Steph1988

It is a while ago since posting here and i have this little epiphany that i can answer almost every question myself. So i find myself on multiple occasions typing an elaborate question and then backspacing the whole thing because i allready know somewhere deep in my heart what has to be done about the particular problem. So take this as an example i was slightly overweight and i could ask a 100 questions on the health and fitness part of the forum but i did not do that, i instead build myself a gym in my house and i work out like a madman it is not easy but it is very simple, follow up question could be ''well how can i build up the discipline?'' the answer was simply a constant trying and that began building up like a muscle aswell and it took some time no doubt about it but i got huge results. most often it is about confronting some kind of fear and it always boils down to ''well have you tried hard enough?'' and the answer is always no i have not tried hard enough or at all and this is always the case with the biggest issue's Maybe deep down life is very simple and i get tired of thinking too much. did u guys have this often?

@SFRL Ah clear Yep that seems to be all true in my experience aswell and ye i go with the cashier too. The thing seems to be like a big ratrace tho and i get it if guys want to cop out and play videogames. I did a lot of thinking on how to go about this myself and maybe it is best to improve only on things u yourself honestly care about and if she wants to go along its fine. now what makes you stand out? did u do the hard work? if so what kind of hard work im curious. if u dont wanna answer thats fine ofc but i like your posts because my guess is that you speak from some experience.

How exactly? u mean as in it motivates you to improve yourself?

i stumbled upon these MGTOW (men going their own way) video's on youtube about 3 years ago and they are one of the things that got me going on self development. If you don't know what it is i would urge all guys to check it out and have an open mind about it. Now listening to several channels over the years these video's did not make me more angry with woman but actually less angry,the philosophy seems rock solid, you might dismiss it at first glance but i stuck with it for a time and there is not a single solid counterargument to it, the only thing is that u better not take it too far. although if u found good counter arguments let me know please i want to keep an open mind at all times. For the guys (well probably guys) familiar with it i would like to hear your thoughts on it if u have any.

I'm have not been very positive about Islam but i want to really challenge myself here, I'm gonna watch it with an as open mind as possible. very curious about this one.

@nectar ok U seemingly know a lot about something u stated u don't know much about careful with passing judgement that fast. But i overall agree with that though it is not something to dwell on for too long that is not productive, i keep at my view of taking in the lessons and viewpoints and use what is useful and look in your own environment if some things they say seem true.

@SFRL I liked that post! What about a guy who has neither actual value or perceived value? seems to me as long as he doesn't have real social anxiety he should first raise his real value up to a reasonable standard and then tackle the perceived value. A sales talk is easier to give when your product is good right ?

I would agree with that and for me it knowing why things are the way they are makes me less angry actually. In addition i always try to get the perspective of butt hurt guys as well, i don't resonate with it but i still want to hear it because i want to hear all sides, there is always useful information everywhere but u don't have to identify with it. I don't like the word butt hurt actually, i don't know what people have been thru and it is not wrong to be angry there are lots of good reasons to be angry but then it would be a matter of ultimately dealing with it in a productive way and or finally accepting things the way they are, then start to improve yourself as u can only control yourself. It is not bad sometimes to immerse yourself in negativity and read real dark stuff, it makes u wiser iv'e read the breivik manifesto, the unabomber manifesto and parts of mein kampf not that i want to compare that to MGTOW ofc but i just want to say it is interesting and useful to read stuff really angry people wrote and not close yourself off to it.

@Hardkill Maybe let it rest for a few years and work on yourself become financially independant, find a hobby or passion, get going to the gym 3-4 days a week. check https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCyjTrLPICgp_b8idy71axYg/videos this channel btw, it offers a different approach to the whole problem,he concentrates on the concept of SMV ( sexual market value ) it is different from game and all that shit although u probably u have to learn that as well a little bit. But at least noone has to send u on a mission to degrade yourself in clubs, u work on yourself first and u see where u end up. then after a few years of doing that u start again with regained confidence in yourself and your future. This is just a possible route for you, it is not original at all i know. Also one thing, life is not only about getting laid i know guys who have no problem getting sex but are very unhappy in other area's it really is not everything, it is just one aspect of a whole list of things that needs to be worked on but sometimes i guess and for some people it is later on the list, sucks of course but who cares u get it later then. not getting woman for now sucks but that is nothing compared to the extremely suffocating experience of being deeply in debt for example.

@Psyche_92 I have seen that, i can see where he is coming from and it would probably apply to a great number of men who gave up on the game way to fast and just get bitter and angry and then calling themselves MGTOW. But again look further into it and u see actually successful MGTOW guys. Rollo Tomassi for example is one of the biggest names and he wrote the rationale male, well he is happily married with kids. It would not make sense if you did not look into it carefully enough and i find it a pity that Jordan Peterson dismissed it so quickly, he actually judged too fast. And i like Peterson too i followed all his courses on the internet but he made a mistake here i think it deserves a much closer look.

