SOUL

The point of this life for me is to live a fulfilled and joyful life..... ending it makes that more difficult. So, I'm not sure what "insight" you think you had but it doesn't appear even remotely relevant for my own experience, I may need more insight into the "insight" you claim to have had.

@alyra Awareness observes, although through our intentional life we create experience like the painter that paints, self conscious collects the experience as a canvas collects the paint, identity is merely the expression of that experience as a painting is the expression of the artist. So we can make our life an intentional masterpiece of joy and fulfillment or it can be an accidental and random expression of misery and suffering. If the ego really does die in the consciousness, there would be no memory of it happening, it wouldn't be told and there would be nothing to teach. So if someone does speak of it and teach it to others, it hasn't happened for them but it's just another story to tell they heard from someone else that they believe with no experience of it themselves.

It's really very simple and I could explain how simple it is though people prefer to complicate it so won't embrace the simple. Instead they seek out the complicated, once one decides to search for the simplicity it will be found.

Ego creates an identity from our experience, this identity can be as separate or unified as we allow it to be and we intend it to be. If we cease to believe in the identity the ego has created previously and instead identify with another that may be altogether different than what was identified with before it is through our 'belief' that this agreement with the identity happens. Even identifying with an infinite absolute nothingness saying we don't exist and calling everything else in life an illusion, a deception and false is done through belief. The ego will eventually identify with whatever we believe in no matter the idea or concept by calling it 'truth' and call everything it's doesn't as 'false' to justify the identification. In experience we can transcend it all through awareness but as long as we have a body that possesses a brain which produces mind the ego collects that experience into identity....even if it is one of awareness transcending it all.

I'm not sure I could find a more useless belief for my own experience than this and I don't think I'd try

This is the literal definition of belief..... If enlightenment is just being present and accepting what is as it is it appears that they are complementary not contradictory.

@egoless I didn't make any such claim about that, the only one I did make was to the extent of unawareness of the beliefs in this thread and my amazement of it.

A bull diagram on enlightenment?.....sure, why not.

This thread is so filled with beliefs it amazes me that people proclaiming to be using their awareness are so unaware of it.

@Joseph Maynor @pluto As JoMay spoke to, judge not your self judging, just observe the ego make it's measure as someone else in this thread mentioned in their measure of this thread. If we judge our self judging we perpetuate judgment not cease it, we are telling our ego that 'judging' is bad/wrong in trying to stop it but we are also telling it judging judgment is good/right by judging it. It's contradiction and sets up an environment for distress and turmoil within us so just observe the ego doing it and don't agree or endorse it with intent by judging judgment, it empowers this identity as conflicted as it may be. Eventually the ego will reflexively express in our mind this pattern we intend for it so it unifies with our awareness in judgment free observing instead. It is this obviously simple once the illusion dogma veil is dropped from the eyes of our awareness. @Slade As far as finding some litmus test for consciousness... what purpose does judging how 'conscious' we are serve our self? What itch does that scratch in your psyche? What desire does it quench in the ego? Try asking yourself those questions to see how conscious you really are, it will reveal much about your consciousness.

There is life after 'awakening' though.... once we are at peace with just being, observing the unfolding and in acceptance, we can interact with our life intentionally without attachment to it. In this presence of being is the genuine expression of fulfillment and enjoyment, the monk can come out of the cave and walk their bliss in life.

It's easy to get to this realization of being now, it's a challenge to not get distracted by the story of it. There's nothing inherently 'bad' about the story, that would be just another story, but finding peace and fulfillment in simply observing the story unfold without attachment to it is something our minds aren't naturally predisposed to do. Of course not having attachment is just another story..... sooooooo...... just be.........

All my posts have awareness, self and ego in them otherwise I wouldn't be able function like a human being enough to post it... well, that and neither the dog or cat can type.

So be it! *Infinite thumbs*

Yup, I guess every story has a beginning, middle and end...otherwise there's no story, nobody to hear it and no teller of it which brings my mind back to existence of being that birthed the big bang of story.... it is infinitely and absolutely now here... can you hear it?

...of being now here.

So be it....

@snowleopard Or ontological fulfillment, the ultimate infinite 'spiral dynamic' of existence and this physical manifest we dance around in is merely the story of it's evolution.

@Shanmugam That's awesome, we can all get together and not talk about it.

In awareness I awakened to existence 'before' the big bang... I am fulfilled by the potential of it in my being.

What should I do? If i want silence I go where it is quiet even if that is only the sanctity of my own silence in the midst of din. Why do you want to silence the crowd? No matter how loud, how much or what you shout if they don't want to be silent there isn't anything you can say to change that. Although that analogy was weak in it's attempt to convey the message you intended. I get that you want to reach someone in a 'language' they understand but I'm encouraging you to be mindful of ultimately the simplicity of just being as the healing for the complicated life that distracts us from it, not add more complication to it. If it is really untangling the knot it is done by loosening from it, not attaching more. Talk to them in the way they can hear you yes but don't let it distract from the message of simple silence so to speak.

Fasten the process? If anything it appears like all this talk hinders the process by creating endless concepts to process but if thousands of years of talk haven't prevented war, I'm not sure how more talk...even thousands of years more will change it. Feeding the ego with more to identify with, even enlightenment identity, doesn't starve it of identity if that is your intention to 'fasten' it. Oh... and I didn't say "the need for enlightenment comes from a deficiency of the ego", you did... you read it into my words because that is your idea that you see, as you perceive it, it's not mine and I didn't say that even though you read it that way. The ego desires out of an existential hunger but this is an illusion of lacking but it won't be fastened by more illusion no matter how eloquently it is spoken. Again, the reason why is the ego needs it like the next chip in the bag like an addict but we all know how obese in the mind it will make us but we can't stop at just one, right? Teach the ego to fast from it all and observe how fast it will be fastened.

@Shanmugam So, in response to my simplifying it you increase the complexity of explanation and add another voice explaining in a video? Oh, I understand you.... i understand it all too much.... yet I gave up understanding...like a fast...and in it there is a clarity that is infinite and absolute. So I take occam's razor to the hairiness of understanding every moment I can.

I'm already on that train of thought... er... um... balloon of thought! I am fully aware of the nature of speaking the unspoken, of teaching the unlearnable and expressing the inexpressible state of just being present. Although, I find that people are consumed by making it more and more complicated with their methods and techniques and layers upon layers of concepts instead of simplifying it. Why? The ego needs to be kept occupied with the activity and achievement of the path instead of just 'being' it.

Thought is more than just a measure, it's more than a concept or a label or an identity or a feeling or an urge or any of the ways thoughts appear to us, thought in all of it's forms is our subconscious mind communicating something to our conscious mind. So as long as we are biologically alive there will be some involuntary communication going on and our consciousness work is merely cultivating the nature of this activity within our mind. Even if we create an 'unspoken' language of silence through erasing the line between the subconscious and conscious mind if we ever are to communicate it to another about this silent song in us there will be some form of thought manifesting in the mind to facilitate this... or we can silently be it without communicating it to anyone else leaving our mind to be just as silent as our mouth. Consider that the next time you want to tell someone what you have in your being. ... and of my own way? I'm at peace with thoughts that may come to mind... they can be entertaining. It is not a belief of mine that absolute silence is any more of precious to be than any other so don't desire it. I accept what is....sometimes that can be a little noisy. I am inspired through music too and music isn't silent either. Just a thought.