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I found it useful kind of. There was certainly a time when I thought it was the shit. The self empowerment course is of course a load of bullshit, but there are some useful tidbits in the enlightenment course. Its kind of like he tells you you are nothing and then tells you to develop nothing. I dont really understand that. A huge part of this is that free will is definitely an illusion (because... how can nothing have free will). It is contradicting, but it may be helpful if it helpful. Either way you will either use it or not, but there is no choice about that.

@WelcometoReality There is 0 control over thoughts. There is no one controlling anything. It is all just random. Thoughts provide a context and then the me uses context to assume knowledge about what is. Meanwhile it is made of nothing. The thing that thinks it knows is made of unknowing and arises in absolute unknowing. People dont control their thoughts. If there is no control, there is no ownership. There is no control over what focuses either. The entire concept of control is illusion. That what the me is. Thats my experience at least. There is an illusion of a central executive that is in control of at least somethings, but it is all just happening. It is insane. @PureExp I dont really know how to say this.. The word consciousness and awareness I think confuses things. This isnt a criticism by any means. Just a thought. Both words inherently suggest separation. Theres no one to be aware. Things just happen. I understand that the concepts may be the easiest way to express what is, but do you know what I mean? There are no other words coming to me. There is 0 separation for sure though. That is really obvious when seen. It couldn't be any other way. The thing is that if it is all one, there is no room for an intelligence. That seems to happen as a part of oneness, but as we know is mascaraed as the illusion of control - i.e. "me". All sensations arise at random, like all the normal ones, but also the sensation of movement. It is easily assumed that sensations are somehow different because of how they happen to manifest. It is really amazing. I cant think of better words other than just saying "this", but that word is almost useless in truly capturing it. @electroBeam Thoughts and the external world are the exact same thing. They seem real, but occur and are composed of nothing, so they also arent real. There is really no difference between sensations of any kind. The illusion is that there is a difference, and that they are experienced by something, but there is no experience of them. Who would experience them? Anyways, thanks for the responses. words really do fail to describe what is. It would be frustrating if it wasn't absolutely amazing.

@nightrider1435 That's literally all that you can do. It's helpful to just recognize that no matter what is appearing, that is what is happening at that time. There's no deep meaning. The me wants meaning. It is the known that arises from unknowing (nothing). If there was meaning, then there would be no freedom. Everything is chaos, and anything can arise. My awakening happened during meditation, but I had never heard of awakening. At the time I was taking adderrall everyday at the time. None of that matters. The recognition happens when it arises. Some people awaken while walking down the street. Seeing what you are not will illuminate what you are. You can never know for sure because you cant use a subject to examine the looker. It is actually about unknowing things, not knowing more things. It is a negation, not an addition. This is the problem of seeking, the me's addiction is knowing things. It drives seeking in a way (or at least appears to). It literally consists of what is known, but obviously nothing can be known. There can never be knowing by the me of what is outside of itself. Concepts make the me apply what it knows, and it makes the me think that what is isn't whole because it is seeking a concept. No one ever gets enlightened, but at some point sometimes, me's stop seeking, and then wholeness can happen. It is counterintuitive because what is intuiting is what is being negated.

@nightrider1435 cool cool. It is almost impossible for the me to not latch onto others concepts. The truth is there is no control over it, but maybe in this exchange, there will be recognition of this. There really is no self. There will be a point if you don't get sucked into the massive seeking world where there will be a clear recognition of this, and thats when it either dissolves, or covers itself up. It can be all at once or over time, or could never fully dissolve. Tony Parsons says that liberation exists, but no one is ever liberated. That is so true. When there are angry thoughts, that is just what is happening. It means nothing beyond that. No one is angry, there is just apparent anger. The me uses it to enter self-confirming thoughts. A good person to watch is Paul Hedderman. Him, Jim Newman, and Tony Parsons are sharing a strong message that selfs don't like because it is mortifying to them. Of course, the only one that chooses teachers that advocate aggrandizement is the self/me thought. That's pretty obvious.

