Nahm

@bloomer Yeah, you’re right. Maybe try the opposite. See how that feels to you. That’s likely how it’ll feel to her. Might make a seemingly complicated thing easier & more natural. Best of luck in any case. ??

@Federico del pueblo Again, if everything = imaginary, that would be included too.

@bloomer You’re going to think I’m crazy and this wouldn’t help, but just a suggestion to try nonetheless… Take a few minutes to read everything you wrote on this thread. Each time you come to some words which are about yourself, say those words out loud, while imagining you are saying it to and about the very girl you are desiring. Just pretend you are saying it directly to her. Really imagine how she would feel while you call her a loser, unattractive, ugly, etc. Don’t ‘beat up on yourself’ here, just imagine as much as you can, her face & reaction to what you’re saying, and how she feels when you share those thoughts about her.

If everything is imaginary, wouldn’t the answer be all of that is included in everything?

First you have to label yourself as laws of physics (not you), then it could seem there could be ‘other you’s’.

Why would you create the thought of a separate universe?

@VeganAwake ? You as well, and congrats on retirement!

Uncertainty is perfectly natural, the fear is in the ‘for me’ interpretation. ‘Knowing a condition’ is really, the thought of, and again the fear factor is the ‘for me’. That is exactly what I’m saying though, emotion is guidance in regards to those thoughts. Body, physical, dog, check direct experience as well. These are thoughts, as labels. Understood. It was in reference to fear. I’m saying animals is a thought experienced so to speak by a human, and that animals don’t experience thoughts like death or avoiding, and that this is projection onto what is believed to be separate & having an experience of thoughts. ?? Maybe, but when not attached to thought / lost in the mind, perception & feeling kind of come to life so to speak. There is no physical reality phenomena, just This.

@Inliytened1 @Salvijus Ok I concede, that dog does look pretty woke.

Spot on. Also, even less so, insight is illusory, as is lack. Insight & lack are not found in sensation or perception, only as thought attachment. @VeganAwake Fear is the emotional experience of false identification. Humans, bodymind organism, animals, and tendency are all thoughts (and not perception or sensation). The projection of human emotion onto animals is justification & perpetuation of identification (“ego”). Animals don’t have egos, and do not experience emotions. No one can show you a ‘fearless bodymind organism’, because it’s a thought. You’re already directly experiencing it. The ignorance isn’t of facts or understanding, it’s ignore-ance of direct experience. The body can’t be ignorant, because body & ignorant are thoughts (parallel, not causation). Holding beliefs / not inspecting direct experience, doesn’t make anyone else anything at all. It’s the beliefs which seem to do that. Also, the evidence so to speak was already presented (monk peacefully on fire).

@SQAAD Hoping that came with feeling of relief. Hoping more it came with some realization you are a profound creator.

Yes. Well said. @Salvijus It is funny, my constant ‘plugging’ of the dreamboard. I do so though (all opinion here) because it’s about the life, the living, the creation. If there hasn’t been kensho, well then it’s obviously about that too. But, fear or not, self or not, water’s still carried, wood’s still chopped.

? Likewise. If I might… seeing through fear just the sake of seeing through fear is fine, great, no issue with it, totally get it. But… seeing through fear in conjunction with directly experiencing the manifestation of what’s on your dreamboard is ineffably, profoundly sweeter, and if I may, incredibly more efficient than the conceptual route.

Inspection of direct experience reveals ‘two things’ is the thought that there are two things, and there are not, ‘in’ perception, two things, any more than the stuff coming to mind on your trips is actual or ‘in’ direct experience. What you’re being shown (imo) is that psychedelics can be helpful but are not exclusively the way, and likewise that the (wandering) mind is a terrible master. Meditation & inspection of direct experience could be said to be an essential foundation prior to tripping, if orientation is truth. Perhaps all that’s being avoided, is the cushion.

Nope.

I was just pointing to the subtle difference (only in regard to what you wrote, to the words) of there being a self of some sort which is recognized as unreal, vs there not being or ever having been a self at all. Apparently there can be a psychological recognition that there is no separate self, and apparently this is not necessarily an end or seeing through of the experience of fear, as the fear is then deflected psychologically, and projected onto the world, creation or experience, as something natural that happens. It is often psychologically added by the ego mind in justification… “for good reason”, or even accredited to “infinite intelligence”. What you are saying is perfectly accurate. This recognition of no self can & does occur along side an upholding that there is fear. The so called ego mind justifies & rationalizes not going deeper into the direct inspection of fear & meditative settling of thought activity, and deduces that fear is a naturally occurring phenomenon, or serves in some manor like survival, etc, perpetuating the belief of a separate self surviving, while simultaneously claiming the realization of no self. This is cognitive, the activity of thought, and is not (as you so humbly & accurately pointed out), ‘awareness realization’ for lack of any term which communicates the actuality. This shed’s a clearer light on meditation, which is the same as saying (in this case) the settling of the very thought activity, which is the deflection, justification, projection and rationalization, which is fundamentally the upholding of the separate self, and thus the perpetuation of fear. Another way to say that, one could attend a “neo advaita” event, talk or gathering three times a day everyday, and while psychological clicks and ah ha’s likely ensue, this would not supplement cessation. So to speak, the way you’re going about it would be ‘right view’, and ‘right understanding’ imo. Accurate.

@thenondualtankie Just be a gentleman. Compliment her, hold the door open for her, have dinner ready by 4pm, offer to hold her cane while she gets in the car, etc.

@Consilience I think we’re saying the same thing here.

It is. The “recognition that the self is not real” still includes a self, which was recognized as not real.

No. Insight is illusory. One liberated, is illusory. Insight is illusion. Also, causation is illusory.

There could certainly appear to be that experience, sure.

That I, me & insights are illusory. State(s) is a belief, and now that you apparently believe it, conjecture. So there’s three apparent layers to see though now. Because it isn’t. Insights and the I, self, one, etc, which has them is illusory.

Insight is illusory. Still got the separate self in there, the one nothing touches. What isn’t can’t be removed. That “I”, which has the insight, which realized, is ‘the separate self’, and is illusory.

Illusion can’t cause anything. Illusion is there-isn’t-that, so there isn’t some thing, which causes some thing. Rope, snake, fear, beliefs, death, all illusory. There-isn’t-a-self can’t be credited with causing anything, nor accepting anything. It’s like saying a unicorn experiences total acceptance & total fearlessness. It’s not a matter of if a unicorn does or doesn’t. There’s no such thing as a unicorn. “if you realized you don't exist” A you doesn’t realize a you doesn’t exist.

If a thing is illusory, then there isn’t actually said thing, and what isn’t actual, or ‘there’, also can’t cause or be credited as having caused. That implies there is still a separate self. The one who remains which could be in or experience total acceptance (of whatever else).