Key Elements

@Serotoninluv I want to add something that I find very funny here, according to my experience. In the US, from others, I get labeled like this: committed, "in a traditional marriage," devoted to husband (what a joke), following the husband, traditional values (Lmao). I'm not even married to my own "background." In other, more "so-called" conservative countries, I'm labeled as: Party animal, likes to have fun, goes out a lot, a Western American Culture gal (Lmao), doesn't mind having ex-bfs (Lmao) In both situations, they don't know me at all. Nope, not even a bit. That's why I like Jay's clip a lot. It's one of my favorite. Of course, we are impacted by social media, and yes, it's very challenging to find someone on social media for a deep connection without all the nonsense so that one can be authentic and honest. Yes, this is what I mean by most ppl not being able to transend culture.

@Serotoninluv hmmmmm....interesting....the word "commitment." I find this word very interesting. Yes, I am married. So, what? What's holding my marriage together? A marriage certificate? A wedding ceremony? No way. Those things are not the commitment. Right after getting married, I thought to myself, "Am I really married?" LOL!!! According to the definition of the "universe," no! Technically, I'm still single. Marriage, long term relationships, weddings, etc etc etc -- all man-made concepts. LOL!!! Therefore, I'm also in a non-committed relationship. The word "commitment" is just a label and part of the man-made language we're speaking.

That's not what I meant when I said, "I guess so..." I do believe you. I wasn't trying to judge. What I meant by saying that is, ppl in general do not know the full details of other ppl's relationships. I wasn't talking about you personally. For example, my relationship is deep because it's "detached", ok? It's just one of many examples. Now, if you asked me why, well then, I have to go into details. Maybe I have to talk for 15 mins or more explaining this.

@Serotoninluv wait a minute...I'm not challenging you. hmm..We seem to be having some miscommunication for some reason. I'm saying we don't know the full details of other ppl's relationships. It's personal. If we did, we would learn a lot from it. That's all. You wrote so much details that I'm not even thinking of. That's why I like Jay's clip that I posted. Jay's clip is not pro-monogamy, and a rant against polyamory. LOL. He's far deeper than that. It's something to deeply reflect on. I think he did an excellent job. Two ppl have to be willing to be able communicate deeply. It's not just communication; it's also the work--actions speak louder than words. And, I wasn't really surprised that you brought up monogamy here after watching Jay's clip. It's not just you but others in the forum too. When monogamy is mentioned or even perceived, ppl really defend their positions against it. If ppl really get defensive like this, the other person cannot even be authentic and talk about stuff. Now do you see how it's very challenging to find a partner, esp online? I'm not just talking about monogamy, but other things too that is perceived in all the wrong ways. For example, "Where are you from?" Answer: "_______." I don't know if you could answer this question. Some ppl, when they answer this question, they can't really be authentic anymore because they're judged in all the wrong ways.

I guess I don't really disagree. I can't really speak for whatever happened in your relationships though because it was between you and them. I thought we were talking about Jay's clip that I posted -- the meaning. I think it can be applied to polyamory, LGBT, polyamory + LGBT, or whatever you choose. As long as you're having deep conversations and deep relationships, you're fine. Then, there's no need to overstep other ppl's values/boundaries and ridicule them because it would be an open discussion. That's what I thought Jay meant. However, you understand what I mean, right? Deep conversations don't usually happen. That's what Jay meant too -- a big part of it in his clip. I don't see meeting someone from Tinder, for example, would be having deep conversations with you on dates, esp when you just read his/her profile and decided to meet.

Nope. I don't agree with this. I don't have an absolutism mindset. For example, I have nothing against polyamory. I don't see Jay being against other relationships. He's encouraging deep relationships no matter what it is--doesn't have to be monogamy. What effort did I do in my relationship? Did I even say it? No. There were big challenges in our lives, but it wasn't spousal challenges. They were other problems we were trying to solve in the past. You're entitled to your own opinions about other ppl, but it doesn't mean you know them. Same is true for me. Looks like monogamy and long term relationships are the "new gay." Millennials think that they are absolute and fundamental just because someone chose to have that type of relationship. It used to be that LGBTs were the taboos. Now it's "reverse discrimination."