Things just happen as they do. Grasping to free will is the self wanting control. That is the entire struggle. The me thinks it can control what is, and thus the dream begins. When that falls away there is no choice, only what happens. It is impossible to imagine by the me. The me is the illusion of control, and free will is its engine. Free will is saying that something could have occurred other than the way it did. It implies that there is a thinker controlling thoughts. Thoughts arise from nothing. How can nothing have free will? If thoughts can't be controlled, then there cant be free will. Either way, me is thoughts, and the me for sure has control over nothing really. There is also a ton of science if that is more to your fancy. It is so blatantly obvious. Something happens and then the me claims ownership over it. Its a story. This is part of the illusion that one awakens from. Just because someone kills someone doesn't mean that they consciously chose to do it. When you think about it, if the person had control, why would they choose to kill? It makes no sense. It is just what is. And likewise, going to prison is what it. Neither thing has any meaning, it is just what happens.

@nightrider1435 It may be useful to stop referring to the ego separately. It seems to imply that there is a self, and a separate ego. The ego/self is thought. Thoughts arise from nothing. They are uncontrollable, they create the illusion that time is passing through stories. The misunderstanding is that something owns those thoughts. If you cant control something, you don't own it. I am not trying to be a dick, It just really matters how you conceptualize it. Everything in the mind is a labyrinth, non of which exists. If it can be experienced, it is not the subject. It is possible to recognize this all at once, but it is rare. Either way, seeing what it really is and accepting the implications of that is vital.

It seems pretty clear that time is a construct, because it is uneven. Also, there is a part of you that feels as though it never ages. Also, it is always the same moment, with different content. What type of being experiences a perpetual now and never ages? Who knows about reincarnation. It seems like a wish of the me. Who cares when you are immortal?

Feel the feeling behind them. Open up to that emotion and let it fill you. What the thoughts are doing is interpreting the feelings and trying to distract or explain them. The self wants to know why. There isn't always a why, there is just what is. Another thing, use this opportunity to notice how the thoughts are completely and totally out of your control. They literally just appear like any other sensation. Because they are out of your control, they are meaningless. Definitely dont fall for the illusion that you are doing something wrong, or that you need to think your way out of them. You cannot think your way out of something you have never been in. Watch the thought and know that every one that is recognized as not you is one more nail in the coffin of the self. All of that advice because that was the experience I had as well. It is a good thing. Remember, if you are not a self, then none of the things that are coming up really happened to you. That is just meaning interjected by the self. They are just stories. They don't really exist.

The self thinks it knows while appearing in a sea of unknowing. Therefore nothing can be known by someone. It is completely unwantable and unknowable. I dont know about all of these complicated concepts of what enlightenment is (of course), but some of them sound wantable. If it is wantable, it fuels the self. Look through what is wanted to what is already. No one can know anything. Who would want to?

There's nowhere to go. "enlightenment" is a non-event where a self recognizes that it never existed. Everything is arising in nothing. One of the things that can arise is a self-confirming thought that uses the concept of time to confirm a false existence. Jim Newman and Paul hedderman's message is the best conceptual understanding that I have seen. If ever there is a teacher that says things that the self wants to hear, that is likely a message that won't result in recognition. This is because the self grasps on to what it wants, then it ignores all the things it finds bad. It is a filter thought that attempts to prevent the very recognition that brings understanding. The less a message seems desirable, the more likely that it might loosen the selfs hold. The problem with wanting to be enlightened is that it infers that there is some concept that isn't already you, that when attained will make you complete. The self thinks I am this, and if I can grasp that then I won't need to grasp any more. But really, this is that, and this that/this is what is. Reality is fundamental, and thought imposes on reality as a secondary measure to exert control over what is. Since it is not fundamental, thought is what is not. What is not can never exert change on what is. That is insanity. Therefore, the reality a self thinks it is in is actually closer to the container of the self than the self is. The misconception of self is thinking that thought is closer to it than what is. Thinking that there is an external world and that thought is an internal world is incorrect. So there is no one here who is enlightened, but there is a recognition of the one part of reality that is completely unreal.