Ok so for me i just find a lot of aspects of what they have to say just simply interesting and useful. MGTOW is extremely varied and it is not really a group they just agree on a few fundamental things and it is backed up by a lot of research and data. I think for a guy to be learning about hypergamy,gynocentrism,game can be extremely enlightening and dangerous at the same time but i think u got to take that plunge, the research speaks for itself often and what i see in real life confirms a lot of it as well as there not being good counterarguments. Then the discussion to me is less about if it is all a lie it simply isn't and becomes more about how to handle it. first off all i have never been seriously hurt by a woman iv'e been rejected and friend zoned and flaked as i clumsily tried to win approval as a lot of guys do but it did not REALLY hurt me as to make me hateful and bitter. I have not been seriously after a woman for several years iv'e just let it rest for a while instead working on other aspects of my life which were not in order but i plan to do the dating game again now with new eyes completely. i just took away the useful lessons i have learned, - to look past appearances way better - to handle my finances ( buying a house on just 1 income, saving money,investing instead of frivolous spending ) - to hold people accountable - don't listen always what people say but look at what they do just watch for a while and say nothing Now i would like to have a relationship and a family one day but that whole endeavor needs a very solid foundation so make sure u took what u wanted out of life to a degree , save your money,make sure your house is on your name, have good habits and standards. I am interested only in truth and u cannot beat biology and millions of years of evolution no amount of propaganda can make that undone. But i don't really take it personally nature does what nature always does, it equips species with the tools it needs to survive. Also if u want to delve into this stuff learn from a lot of sources and don't look at the guys that are only just angry but look at the difficult stuff with an open mind, look at the philosophical and scientific oriented MGTOW channels and u see also a lot of overlap with what Leo has to day actually. That is how i look at it.

@d0ornokey My opinion on it, i could write a whole book about it if i was a good writer i'm gonna think about it for sometime and write my opinion here soon, at least i will try because it is actually a very difficult and nuanced thing.

@Dino D I find what i want changes and adjusts over time and to just find out what u want might take forever trying different stuff. Over many years for me a few things seem to stick in my case that is my interest in music,history,philosophy and building a strong body besides the obvious friends,family,intimate relationships i wonder how can someone NOT chase what they want. A lot of people i see are seemingly happy with working a full time job and running endless errants and chores,making ends meet, then drop exhausted on the couch watching Netflix for 4 hours, are they happy? how? I would like an answer to the reverse question how can you be happy with the basic script most people seem to follow? it looks like hell to me. Maybe i will not make all my goals as perfect as i want but i (and i can only speak from my subjective experience) am certainly happy if i'm able to slowly and steadily work towards what i want and just working towards it is already good. and then i don't need much luxury or vacations at least for a while.

That scares me, should we be scared?

@Hardkill U live with your parents? then maybe u should aim for moving out as a first priority and resist your mom, work towards making yourself independent, your mother or anyone else should be completely out of the picture with this, she should have no power over you whatsoever. You do whatever the hell you want. And when your independent you work hard towards your goal in your own time.

@Sahil Pandit Saw him on the Joe Rogan podcast very inspirational!

Fair enough 4000 is too much tho

@Shin cmon - work order and why - biggest challenges and why - amount of time spend on it - concrete results achieved i'm curious do it someday perhaps. That's why we are here ( or i am at least )

I have to add BTW that i would love to read a story from someone who did it the other way around, so the socially anxious guy who can't speak to woman, lives with parents,broke,addicted who solved his problems by starting just the consciousness work, just the meditation,contemplation,etc first and then started to take more concrete action ( by lack of a better word ) and that it worked out as a direct result of the consciousness work. That would be an amazing story i have to say i would love to hear it !

@Shin Yes you know you can solve these things by practicing and failure, trial and error. That is the proven way everyone know how that works, thing is that it is scary and hard and requires extreme self honesty but that is ok. you don't know what enlightenment is when your not, you can't know and i can speculate whether it is even possible to attain if you cannot get over your fears first. I solved social anxiety successfully by simply working a lot with people iv'e worked in over 20 places and that did the trick that is speaking from experience as i was a total wreck 10 years ago and not anymore just pushing through with time u will get it ,and maybe years of endless meditation can do the trick as well but i again i don't know it is a big time investment. But anyway i like that we are here to be something more and to not go the way most people do namely by shutting off our consciousness as much as possible. First the basics, then (maybe) enlightenment is my work order and i have to say it feels good that way.

Just throwing it in here for fun not going to debate it enjoy.

Nice i solved this problem by putting my alarm at the other end of the room so i have to walk over that works as well and after couple of days i don't have to do it anymore i just wake up and get up, i cheat my way to self improvement

Some posts here are real gems, I love real story's of comebacks and people solving their problems and explaining how and why. But i find it a pity that there is too much talk about enlightenment i know that is a thing on Leo's channel and amazing that people go after it but maybe they do it too prematurely, maybe as an escape from the pain of solving their problems the way they know it can be solved by taking more concrete action. I admit i'm probably not enlightened and i have a hard time grasping non duality but i'm not sure you want to tackle those things first while you're broke and deprived of intimacy and out of shape it feels like the wrong order of doing things and that should be done when you have overcome things the way you know, when you are honest and dig deep enough. I would love slightly more real story's and less spiritual platitudes i know i'm not going to bother with enlightenment however interesting it is until i accomplished my goals the proven way by taking more concrete action. Its just the feeling that some people might preach spirituality sometimes before they completely understand it (although i guess that should be allowed of course because you learn through writing) Maybe i'm wrong and both can be done easily at the same time but i'm just thinking out loud i don't feel like ranting here and i still like the forum overall.

@Sahil Pandit That is pretty much it for now Can't think of much more then that, i tried

I hope for your mental health you don't view yourself this way.