Jay has not told you, me, or anyone anything, other than stuff like go deeper than just having conversations about shoes, social media, coffee, beer, happy hour, etc. Go on a real date instead of avoiding it. That's what he meant in the clip, to sum it up. I don't find the clip biased or judgemental like you put it. His clip is not a justification of "traditional monogamy" and long term relationships and a downplay of polyamory and other types of relationships. That's a projection. I think you're looking at what he said from your lense. If you had a casual date with a gal at Starbucks that you met online carefully, what are you going to talk about after the first few dates? Definitely, you will not repeatedly say that you like to drink tall mocha frappuccino the most. You will not be talking about which coffee do you like from the most to the least. Here's where the conversation gets deeper. She mentioned that she's a lesbian, and you're not into that. Well, hey, that's fine. Just be friends. See, this is the deeper conversation. Then you start talking about what you're into and what you're not into. But, to do that, you have to know yourself very well. Same goes for the other person. That's a real date. Here's another way of putting it. If you're on a "real date," you just don't say to the other person or in your mind, "Lmao! She's a lesbian. Why am I wasting my time with her?" Wouldn't you say that this reaction is shallow, even though you said it in your mind? To me, yes, of course. A deeper date would be the both of you got into a coversation where you learn something new from each other, even though you're not interested in each other in an intimate relationship. I'm sure if you go into it, you'll learn something new. But, in real life, does it even work this way? Nope. Rarely. Esp, not on social media.

I agree that relationships are nuanced but disagree that Jay is not nuanced. If you look at Jay's other clips, he is very nuanced. When I said "petty," a person is just sitting down with someone talking about topics like clothes, shoes, coffee, beer, etc. -- not something deep. Jay, IMO, is trying to refer to deep conversations. The complete opposite of what is portrayed in his video clip. Didn't you see that in the video clip, ppl were just having coffee and beer and doing social media and not going anywhere else with the coversation? That's all he meant. He was NOT trying to put down any groups, like polyamory. Did you see his channel? I don't get that impression that he's someone like you described.

@Serotoninluv Jay did not exclude polyamory. Just because he said it like that does not mean he excluded that type of relationship. It looks like your interpretation of what Jay said is only for your interpretation of "traditional monogamy." I just told you about the conversations not being petty. That's what I thought he meant by "actual relationship."

@Serotoninluv I knew that you would mention polyamory. Yes, it does include that too. Polyamory ppl do talk about serious stuff, like who (which partners) are involved and so much more beyond that. They don't just talk about which coffee they like, and which beer they like to drink, and what shoes they will wear today. The conversations go way beyond those at the start of their relationships. Whether they want to end the relationship is up to them. Jay is saying that with anything it takes work, and yes, the word "work" is deep and profound. It takes work to fully understand the other person, and this doesn't involve shallow conversations with labels.

@Serotoninluv here's another thing I want to mention that doesn't make any sense to me. First off, I'm completely ok with not talking to ppl. It's not easy to have a conversation nowadays. It's only small talk. Most ppl I run into, when they find out that I'm married with children for years, I'm usually automatically labeled as a "traditional" or something for no apparent reason. And, I tell them that I'm not interested in going into my marriage because it's personal and no one knows what's going on except for us, esp when there are labels and criticism. "Aren't you bored of him?" I'm like, "no, why should I be?" It sounds very inauthentic and insulting to me to make some kind of petty excuse just to break up. I don't see the difference between what Leo said in his clip and the clip done by Jay Shetty. Both mean the same thing. Leo just happens to not include talking about social media, and he also forgot to include that it takes work for the ppl involved in the relationship to get there.

I see nothing about it being "traditional." It could work in any type of relationship. He never said anything about it's wrong to break up or anything like that. Most of what Leo said on his clip also made sense to me. What's traditional about it? I can't picture a stage blue person listening to these clips.

Reminds me of this clip... I like how Leo puts it here. He basically nailed it. But, I think he forgot to say that it takes work to grow into that.

I also don't right now, but I'm happy that I did and it worked out. I see nothing wrong with it. I appreciate the lessons that it taught me, and it made me realize how to live life better. The saying, "Challenges are opportunities," is totally true.

