WaterfallMachine

That's interesting though. In essence, what is authority though? Authority is anyone who can dictate power over your life, and by trusting yourself, you become the authority in your life. That is what's meant by being both the guided and the guide.

I disagree with having to have a written journal. The thing about physical writing is that it's very hard to organize, and with the mountains and mountains of writings I have, it's nice to have an easy search network for what I want. I also have a disability with fine motor skills though, so handwriting is extra difficult for me, and typing is a welcome difference. I don't seem to get the reason for hating TV in multiple personal development communities. Some TV shows are thoughtful and intelligent discussions of the human experience, and some books are as terrible as Twilight. There are so many wise and beautiful thoughts that can only be understood well through a combined visual-auditory process, and it's sad to see people don't see it's potential sometimes. It seems like it's caused by how people are overly cynical of anything new in media, in the same way Socrates used to advocate against the written word. I also remember about Leo's cynicism about how the world would turn out to be in one of the forum posts. Sure, not everything is getting better and not that the world isn't awful, but it was more awful before. Lifespans were shorter from World War II and lack of medical progress. The Millenium Developmental goals on poverty, hunger, education, gender equality, etc. haven't been reached back then. Gapminder has a resource on world statistics of how the world is getting better, and Steven Pinker wrote "The Angels of Our Nature" to track down how violence has decreased. Yuval Harahi on his book "Homo Deus" also predicts a steady increase in human progress as we grow.

Well, in a way, direct experience can be experimented on. Like any scientific method, you create a hypothesis and so you test it out for yourself to see if it works. Why not test this with direct experience? If it's true, then follow through. If it's false, then throw it away and trust your opinion. The problem with science is that it often can only study what is true for the general population due to limits of monetary fundings. Your individual needs can be very different, and so self-experimentation is needed.

I don't think this is what Leo meant. If everything he looks for to find truth is from direct experience, he wouldn't have as large a recommendation list of several books of others' experiences. I think what's meant is that direct experience is the most reliable form of truth if you're able to experience and experiment with something yourself, but if you don't have that option, there are other better places to look for it.

@andydufrain The spiritual path doesn't mean having to let go of what your ego wants all at once. You can simply invest short amounts into spirituality and meditation for a short time. Even 10 or 20 minutes of meditation a day can be a good start. Research has already talked about the massive benefits of 20 minutes of meditation in 2 weeks. To go so far towards enlightenment work though, is a much much harder and longer process. And it's best to start small. Worry about self inquiry later. Go find a different meditation forum that doesn't have as many advanced concepts such as "nonduality" and "being one." Work a little with the basics of mindfulness and paying attention more to your senses. Meditation is just mastering the basics on deeper and deeper levels, so make sure you know them well before moving on. Try the site palousemindfulness if you'd like some practices for a beginner.

Seems like these are just arguments with semantics. Different words for same ideas. There’s a practical reason for these stages. Having different stages allow us to know what different methods we need for each stage. Just like you’re not supposed to teach Calculus to a kindergartner or learning how to count to a college student. Maybe it is an absolute concept or not — you see it or you don’t. The thing about this though is that people can switch between the two modes throughout their day. Easy to see a little bit of the Truth for a bit. Much much harder to maintain it throughout our life — especially in times of stress.

I’ve seen this and have been working on it for an entire year with much more advanced concepts. I understood what you daid, but what I said was an oversimplification. I just said so in case the person asking may need to understand this level of thinking before reaching our level of thinking. Even with guidance from the universe and intuition— the best I can word it — we still have the freewill to accept it or not. It’s not that I disagree with using intuition. It’s more that some forms and sources of intuition are better listened to than others from experience. Just like discernment in books and mentors, I’ve found discernment in intuition. This is why I said I asked guidance to be able to guide myself later on.

Some do it for perfect answers or a need to be dependent on people, though the best ones ask to be able to learn how to guide themselves.

We count on conjecture and theory from lack of direct experience all the time. We’ve never been born back in history, yet we believe in those people who talk about World War II. Most of us have never been to Mount Everest, but we believe the famous people who say they have. Most of us aren’t scientists working with the Hadron Collider, but we believe them as the experts. So much of everything we believe is just from other people. This is what removing the ego is. Letting go of what isn’t directly experienced and believing what is really there. And in there, there’s nothingness. Only from nothingness do we know what something is, and so we have a framework to compare our beliefs to something entirely without assumptions.

Hi there, egoless. I’m sorry to hear there are many people who are rude to you when you’re simply sharing your beliefs here. I would just like to respectfully correct the misconception in your beliefs. From the book, The Science of Enlightenment, Shinzen Young talks about meditations from different spiritual beliefs. In history, there used to be an emphasis on meditation more in Christianity, but this somehow later evolved into emphasizing prayer and devotion. Also, prayer and meditation are not mutually exclusive. The rosary, for example, is a type of meditation it itself in that it repeats a prayer to Mother Mary, similar to many Buddhists who repeat the mantra of “OM.” That, or prayers to Buddhist saints in Deity Yoga. In a similar way, those who work on meditation are not removing their free will, but merging and devoting with all in some form. It’s like how a carpet can have different designs in its thread, but it would be all one carpet. It’s not a removing of who you are, but an addition to it. Enlightenment may be seen primarily as an Eastern religious concept, but similar phenemenons happen in Christianity as well. It just has another name, and this is called “The Holy Spirit.” Though how it’s interpreted in modern times is much different from the much more deeper and complex way of seeing it. Many Christians who have similar beliefs in enlightenment work believe in this merging with “God”, to learn from His wisdom, kindness and faith. I’m not much of a follower of these beliefs myself, so I don’t know it much. Though I’m sure you can find some Christian focused meditations online if you try.

