Outer

If you could reveal unconscious biases (you can't right now, since they are inaccurate) what do you do with that? Do you think all employers should go through it, or for instance citizens? If unconscious biases was later found out to predict behavior, would you change people's unconscious biases with retraining? (To alter behavior).

Just saw peterson's response to systematic racism or whatever it is called.

Mate, you are pushing people to become aware of therefore measure unconscious biases in themselves, yet it's not proven to be accurate, because it changes each time you test for it.

But you can't know who has unconscious racial biases, because the test result correlates .5 with future results, meaning it alters as you do multiple tests. Even if you could measure unconscious racial biases accurately, do you then have evidence that they predict behavior? Now if you did have evidence that they predict behavior, could you alter the unconscious biases and then to change behavior? Then the question comes, should you be retrained by your employer or government?

Which can't be measured accurately.

@Serotoninluv @Emerald

Your mind is neutral about what associations it creates, unless you think you've mastered some part of you, you can't master. I love this conversation as it makes me think, I don't have a fear of being labeled racist now, but I don't want to get pissed off and that would piss me off. Ultimately it doesn't matter what you think or imagine, it matters what you say. You're adding value to a neutral thinking process which is produced by inputs from the environment and your own genetics. You're observing that inputs change your thinking process, but I don't think that there's a systematic on-mass inputs which alters thinking process that leads to negative consequences for society. I just think that they are useless things that you should ignore, and not pay attention to, within yourself. I also think that all the non-racists who protest at social justice rallies should let go of their "white default-ism" labeled thoughts. You don't fight it or figure out where it came from. That's not letting go. Clearly I've never said "black" people or anyone else who experience racism is going to dream that away by repeating that race doesn't exist. It might not exist in their mind, but it does in the racist. The one who is affected by the racist you can tell them that races exist, but you can't tell the racist the same thing, can you? If you want to stop them from being racist. Everyone must drop race. It doesn't work from telling the victim they do exist but you tell the oppressor they don't. The problem comes from the racist thinking they exist.

I'm just asking why you're making that observation. Note how you're avoiding my question. That's not a nice way to have a discussion.

It's Red/Blue values in an Orange scientific-capitalistic society. The science is complicated but it seems clear to me that the divisions of humans into races is arbitrary and socially constructed. From an alien to this planet perspective with the same understanding of genetics, they wouldn't create our typically "races", those used in the U.S, for instance. The Scandinavian countries are actually highly scientific and capitalistic, they run on social democracy. For them racism begins with grouping humans into races, which is why I am questioning those who have those beliefs in this thread, as even for "social justice" it's really counter intuitive on the long-term, if we are to aim for the stars and ideals.

I completely accurately described you in being neurotic about not seeming racist then. You're not undoing your own racism by placing value on skin color, as that's how racism evolves. The foundational belief of all racists is that races exist. No belief in races, not giving importance to race or color, and you will not be racist. However you managed to do just the opposite in that, by giving value to whatever skin color came up when you're imagining "a person walking into a bar". Just my thoughts.

You're making an observation based on the belief that races are a thing, but you've not said why you are making that observation?

Self-inquiry is about the silence of the I-thought, it won't give you any other answer than silence, unless you're doing it wrong. As a part of a Native American tribe the shaman is going to tap you with a stick and say "Pay Attention" "Be without thought". As you watch the Bison herd run on the steppes.

Clearly you shouldn't default into any color, because none matters more than the other, so you shouldn't care if you think "person entering a bar" means a white person. But because you do think some matters more than others as a part of your Shadow you NEED to have another color than white when you imagine the scenario "person entering a bar" you probably even thought "why didn't I imagine a black person?" That means you put value on color in the first place to react. By not defaulting in any color, white color can arise in an imagination, but you're not even aware of it because it doesn't matter. The truth of the matter is that your thinking probably just thinks of associations and creates a picture out of "person entering a bar" scenario, from where you've heard that before to movies. To update your future picture creating with a new association of being aware of which skin color you have an imagined person is just a reflection of your neurotic need to not seem racist, while it merely substantiates the "some colors matters more than others" belief, to the extent you want to imagine another color when "a person entering a bar" comes up to you. Not defaulting into any color means not caring about colors, means giving up on the beliefs of division within humans into races.

The word consciousness raising was created by feminists in the 1960's, and it has nothing to do with spirituality. So in case you believe those things will answer it, I'm sorry, but that's not the case.

Entertain the idea that your thinking goes to its logical conclusion, and is handled on a governance level, what would that look like?

I understand that, but I don't understand this: No, I haven't. What is the deeper fundamental issues? Here's your opportunity to explain these 'deeper' fundamental issues, and why they are issues. I've already thought about it, and I know what I care about, and that's to decrease racism, one of many issues, for a future Utopia. I understand how you're thinking, but what I wonder is what you're going to do with it?

That's what I'm doing, except I don't even know your perspective, that's what I'm trying to figure out.

Yes, I was asking you, not asking you to explain some video. What do you want to happen? What changes? What is your ideal world? That's what I'm wondering. What does it mean when you say "White are the majority and the most powerful group" to you? What does that entail?

No,no no. I'm asking you.

I don't understand, sorry.

So what conclusions do you make from that type of thinking? What do you want to happen?

Yes I won't ask you to prove it to me with facts and evidence. Because those are my defense systems. Listen to what you sound like. I'm not denying systematic racism, but I define it very clearly as an organization who has been overrun by racism, for instance.

Just stop.

So relatable. So loving. So compassionate. So looking into the sky and aiming at the highest ideal.

"Racism, previously referred to as raselary, is the notion that humanity can be categorized into different races, each adding a set of properties and ranked by value. Racism is and has been the basis for discrimination or segregation." Norwegian wikipedia on Racism.