Forestluv

Yea. . . in terms of conceptualizing it for a mind. . . I found it helpful to first get grounded in nonduality/absolute and see distinctions between nonduality/absolute and dual/relative until I could start integrating the two. But yea, at a "deeper" level, my fingernails are simultaneously "Perfect" in an absolute sense and "perfect, imperfect and an infinite number of perfect-imperfect mixtures". When I dig deep enough, it all collapses into nothing / infinity. If you remove all distinctions, nothing / infinity remains. Yet even with distinctions, there is still nothing / infinity - yet it may appear as separate things.

Well ya, if you create some thought story like that. . . Our faces are also covered by a layer of dead and decaying cells - and bacterial cells. Yet that thought story doesn't sound too attractive to me either. What if you put down that thought story? What if you entered a nondual state together with a oneness of energy, empathy, intuition, intimacy, love. . . Now that's attractive. It's so attractive that the idea of sex may not even appear. I've entered nondual spaces with another that were on a whole nother level of intimacy, sensuality etc. than traditional sex between two human bodies. It goes much much deeper than bump and grind. But yea, I no longer see women like I used to - as a something to fullfill self needs and desires. Trans-personal love and sex is mind-body blowing. Yet ime, it's very rare.

Is the "don't try it at home" advice for those without years of experience? I have some free time coming up in May and I am considering doing a seven day at-home retreat in which I do a moderate amount of 5-meo once per day (about the equivalent of 15-20mg plugged). In combination with meditation, yoga, contemplation, journaling and a nonduality-related video. I've never done consecutive days like this, so I'm thinking of starting moderate. I'm not sure if there would be a cumulative effect of moderate doses. I could always reduce or discontinue the 5-meo. What do you think of this idea?

@mandyjw Sounds like a good run. There is a special combination with running, contemplation and beingness. It can be a form of meditation

Sometimes I laugh at the absurdity of it all

This is just my take of the dynamics here. . . I think you are conflating the absolute and relative. Right now, I am staring at the back of my hand. . . It just is how it is. It is ISness. I suppose one could say it is Perfect in an absolute sense. Yet this is a different context than a relative sense. Let's now enter the relative. . . I am again staring at the back of my hand and I see various "imperfections". This was a stressful week at work and my mind-body often bites it's fingernails when under stress. I grew up being told that biting fingernails was "bad" and "ugly". I live in a culture in which many people around me tell me biting my fingernails is a "bad" habit and I should stop doing it so my fingernails look nice. As well, many people in my culture spend a lot of time, money and effort in getting pedicures, filing and painting their fingernails etc. That is the relative standard of "perfect" fingernails in my society. My mind-body has been conditioned to believe that is what perfect fingernails should look like. Yet it is relative. My mind could reject that belief or believe the opposite as being perfect. As well, I imagine there may be some tribe in a remote place in the world in which bitten fingernails is regarded as beautiful. It could be an art form. People here may spend years developing their fingernail biting technique to create perfectly chewed fingernails. I could travel to this remote culture and they may see my bitten fingernails and exclaim "Omg!!! Look at those perfect fingernails!! You are a natural!! How many years did you practice to perfect your biting technique!!??".

Sure, it all deconstructs to nothing. When my mind is engaged in deconstructing and constructing, it likes to draw connections and undraw connections. For example, when my mind-body is engaged in yin-yoga, there is deconstructing/disconnection. A dissolving of distinctions into pure beingness. There are no concepts of “grounding”, “absolute”, “relative”, “my hips”, “this pain is connected to my hips” etc. There is nonconceptual beingness. My mind-body seems likes deep states of non-conceptual beingness, conceptual-beingness and mixtures of the two. It’s when the mind-body becomes attached / identified to any state or concept in which distress in which flow is disrupted. Without attachment/identification it is fluid - it appears then disappears. Connects and deconnects. Constantly changing in a beautifully flowing formless form. Yet then again, maybe not. That’s just what’s occurring in my mind right now. In an hour, who knows what will arise?

It’s inter-related. There is a subjective “choice/judgement” that something is imperfect. Whatever appears simply IS. Thoughts and feelings that deny what IS also IS. They are thoughts/feelings denying what IS. That is also ISness. If I have a thought that my car is imperfect, that IS a thought that my car is imperfect. It’s not a roast beef sandwich. It IS a thought my car is imperfect. These thoughts/feelings of imperfection fuel movements through a time construct. The thoughts/feelings that my car is imperfect will influence the mind-body within a time construct. For example, the mind-body may wash and paint the car so that it appears closer to it’s idea of perfection and provide relief for the discomfort of perceiving it as imperfect.

I think you are now entering the realm of “choice”. An idea that humans hold very dearly. The subjective experience of choice has a huge evolutionary advantage. With the constructs of a timeline and choice, humans can be reflective about their “choices” in the “past” and evolve to make “better choices” in the future. It’s an incredibly powerful evolutionary tool for the human species. Only humans have it. It may have practical uses for survival and evolution, yet it also causes a lot of distress and delusion in the mind-body.

Ahhh, the plot thickens. . . ? This also brings to mind the inter-connectives of a mind-body relating to it’s environment and the sensation of “absolutely so”. We are all like neurotransmitters to each other and it gets tricky assigning an “absolutely so” mindset to an individual mind - it is all inter-twined in an amazing dance.