I agree with stopping the news. It is all behavior manipulation. The average american will wake up in the morning, and ask themselves: "How am I going to be manipulated today? CNN? Fox?". It is so clear what these organizations are doing. Theres nothing wrong with it, but once you see it, you can't unsee it. I see it everyday. I'm in law school, and I read and listen to peoples arguments all day. The blind-spots created by the media are pervasive in people's lives and generalize to all other facets of their life. It is the same argument over and over, only the content is changing. All of it is based on the assumption that "their side" is inherently right because the other side is wrong, or some variation of that. It is one of the biggest propagators of the "matrix". When a populace is only concerned with tearing each other apart, those in power have a few benefits: 1) they are generally guaranteed incumbency because everything they do is centered around blaming the right people. When they do this effectively, it creates a situation where supporters feel guilty for criticizing the person, and worse, feels that they have to defend the person tooth and nail. 2) They have no accountability. 3) they are able to campaign even when they arent campaigning. 4) They are able to distract the populace from certain issues VERY easily by pulling the old switcheroo. It becomes impossible to accept what is because people are identified with their side. Contradiction ruins their day as all they can think about is how different they are from those evil people on the other side. There is a very simple truth about reality. Underneath beliefs, every person is the same nothing. Any feeling that this isnt the case is created. It is all a big orgy of egotistical projection built on a bed of self-lies. Once uncovered, it is seen how hilarious it all is. I mean just watching the people get angry over words which are structurally the same argument they are making, or watching their eyes glaze over when someone starts their opinion in the wrong way. They are immediately arguing in their head, they hear nothing. It's good to check the news every once in a while, but for godsakes find sources from both sides and read them, don't watch it. TV news is too easy to insert manipulative methods. We live in an editorial society, and opinions are like assholes.

Keep an eye on wandering mind. Those thoughts are all stories. It may help to start recognizing this. Every single one of them is real but only in-so-far as their value as a sensation. The content however is fake. It's only function is to pull one from the presence. Not saying some of them aren't useful, but they are the main happening that distracts one from reality. You cant stop them from arising, but recognizing them for what they are may cause a slowing. Start noticing how little bearing they have on actual reality. Notice that generally, they serve 0 purpose. They are like waking bedtime stories, only the content is less restrained, and don't serve a purpose to comfort most of the time. There are stories and there is perpetual right now. Thoughts are the thing that makes a person forget that it is always now. Then a thought will arise saying oh no I'm thinking to much. Then a thought will arise that will say I wish I could stop thinking. Then a thought arises claiming that you need thought to live in reality. Then confusion and anger or guilt arises with the feeling that happiness requires no thought. It's the same cycle over and over (just different content), and it is all based on a faulty assumption that time is something real. But the point is that they are just stories that can dominate experience. They are a big factor in experiencing time.

What helps me is just asking myself if I am aware throughout the day. Find an object, focus on it, take a deep breath and come to present. Relax into awareness. Another thing in my experience, is when I feel like I cant stay in the now, I look for resistance. A lot of times the problem is that I am ignoring a thought. And finally, just spreading my attention across my body and sounds around me (even if it is just the soft static of silence). Oh yea one more, try to consciously be unaware. Like purposefully try as hard as you can not to be aware. It works like a charm. It's impossible.

@zazed I agree. The circular thought processes are especially a problem for people suffering with anxiety. Thats actually the entire problem. From my perspective, first I learned that a thought is just a sensation. I had never thought about it before, but it is. Then I started to look at it in terms of identification. I do not identify with tastes, touch, sound, etc. So my mind said, well I must be the totality of my sensation. That cant be right either, because that would mean that I wouldn't exist between sensations. This is when I realized that everything is arising in nothing. "I" am the nothing in which it arises. This is where I started to identify with what is outside my body. It makes way more sense that we are that, rather than the body. Recently, I have been watching me thoughts. When they arise, how they arise, etc. I have been going through the process of dis-identifying with them. I can't control them, so now I observe them like a sound. When I really started doing this, I would have moments where there was no middle man between me and what occurs. My body just moves and it's really weird, like I'm not necessarily in control of it, but also, I know its coming. It is complete engrossment in what is going on around me. I went through a few cycles of that over time, as I tried to kind of figure out what the me thought was. Then the realization hit me that the me thought never really carried the meaning that had been assigned to it. it was an mascarading as the executive that was seeking, and really controlling everything. That has been the emphasis, until this morning, i was driving to school and I guess it just sunk in that the thought that was occurring was a me thought, and it was only arising in me. This thought rolled through my head: The me thought is swimming in an ocean of nothing. After that the thoughts kind of stopped arising and I felt physically just like I did after my awakening. Blissful. during class, it seemed like my body was on autopilot. I felt as though I was only in the background, watching. That sounds like it would be a terrifying experience, but it is the best feeling. Words dont do it justice. It is sort of like a yoyo. The identification breaks down in waves and true identity becomes more and more established. I know this time that the bliss wont last, but I don't care. The ego is losing its control, and this morning was a big step in that direction. It's funny how living as nothing feels more real than when I thought i was something. I don't feel like this is happening to me, but I dont really know how else to write it without using that language.