I get what you're saying here. If I was in a situation where the relationship fell apart after years of commitment, I rather not find another. For me, there are other things to do in life. Being embodied in an "ego," we don't have all the time in this world to do what we really want to do. Life is temporary.

Different ppl dress differently in their weddings across the world. They don't look similar. That's what I like about it -- the different designs.

@Serotoninluv I think many ppl in society are not getting this... When you're in a relationship, do you want it to last? Yes? Ok, then. Don't call it quits so easily. Just keep working and working on yourselves. That's it. All these "emotions" or talking about something or going out somewhere are just the icing on the cake. Even when you're together, technically you're still "single." What's keeping ppl together is simply because they accept each other for who they are, and they want to be together.

The key word here is "detachment." When used to self-reflect/self-inquire, it's to help in understanding a successful relationship/building successful relationships, life itself, and the deepest truth(s).

So sweet! It's your wedding, right? Cute couple.

I bet, eventually, no matter what relationship you're in, it will go toward life purpose + spirituality whether you like it or not. At least it will have to fall into LP. And yes, it does correlate. Here's why... Eventually, a person will retire. Most ppl retire at or after age 65. Let's spice it up a little. What if you retire much younger? Like in your 30s and 40s? What are you going to do for the rest of your life? Relationships are not the answer. It will go out of balance. How long are you going to be "in love?" The "lovey-dovey" phase can only last for so long. What are you going to do? You can't talk to each other forever. It will get boring. Some ppl don't have to work a day in their lives anymore. Then what? They don't even have to lift a finger anymore--no housework, no cooking, nothing. Then what? Life can only get duller if you don't know how to live it. There's a saying, "An idle mind is the devil's workshop." This includes idle relationships. One cannot go on continuously talking small talk to each other forever. If this happens, they'll just find an excuse to fight. What's the next step? Detachment and finding the LP. This is probably a stage yellow clip at least because the word "detachment" is our true nature. He talks about detachment in relationships. That's how it works. The truth to why it's our true nature is because when you're experiencing an awakening that has to do with the nothingness, you will see and become one with everything but detached from everything. That's how it works in this life too because duality is correlated, interconnected, and one with non-duality.

See, if you want to tell them when you're completely independent from them, that's your choice. Just think of how they will react and the consequences. You know your family the best. Just be aware of that. I don't know if it's possible to introduce new ideas to them slowly once you're independent. For example, once you've reached a point in your life where you could start your own business (startup/LP), and then you completely quit your job and you're financially free. Can you tell them this after you do this? That's so much more basic and easier to tell them than talking about "all religions have truth in them." Will they even understand this part? To me, this is passing through stage orange in real life. Green is if your business (startup/LP) doesn't destroy the environment and takes environment into consideration. Beyond that, you could express your spiritual path in your business (startup/LP). That will probably put your work into Tier 2. Maybe they'll notice instead of you saying it. But then, it's your choice. I always thought that showing someone is different from telling someone the whole thing at once. Those who are closed-minded get shocked for no reason, and then they react and make trouble for others.

If they are dogmatic and you feel that you're at a risk of being disowned by them, or you know they don't accept that at all, there is no need to tell them. It will just cause more trouble for you, esp when you're not independent from them yet. You run the risk of them cutting you off completely. To me, it sounds like the next step is to find your interests and become independent from them. Even if you do become independent from them, you probably don't want to tell them. What's the use if they don't accept and stuck in that mindset? (Btw, just wanted to add: If you decide to go off on your own, make sure you understand the society and culture that you're living in before making any major decisions. Most ppl have not fully transended culture.)

Hey Jude, The Beatles

I think up to stage green and not passing onto yellow, a person is capable of excessively wondering why the other person should behave "like that." Tier 2 becomes more and more balanced and put more focus on solving problems in a reasonable manner than wondering excessively about what others are doing. Tier 2 is less likely to gossip. I think eventually a person will have to evolve into Tier 2. If not, it's no fun not to even know what you want to do in life that's of higher consciousness and just wonder about other ppl without knowing them properly.