kurt

I'm saying you are attached to your ideas and your bodymind (clearly, because you dont know who you are). I'm aso saying you are possibly still at blue cognition because you imagine that you can skip stages, you probably stereotype life in much the same way as the model is presented to you. I'm not turqouise, I said "thats turquoise thinking". Dont put words in my mouth (although, I have no expectation from you to be anything than you already are)

True, but a teacher cannot teach (they may in fact be enlightened) unless they have a teaching that others can follow, exactly for the reason you mentioned that experience is subjective. If you follow a teacher with only their subjective experience as a teaching then you have technically been drawn into a religious cult

@Extreme Z7 Thanks, I didn't look at the content, but scanned through the descriptions of the charlatan on the screen. Agreed, almost 100% . * I just listened to the content, and no, this guy sounds misinformed. He's still attached to the world as if it is real and worth worrying about.

You're right, these 2 particular guys were way more developed than orange. They did pass through orange on the way, 12-17 years old is orange thinking. Most people don't reach orange in their lifetimes, they are only dictated to by orange paradigm because it's the top of the food chain in terms of interpreting experience.

For a green thinker (who still takes themselves to be the body, therefore lives in duality) the environment for them is an object that is separate from them. They believe in their conditioning that they are an individual who is a product of the material universe. People in the first tier can and do hijack spiral dynamics for their own agenda. So it depends on where your information is coming from, if it is coming from a first tier person, they will interpret the model according to their own understanding.

Good question "Orange" If you only know what orange looks like from your point of view, if you only have a cartoon like social model like spiral dynamics that you then proceed to interpret through your own intellectual faculties, and you dont have adequate understanding that "orange" is a just a rational objective mindset then all you see is Tia Lopez, the banking world and celebrities in hollywood. There are other sources of information about the "developmental altitude" of formal operational thinking than spiral dynamics. Were not fucked as a species, there is no species. Point me to "a human race" that is outside your own assumption, and I will offer you up for the nobel peace prize because you are a genius and the first person to discover the human race as an objective reality! That's turquoise thinking right there. But you don't understand what it means when Turquoise says these things because you first need to understand what it means to pass through orange itself.

@Kvath Too much study without practical application just creates a backlog of unassimilated information. I had that and needed to see a psychologist to get it all out. It does cause anxiety, because you end up smothering your actual psychology instead of assimilating it into your current knowledge and it actually becoming part of you. Take your time, and focus on one thing at a time.

@Maria Antunes You won't have to fulfill all the worldly desires, only acquire the skills, qualities of mind of each "stage" and recognize sufficiently that they are all "empty" of permanent satisfaction. Yore not being egotistical wanting to climb the ladder. In fact it's the ultimate act of self love, all beings have a desire to reach their full potential. Egotistical would be claiming any of this as your own doing (which happens naturally, and therefore we all have narcissistic traits in various areas). This is not a problem, if your goal is liberation then just go for it, do your best and let go of attachment to outcome. The path is so much easier that way anyway in my experience. I am having trouble interpreting what you meant with this: Would you mind re-phrasing so I can get a clearer picture of what you mean? Thanks

@Scholar Don't worry about it. If it keeps happening go get yourself checked out by your doctor.

The ego or the individual is not the problem. Ignorance and taking the dimensions to be real is the problem. The ego is just the sense of a person, and that stays because it is part of consciousness, it is an object of consciousness, it is consciousness taking a particular shape, just like the "keyboard" I'm tapping on right now, it's not a keyboard, "keyboard" is just the name when consciousness takes that particular shape. We're limitless because we take any shape and form but consciousness itself is not limited by those forms. Were free because the forms depends on consciousness, but consciousness does not depend on the forms. The names are just bullshit lol This is enlightenment, were always experiencing enlightenment even if we are under the spell of ignorance. There was never a time we were not enlightened.

@Kevin Dunlop The chair Im sat on is only a sensation. I can only infer that there is a "chair" there, but I can't actually find a real chair, only the sensation of it in my mind. But... how about that sensation? Is it any different to the sense organs? What is the difference? None, there is no division between the "chair" sensation, the sense organs and consciousness. However, there is still the perception of dimension, but that doesn't really matter much because I clearly see that my experience is one, its "flat" it's not really dimensional, only maya tricks me into thinking that. But upon close inspection there is only one experience here. Whats even more mind boggling (but equally as irrefutable) is that you are in the same experience as I. We are one experience. Nice to meet "you"

Who's comment? JJ's?

mmm yeah, you're having an impact, i'll give you that.

@Mikey I'm at a loss for words, I'm staying out of this. All the best

Yep! And if we had no ego then there wouldn't be anybody here to enjoy enlightenment. If its a non dual reality, then that must include the ego because life without ego is a duality. Non dual reality includes the real and the apparent, it's just that one is not fooled by the apparent objects ignorance projects. The objects ARE the Self, (projected from past actions from the causal body) maya is the illusion that the objects are somehow "out there"

I'd let someone else test it first lol. Better to be safe than sorry eh?

A word of advice. Don't judge things people say and do as right or wrong. That only makes you angry and you just end up hurting yourself, nobody else. I would take my advice if I were you. Good day to you!

No you're not. Mikey is

I can do what i like. And I know what I write, because its confirmed by my own experience. And I'm not preaching lol

Feel better now? lol

Where is the mean stuff people are saying about you? (I'm not criticizing you, just asking)

Exactly That's all this path is, learning teachings and doing meditation. I'm here assimilating what I heard and parroting it so it goes into my subconscious. That is how people have always become enlightened.

Hahahaha! Excellent!

Of course Were all wrong, thats the problem. I'll pass thanks lol

No. Just no.