@zazed Thank you for explaining. My mind was so rational and scientific. It just seems that plugging it into models shows me the holes in the reasoning or the blindspots. That has been the process that my particular mind has seemed to progress. It is definitely better to have almost no thought and just to be. I would have never thought the way I feel now would have ever been possible. It's unreal.

In the movie the matrix, all scenes shot in the matrix have a green tint overlay. This is why. It's an awesome thing to start experiencing as an experience itself, and not just an observer.

@Scholar I agree, but the scientific intro is a stepping stone to those ideas. It helped me greatly in the beginning. I mean, I didnt have a choice in the matter anyways, but... you know... The funny thing is that I'm in law school. Free will is about the most important concept in law. The supreme court has even mentioned that free will looks less and less like reality. It's so funny.

Don't think of it in terms of some third party power on you like predestination. Its motivational drives. When you think you are deciding, you are listening to the subconscious deciding. No one is exerting a force on you, the the self has no control really over what occurs. It just claims to.

@zazed Fair enough. Lets look a little more closely. Not to argue, just because I think submitting to this is important. Under the scientific paradigm, you have a conscious mind and an unconscious mind. You do not have conscious control over your subconscious mind. This is why in meditation, you are subject to when things happen to pop into your mind. Scientists believe that the conscious mind can process 40 bits of information per second. Not too shabby, but of all of the conscious processes, seeing, tasting, feeling, thinking, etc, it gets spread thin pretty quick. Now lets look at the unconscious mind. Scientists believe that the unconscious mind can process 20,000,000 bits of information per second. That is 500,000 times what the conscious mind processes. This includes all the things that are traditionally considered unconscious processes, but I would argue that it extends to decision making processes. This is evidenced by the fact that all sensory information is routed first to the unconscious mind, and then to the conscious mind. Occipital lobe, temporal lobe, etc, are located in the deepest part of the reptilian brain. Consider that the eyes are capable of taking in something like 10 million bits per second, I'm not sure if that's the actual number, but there is a huge disparity between the visual system, and the conscious mind. All sensations are constructed into a reality that is then transferred to the conscious mind. This is also evident in those moments when your subconscious perceives a threat, and you react without being consciously aware first (i.e. flinching). It is an evolutionary override that actually removes your volition to move in these circumstances. The same thing happens with fear. It is autonomic and it completely overtakes your conscious mind. Flight or fright is hardwired into the system. Under this paradigm, it is a stretch to say that the conscious mind is anything other than an output of the entire system. It is the same as saying that a computer monitor controls a computer. Yes, the monitor makes the computer useful, but the image is produced in the computer. When one is in a coma, they lose the heads up display that is reality, but their bodily functions still work. They are still making decisions, but obviously, there is little need to make decisions in interaction. The brain lives on, but the conscious mind is suspended. This is also evident on the meditation/experience level. When you have a thought, where does it come from? Nothing. It appears from nothing. It just is when it is, you cant miss it. You have no idea what your next thought will be (this is kind of illusion because since your mind is connected, it appears that you are controlling it. This raises the question of the definition of "you". What are you? Most people would say that they are their thoughts, but the problem is that thoughts just appear from nowhere. There is no controlling them. What if the self thought is just the thought which arises after the other thoughts, and claims ownership over them? What if it is the subconsious' way of linking thinking into coherence(albeit sometimes in an ineffective way)? How does the experience of thinking differ in any way from other thoughts? It seems to be one continuous stream. Also, if you have conscious control, as it appears that you do, why cant you consciously control your thought? I mean, people want conscious credit for big life decisions, if they have control, it would seem that they should have the final say in what is in their conscious mind. Where does the decision process actually take place? Conscious mind or subconscious mind? I would suggest that it takes place outside of your conscious mind, and is shot into your conscious mind by the subconscious. So did your conscious mind make that decision? It would appear so if there was always a perpetually subsequent"me" thought, that popped up and says, "I did that". But maybe that me thought also comes from the subconscious mind. The greatest limitation of the human is the conscious mind. It is the monitor of a reality rendered in the subconscious mind that is uncontrollable (that is unless you have the ability to hold your breath until you die, or to consciously turn off every sensation at will, or maybe to stop your heart from beating). Why would thinking be any different? Thought is just a sensation like all others. It is uncontrollable. The illusion of choice is merely a reaction claiming to be a cause. I'm not going to get into the Buddhist model, but even if I did, you won't find any refuge there. It's really hard to accept this, but when you really start breaking it down, it is almost unimaginable that it would work any other way. Besides, if it has always been that way and has never bothered people before, why would it do so after discovering that there isn't free will?

