet this takes work and effort. Most people are too lazy to do the work and don't go to deeper levels of understanding and embodiment. If you dedicated 10 years of your life fully immersing yourself into Green, with openness, you would have a much deeper understanding and embodiment than you do now. Why focus on hypothetical situations of how it might be for others? That will not get you any closer to deeper understanding yourself. It's like conceptualizing whether it's better to train for a marathon at high altitude. Sitting around thinking about it is not going to move me toward actually running a marathon. I need to actually go running and train.

What if someone is raised in a household of marathon runners or piano players? It is a great environment to learn, yet it still requires years of practice, immersion, integration and work to gain experience, develop skills and embody. Households or environments of well-integrated yellow are extremely rare. In such a rare case, the child would have an advantage if the parents are able to integrate and teach all stages through mind, body and spirit. This especially holds true for Green. One can get a pretty good understanding of Orange via intellectualizing. Yet Green is not intellectualizing. It is not about intellectualizing things like empathy, love, connection, creativity. It is actually being those things and gaining understanding that is not intellectual. Green is awakenings of the heart and spirit, not awakenings of the intellectual mind. Of course. One could say "I resonate with Green". Yet to deeply understand and embody takes years of work. Yet some people have natural abilities for Green. For example, some people are natural empaths.

Deeper understanding and expertise comes from practice, work and experience. Yet most people are too lazy for that and would rather pontificate on forums. This is a surface understanding. One cannot think their way into a deep understanding of marathon running. One must actually do the training for years, actually run marathons and gain experience of it's beingness and actuality. One cannot think their way into a deep understanding of piano playing. They must practice the piano for years to become fluent and understand the actuality of what piano playing is. . . Similarly, one cannot read a few articles on SD and think their way into a deep understanding of Green. Claiming "I'm Yellow" and intellectualizing Green is lazy and at a surface layer. Learning, experiencing, embodying and understanding Green takes immersion, practice and integration. Many years of work and experience.

This is not a water distillation or filtration system. It's an aeration system. If you want filtered water, you would need to filter the water before adding it to the MAYU jug.

@Yoshy It depends on the quality of water you are starting with and how far you want to go. If you have fairly clean hard water, a simple two pass Brita filter may be enough. If you want to go next level, a ZeroWater filter or RO system is 5-6 pass and gets the water down to zero TDS. You should then remineralize the water. RO systems are more costly upfront and produce a lot of waste water. ZeroWater filters are cheaper upfront and don't produce waste water, yet if you are starting off with a high TDS, you will go through a lot of filters and it won't be much cheaper than buying spring water.

Of course there can be Green excess, yet imo you’ve gone into Green Shadowland and concern troll. You are spending much more effort criticizing those speaking out against racism, than racism itself. Yes, those with strong racist tendencies have likely been conditioned in toxic environment. There is some empathy for that. I would support social services like treatment / therapy. Yet that doesn’t excuse accountability for such behavior. We can have empathy for an abuser, yet that doesn’t mean we should coddle the abuser, hyper criticize victim advocates and let abusers off the hook. That will enable, empower and perpetuate abusers. Especially for abusers that don’t come in good faith and are trying to manipulate others. There needs to be accountability and structures in place to prevent such behavior.

Persuasion is one piece of the puzzle. Yet to me, you are too contracted into persuasion. Another piece is taking bold action and you don’t cower to white nationalists because you don’t want to upset them. Yes, there needs to be a critical mass of white people to join in for progress, yet white nationalists will not be persuaded. If we wait to win over white nationalists, there will never be progress. Part of progress on involves taking bold action and having to drag 35% of the population along as they kick and scream. Bold action itself is persuasive. Look at the trajectory of public opinion on same sex marriage. With your strategy, we would still be doing research to build a rock solid case that homosexuality is natural to persuade evangelical homophobes. And we wouldn’t have made as much progress.

People have been doing that for decades. It’s 2021, not 1981. There are mountains of evidence demonstrating systemic racism. Systemic racism deniers are not going to be convinced by more data. Don’t be so naive. What you are saying is akin to “Let’s not take action on climate change. Yes there has been decades of research proving climate change, yet lets wait and do some more research so we can win over climate change deniers that cannot be won over”.