Whatever is. . . IS. It is perfect ISness. How can something that IS not be perfect? As well, my mind-body has no desire to shove a pencil up my nose and experience the perfection of that ISness. There is a movement in the construct of time and that is perfect as well. Adding in meaning of imperfection and desire to get to another place is part of human nature. And that is perfect ISness as well. A mind can be aware of this underlying dynamic or unaware of this dynamic.

Exactly. What I’ve found is that as we awaken, the cowbell guy (thinking mind) will concede some territory- it realizes awareness has expanded and it cannot continue to run the whole show and be 99% of the song. It ego can be incredibly sneaky and subtle by saying “well we are all in the band, let’s play together in harmony”. Yet it continues to try and control the narrative of the band. It wants to write the songs and have most of the solos. Yet the cowbell just isn’t that great - the guitar, drums, saxophone, piano etc, flow so much better together. The cowbell just isn’t needed. He’s like some guy in the audience thinking he has a big role in the band and won’t stop playing that darn cowbell. It becomes distracting and uncomfortable to the mind-body. Much of human discomfort and distress is related to too much cowbell.

@mandyjw It’s not all or nothing. What if the cowbell in that song drowned out the other instruments and the song was 95% clanging cowbell? It would sound very different. The cowbell is less than 5% of the totality of that song. It is relatively subtle and integrated and supportive to the other instruments.

@Aakash Sure. Now is perfect. It is perfect ISness. It is what it is. There is also movement within the construct of a timeline. For example, one time I was about to enter a sensory deprivation tank, I realized I had to pee really bad. I thought that having to pee really badly for 90min in the tank would be distracting and if I went into a deep state of consciousness, I might actually pee in the tank and not realize it. So I went to the restroom and relieved myself. While in the tank, I wasn’t distracted by needing to pee. This made it easier for my mind-body to relax and enter deeper states of consciousness. If I entered the tank needing to pee and unconsciously peed, is everything “perfect”? Well, in the absolute sense of what IS Now, yes. Yet c’mon it’s a distraction. Why put oneself in that situation? Just use the restroom and pee for goodness sake. Similarly, at times the the overthinking cowbell is distracting . My mind-body functions best with a small amount of cowbell. Perhaps 1-5% of my beingness. It’s easy to get immersed into 95% cowbell and the song doesn’t sound so great. It’s not an “all or nothing” thing for me. It’s a question of degree. My mind-bidy has discovered it really likes playing other instruments like the guitar, drums and saxophone. The problem with the cowbell guy is he wants all the solos and wants all the music revolving around him. Is that song still “perfect”? Well yea, in a certain context, Yet it also sounds like crap in another context, Who wants to be in a band with 95% cowbell and noone else gets to play and develop their skills?

@MsNobody Beautiful insights, artwork and photos. Thank you for sharing it with us ♥️ ?

I would say the cowbell has value and isn’t “bad”, yet too much of it can be distracting. For example, if I am exploring and developing deep aspects of intuitive and empathetic abilities - the cowbell is distracting. I find it helpful to set it down for a while.

@Mu_ Dang, that’s some really nice inter-connection of spiritual dots into a more holistic view ? To perhaps connect one more dot. . . as we develop to a “deeper level” there is the idea/experience that it is ungrounded. The mind-body has dug deeper than it’s previous grounded state and now feels ungrounded. With continued contemplation, practice and integration things start to feel grounded at this deeper level. It has matured and begun to be embodied. Yet, as we continue to dig deeper, things can feel ungrounded again. . . . The above is an over simplified idea of linear development - it is often a “back-and-forth” experience of grounding-ungrounding through a construct of a timeline/storyline. . . I’m curious if this idea of grounding may relate to what you are pointing to as “absolutely so” in your first paragraph. Could “absolutely so” provide a sense of grounding for a mind-body? For example, when I got my first good glimpses of nonduality, it was extremely destabilizing and I felt very ungrounded. I gradually entered a mindset that nonduality is “absolutely so” and tried to speak from a strictly nondual perspective (whatever my mind felt/thought that was). This provided a sense of grounding. Yet then awareness arose: “Wait a minute, there is more to it than this” and insights about the relationship between nonduality and duality arose. Things felt very ungrounded again since I had just gotten grounded in embracing nonduality as “absolutely so” .

In one context the cowbell is overthinking - which can be uncomfortable to the mind-body. Yet if a mind is gonna overthink, ya might as well overthink the hell out of it and then laugh at one’s self. Trying to repress it can be counter-productive ? I never would have imagined a SNL skit to open existential contemplations. ?

Welcome back friend ♥️ Sometimes it’s nice to take a break. Thanks for sharing your contemplations with us ?

@mandyjw Yes, a cosmic joke ?

“I’d be doing myself a disservice if I didn’t play the hell out of this cowbell”. The egoic mindset in a nutshell. . .

Yes. Nothing = Everything ?

@The Blind Sage @How to be wise Thank you for posting this info. I have sleep difficulties and I think part if the problem is bluelight. I just did some reading on the apple night shift feature and it seems like it reduces bluelight, yet not eliminate it.

@Paul92 It is a reference to a SNL skit. In the skit, Will Ferrell and his cowbell represent an overthinking mind. Christopher Walken represents an ego demanding more cowbell (more thinking). The ego thrives on overthinking. . . . The rest of the band members represent “beingness”.

@Paul92 @Nahm More guitar ?. Less cowbell. . . ?