@jse Yea, That's what I've come to realize. Nice video. @zazed There's just no free will. If it happens it happens. Nothing can't have free will. That's the big change in me that has changed my stance. It is so clear that free will doesn't exist. For me accepting that has been really important to defang the "I" thought. All of the second guessing that occurred prior to awakening was an illusion. It is both freeing and terrifying.

@Leo Gura Believe it or not that was understood. Thanks. I'm still oscillating between extreme love and backlash from a me that it is known has been experienced, but is not there. It is a wide swing, and when it happens, I just have to let it flow through me like everything else arising. There's no other option. It is absolute existential terror, but the intensity is getting smaller and smaller. Sitting in class, I am notice breathing gets more controlled, and everything becomes lucid. It is the same sphere around me of space, and things are just flowing through it. It's hard to imagine the direct connection being permanent, but it is so natural. Life is just so amazing. The me had forgotten that. It is a truly awesome experience, and had your videos not been there, I may have felt insane (which I may be, but I would rather feel like this and be insane, than to be dreaming and be sane. I was also an atheist when it went down the first time, so as you can imagine, it was a shock. This thought came to me shortly after the initial shift: "When you are looking out, you are looking in". I don't know if it was something that I heard before, but it comes back when it's needed. Thanks again.

@Leo Gura I really and truly don't understand this. It seems that there is a contradiction. Me wants. That's all me does is desire. It can never see that what's around it is beautiful. It is constantly grasping for more. I know people can't control what they want, but it just seems like a never-ending cycle. Don't you think that once you are conscious, wanting more always leads to more of the same striving? It doesn't know what it's striving for, but it assumes that it's death requires fireworks. What if it doesn't? I mean if it never existed, then how can it ever die? Is this not the same as assuming more money will bring happiness, only now assuming that whatever enlightenment is will do the trick? Worse, what if accepting that what is can't be known is the only barrier between an individual and seeing what really is. How can someone know what occurs outside of their perception? It is literally outside of known perception, where the unknown or nothing takes place. Anyways, I just don't see how a steady supply of desire can do anything other than fuel egoic thoughts. But there is definitely no certainty on this end. Just would like to hear your thoughts. It's just so amazing to me man. Everything is literally arising out of nothing. The images, sounds and touch of whatever is outside of our perceptual field are rendering a reality in real time, and the kicker... it always happens in the same moment, always right now. I mean really. WTF could be outside of our perceptual field? No one can ever know. It is the literal unknown nothing outside of the known. Where exactly does the answer lie outside of just observing it happen and having a recognition of the fact that all of it is you? What more can be desired? More "me" stories about what isnt in this moment but what could be with a little more wanting it? Its a fuckin hologram with no input. I mean WTF

@My_Name_Is_Mud . You only get to use that one more time

It's because they are chasing a concept predicated on knowing something that is unknowable. All we can ever know is what arises in us. One of the things arising in us is fake, and it is hard to see how that fake thought works because it chases anything that will make now better. Now is perfect, and it is all we ever know. Whether you chase money, enlightenment, love, sex, the american dream, it is all predicated on needing something to be more of what you are. Chasing need and want is the very thing that fuels the me thought. How could chasing enlightenment be any different? The inherent assumption there is that enlightenment is morally superior to everything else. You have to know when to stop the pursuit/needing process for the me to quiet. When it quiets, it can be recognized for the thought process it is.

@Echoes I think the message that is being put out isn't meant to be received as ridicule. But there's no way to know. There's a good argument that it makes people become set in their ways, but if that is the case, then they would have done that anyways. I definitely felt the same way for a long time, but it caused me to react by realizing that the reaction arising in me was the me thought. It cause a lot of recognition to occur because it de-idealized the idea that were pulling me out of what is. None of these people have a cruel intent. They usually begin by saying that the talk is pointless because people will do whatever arises in them to do. It makes sense. We are our experiences as they occur in the nothing we are. If we react as a me, then that's what we are until that fades. Then we are whatever arises after that.