As I suspected. Saying we need more research to see if systemic racism exists is a delay and obfuscation tactic. It is akin to those saying lets do more research to see if climate change is real. Your platitudes of “let’s all just love each other with empathy” ring hollow to me. And you don’t get to dictate that black people who have been subjugated to racism should behave in a manner that is acceptable and comfortable to white people to “win them over”. That is part of the problem that perpetuates racism.

She is from a deep red MAGA district. They love her. In the rare chance she gets removed from office, here district would elect another Trumpy nut case. This is no surprise to her constituents. They knew she was a batshit crazy conspiracy theorist. Thats why they elected her.

Be aware of constructs of the mind. The ego loves to be virtuous. This is a question of love and, ultimately, Love is infinite in all directions. Yet this requires complete surrender of the ego and it’s desire for mind control. What we are discussing here are constructs of relative love. Yet again, expanding one’s capacity for relative love involves surrender - layer after layer. The idea of treating everyone the same sounds nice on paper, yet is restrictive. For example, when I first became a teacher I wanted to treat every student the same regardless of what so called group they belong to. Yet after a few years, I learned that not every student is the same. I was “colorblind” and “gender blind”. Yet, I was limiting myself as an educator. And I was limiting my ability to connect with students, love and support them. Each student has their own set of issues and for most students their race, gender and sexuality are issues - whether they are conscious of that or not. There are lots of other issues as well. As well the mentality of "I treat everyone with dignity" is great at a personal level, yet does nothing to alleviate systemic racism. Left on it's own, that mindset actually perpetuates systemic racism. So far you've written some vague platitudes about empathy and dignity which sounds great. Yet I haven't seen you acknowledge systemic racism and offer any ideas to alleviate it.

Yes, I’ve also done Yoga with Tim. He is oriented toward the physical nature of yoga, such as posture alignment. His videos range from novice to intermediate. He is good to for exercise, stretching and balance. Yet he isn’t an Orange level fitness guy. He is solid Green. Adrienne’s videos are at a beginner level and broader. She adds in meditation, breathing, spirituality, emotions etc. She is at Green-Yellow. I’m a member on her premium channel and she can go into some spiritual realms.

That depends on the type and degree of asymmetry.

I think it's context dependent. In some cases mutual empathy opens up channels, yet ime many people have a low capacity for empathy. I see it as a spectrum from highly empathetic to highly narcissistic. Those in the middle to empathetic can have channels of mutual empathy. Yet for those toward the narcissistic end, empathy can be counter-productive. Narcissists don't come in good faith and are energy vampires. They manipulate empaths for their own selfish gains. Empaths are often naive and are taken advantage of. Empaths can still be empathetic, yet need to set up boundaries, show tough love and not allow abuse. For example, I've been watching videos of how vulnerable people got sucked into Qanon and how destructive it was to their lives. I have empathy for them. I can imagine myself being in that situation. Yet that doesn't mean I give a pass on poor behavior and let them manipulate me and others.

@SamC Rather than a mindset of either 100% pure or 100% impure, another way to measure growth is how long it takes me to "come back" and re-wake up. Consider that a meditation session is a microcosm of awakenings. In the beginning, the monkey mind is active the whole time. Yet after some meditation practice, the mind realizes it drifted off and awareness returns. Yet the mind may wander off for twenty minutes before the mind realizes "Oh, I'm supposed to be aware of my breath. How's my breath doing?". Every time the mind realizes it lost awareness is a mini-awakening. As well, the mind may rebel "Meditation is boring. I want to do other stuff. This is a waste of time". Yet with practice and "purification" the mind begins to return to awareness spontaneously and effortlessly - without beating oneself up. In terms of purification, I'd say it depends on the impurity. Some clogs in the pipes are dense and take some time and effort to clear. Other clogs are thin and just takes one shot of Drano to clear out.