Saying you’ve seen something special does not automatically make a person say they’re God — as in an all powerful deity. If this would be the case, then we should be discouraging people who create special inventions, medical research, writings, paintings, atheletic feats, and more. These cases are “special”, but this doesn’t make these cases “bad”. Many could very well benefit society. It’s much easier to assume this with a person who talks about spirituality, but this is not always the case. There’s pseudoreligion to look for as much as pseudoscience. For me, any spiritual belief that claims to know all the answers and demand absolute obedience is pseudospirituality. Leo doesn’t give us commands as I’ve seen. Just ideas, perspectives, and suggestions — that we can go out to test for ourselves.

@Gnosis was right about what he said. ADHD cannot be “cured”, even if people wanted too. I don’t have ADD or ADHD either, but I am autistic though, and many books I’ve read on that is paired with other conditions like ADHD. There’s no cure, but it is possible to manage it well, just like I have to do with being autistic. Enough social therapies and most people barely notice. . But anyway, it’s not exactly a disease or sickness either. It’s more like a difference. In the neurodiverse movement, they noted those with ADHD have weaker focus and stronger impulses, yes, but they also have been researched to have stronger strengths than the usual. Such as higher energy, creativity and adaptability to new environments. Their ability to hyperfocus when they’re really passionate about a task really helps them. Lots of people with neurodiverse differences like us have different strengths, and maybe instead of working against them, I’d work with them. Maybe before trying more “boring” meditations beginners tend to be given — maybe try the more dynamic meditations. Ones that require more physical activity, walking/running, or visualizations. Maybe with meditations that require focusing on the five senses — you could do it with traveling around or exploring somewhere. Maybe switch around between different types of meditation if you get too bored with one, but don’t do too many meditations at once. Then when you can do this, feel free to go to the harder ones that require more discipline and focus. Focus on a more narrow choice then, and see what happens.

I had a fight with the leader of a support group I go to for trauma recenty. I was having a particularly bad day, and blew up on her. Ever since then, she banned me from the group. She said it was a partial 3 day ban to just make me reflect on what happened, but after 3 days, she broke her promise and still kept me out. I went out and opened up to people for help I’ve been avoiding for months. I’ve spent those whole 3 days reflecting on what happened and after. I’ve worked on being a better contributor in there, but she didn’t seem to recognize it either. She just seemed suspicious of me now. I tried to ask for her side for me to understand over and over— but she just said vaguely said it was for the good of the an group. I’m thinking of coming back 2 weeks after, A month — if I could wait longer, so we can both calm down about this. But I’ve built so many relationships in that group. How can I be alright with the frustration of waiting? Of never getting to resolve misunderstandings between us? To never even have the chance to be allowed to say goodbye to the other members? Maybe I pushed my complaints too soon — when everything was still heated. I messed up. What can I do?

I’ve been following Leo for about a year, but I’ve left this forum for a long time so I can focus on developing myself than reaching out to people here. I’m back, and well, I’ve gotten so many changes in my life I haven’t before. It’s just that while it’s gotten a lot better, I still struggle with thinking I’m crazy. I’ve read so many of Leo’s recommended books, and it still blows my mind. So many paradigms and worldviews have changed, and I feel isolated for it. I’ll still continue with working hard on the practices, but I’d like some help in being able to believe myself — direct observation has taught me otherwise, but the world still thinks differently. It’s disorienting. What can I do? How can I believe I’m sane?

@tsuki It’s helpful for you to define it that way. Though the issue is not that I can’t explain it well or at least the best I can possible — it’s more of an emotional fear of rejection that’s preventing me from trying to explain in the first place. Though explaining my ideas on this forum to receive feedback does help. Is that what you mean? I’m not sure if these ideas can ever become normal, at least in my lifetime. It only seems that it can be normal only in certain outsider groups. So I’m not sure what you mean. I guess if I take a look at it now, I can’t really receive full feedback about my sanity. Since there’s no way to fully communicate the Truth, I have to validate myself on another basis. But I don’t know what that is.

@Arkandeus Hmmm. I’ll try to do that. @Prabhaker What do you mean by enlightenment as a fantasy? I know there’s really no such thing in the literal sense, but I have to use some kind of metaphor or language as an oversimpliication to communicate it. @who chit Hmm. The first sentences you said about belief being the same helped. Though I’ve been told that the world can be wrong for years, and and I’ve been telling that to myself for months. I know it thereotically. Just trying to make my emotions accept it on a practical level is hard. Any advice?

It’s actually a myth that high IQ equals success in work and life. That’s because giftedness comes with it many other conditions — they tend to be more emotionally sensitive and easily hurt, they’re more likely to be more easily stressed by strong sensations such as loud noise or strong smells, and while they’re smarter — people often have too high expectations of them that pressures them. There’s a difference between superintelligence and perfection, and people don’t recognize that. There are other more important traits for success. Emotional intelligence factor into success than IQ. This includes things lik self awareness, emotional regulation, adaptability, problem solving, discipline, empathy, influence, persuasiveness, and several other traits. In other words, wisdom is more important than intelligence for success.

Well, they’re not purposely aware of enlightenment and hating on it all the time. Their presence are much more subtle. People who put too little effort in changing that they focus too much on what others think, focus on status, focus on trying to find the ideal one true love, focus on eating as a way to escape, focus on running away from responsibility, and all the traps that prevent people from the Truth. I think there’s a lot to learn from anti-gurus. We may not be like many of them in the extreme, but observing them could allow us to see how we’re alike to them ourselves. I know I am sometimes.

It’s a categorization, an interpretation, and a sense of meaning of something you’re trying to understand.

Well, I don’t really see enlightenment as an on or off switch. It’s more of a spectrum, where it can start with one major enlightenment experiences and becoming more and more enlightened as the days go on. I empathize though with Leo’s repetition, despite me also feeling like he can drone on about it too much. What makes self inquiry so hard is not how complex the ideas are, but how repetitive it is to do it. It’s basically trying to do the same thing over and over — but for different areas of your life. That’s why different examples and analogies help — so the same theoretical perspectives can get applied to new practical areas. I’d say there’s a lot of benefit in seeing life more clearly the more enlightenment experiences I have, and I’m starting to enjoy the fact that there’s no such thing as a full enlightenment. That means there would always be something new to figure out along the way and have pleasure in discovering.

I agree with you. Science is an amazing tool on reality, and much of religion is dogma. I grew up reading kids’ science books and have heard of skeptics like Harris and Tyson growing up. In one of Leo’s videos I recall — he did say he loved much of science, but believes there’s a better alternative. Though I’ve been following Leo for a year, and what he’s advocating is not blind belief in religion or science, but in pure first hand observation. That’s really what they mean by the Truth — it’s less something to blindly believe and more for a tool to remove beliefs or assumptions. I dislike that they make it sound so vague — when that’s what it really is in particular. I’d trust science if I can’t experience it directly, and it’d always be something I’d look at more tha religion. It’s just that skepticism in science often means you have to trust in the experiments of science — even if the research supported are often controlled by who’s able to collect the most funds or the most status for it — and so some personal experimentation could add to the perspectives. Truth, like I said, isn’t a belief though. And since it requires removing assumptions, that can mean trusting science or religion more if you’d lead to it. Truth is a very subjective thing since we all look through the world to limited worldviews, and being able to expand our worldviews by first admitting what we don’t know helps. I’m a science student, and in my perspective, mixing science and the spiritual together have made me enjoy science more. The ideas here are not trying to remove science — but to add something to it.

Well, offer her books or classes if she’d like some. Don’t force her though — forcing a child to be interested in something tends to make them hate the topic more, and working them too hard when they’re young can be bad. So give her a lot of options for her passion, freedom to choose, and see what happens. The goal is not to work hard so she’ll be good at it. The goal is to have her naturally interested in something so she’ll work hard and be good at it.

That happened to me before. After some intense self inquiry and when I reach some milestone, the world becomes a lot more vibrant. I think it’s because my worries and thoughts become more silent, and more of the energy of my mind is focused on the world around me.

I understand the need for competiton. I grew up with it, and the absolute pressure is terrible. Lots of us deal with it by increasing our self confidence or working harder, but much of the hurt comes from lack of self worth, not self esteem. Self esteem is when we can believe that we can accomplish or do certain things. Self worth is believing that we deserve help, love and belonging. Meditations like loving kindness meditation can help, or finding a support network whether online or offline helps too. Self esteem can be emphasized too if you need so. Start with accomplishing small goals so it won’t be as intimidating to try at first, then steadily work to something bigger. Take care.

I agree that direct observation is the best way, but for many issues, we can’t always affirm it directly. Like issues such as the political decision of who to vote for during the elections — where you have to count on believing certain statistics or groups of people. Where to invest, what doctor to trust with your health, what lawyer you’d choose, who you would like to work for, and so many issues that require that we believe in certain experts or at least other opinions. One way to tell if they’re worthy of trusting is if they’re willing to admit they’re wrong or that they don’t know everything. That they’re willing to patiently take account doubts against them, instead of getting angry from attacks on their ego. Another might be simply asking other less unbiased sources — people who won’t benefit from some status or money from telling you — on what they think of them. Like online reviews or word of mouth. Another is that people who have first hand experience on something you want to know is a more reliable source of information than people who heard it from a book, a documentary or something else. A real life interview is best, but for accesibility, a book written by them or to talk through them to a forum can be good too.