Yea, nibbles grow back

A couple years ago I traveled to South America to learn Spanish. My best Spanish teachers didn't tell me bullshit about how great my Spanish was. My Spanish sucked and if I wanted to learn Spanish, I needed to stop taking things so personally. When a Spanish teacher said "You have a deficiency with the subjunctive tense" I didn't respond "You called my ignorant! That's all you know what to say. What a terrible attitude. Be nice to me!". . . That type of insecure personalization is a major block toward learning and growth. If you want to grow and become fluent, getting feedback from people that have fluency is one of the best tools you have. Don't bite the hand that feeds you. There is LOTS more that we as white people can do. First, if we don't want to be part of the solution, we can get out of the way and stop being part of the problem. Second, we can listen to poc without being defensive and learn from them. Third, we can become allies. Fourth, we can use our privilege for good causes. For example, I'm a college teacher with certain privileges. When the teachers of color talk about racism in the context of their life experience, the white students dismiss them as "another poc lecturing us about racism" - especially female teachers of color. Yet as a white male prof, I get to walk into the classroom and talk about my life experience regarding racism and it carries weight with the white students. I told this to a poc colleague of mine and she was shocked: "You can do that???!!! I have to go through hours of data and statistics so I'm not dismissed".

In my view, you are trying to control the narrative of what is acceptable and unacceptable in this arena. You are trying to take all the seats at the table. You only get one seat at the table and you only get one voice. The person sitting next to you may have a very different perspective and break all of your rules about how they should speak and behave. They get a seat at the table with their own voice, just like you do. This is why diversity and representation is needed at the table. One of my biggest breakdowns and breakthroughs came through a black woman I was dating. She straight-up revealed subconscious biases I had. She didn't sugar coat it and hold my hand. She ripped the band-aid off and told me sternly and directly. At this time, this is exactly what I needed. Throughout my life, people were trying to be polite as to not hurt my feelings on this issue. And I had never taken a hard look at myself. Sometimes, direct and stern is productive. It can be uncomfortable, yet can open up doors to growth. Other times, being gentle and creating a safe space is better. It's context dependent.

I don't consider this an accurate analogy because it has have removed causation and discrimination. I'd consider a better analogy to be: People with brown eyes didn't like people with blues eyes so they created robots that broke the backs of people with blue eyes. Since I have brown eyes, I have the privileges of not worrying about robots targeting me and breaking my back. I don't see it like that. If we came together and said "It's unfair that robots are breaking the backs of people with blue eyes. Let's inactivate the robots so they don't do that anymore". That lifts up the people with blue eyes (they know longer have their backs broken by robots). Yet it does not pull brown-eyed people down. In one context, yes, brown-eyed people have an advantage. Since they robots are not breaking their backs, they are better able to carry out jobs. Yet a brown-eyed person would need to be hyper selfish to think "Wait a minute, if the robots stop breaking the backs of blue-eyed people, they will have healthy backs and they may start getting good jobs. I don't want them getting good jobs. Let's pretend like the robots don't exist. Let's point out the rare cases a malfunctional robot breaks a brown-eyed back and say it goes both ways". Imo, that is a crappy mindset. This is the equivalent of a brown-eyed person saying "I'm not a robot that breaks blue-eyed backs! Sure, brown-eyed people programmed the robots, yet don't blame me for it! Don't make me feel guilty!". I consider this a crappy mindset since it allows the back-breaking robots to continue. Imagine being a blue-eyed person and you and your family has been targeted and suffered under these fucking robots programmed by brown-eyed people. And then a brown-eyed person comes by and says "Yea, it sucks to be you. But don't blame me". No you are not. If you were, you would be taking action to reduce racism, helping people and making the world a better place. You wouldn't be on an internet forum being fragile and defensive. Why should you get to dictate how people that have been treated unjustly should behave? Why should white people be allowed to tell black people "Stay in you place. Express your displeasure of being treated unjustly in a way that I am comfortable with"? This is what is referred to as "white fragility". Personally, I think blame and guilt has value in some contexts - yet is counter-productive in other contexts. For example, a few years ago I became aware of one of my unconscious biases that was conditioned into me at a young age. Importantly, I genuinely wanted to evolve beyond this conditioned behavior. If POC were guilt and shaming me, I would have retracted and gotten defensive. I wouldn't have grown. Yet I have yet to see a white person that genuinely and humbly wants to grow beyond their racist tendencies be guilted and shamed by poc. Never in my experience and I've never seen it. POC WANT white people to evolve so we all move closer toward equality. However. . . if a white person is disingenuous and is intentionally undercutting efforts toward equality - that is a very different scenario. For example, those that deny there is systemic racism. Here, calling them out on poor behavior and creating a social stigma for that behavior can be productive.