AtmanIsBrahman

I've been rewatching the Stage Red episode, trying to understand how the stage works and how it fits into spiral dynamics overall. One thing I was surprised Leo didn't mention (forgive me if I missed it) is how stage red relates to rap music. Pretty much every aspect of stage red blatantly aligns with the vibe of rap music, and I think rap provides a powerful lens for looking at the intricacies of spiral dynamics. Rap music is all about power, conquest, egocentrism, brazenness, wealth, being better than others, hating others, "beating the haters," and so on. These are my questions: 1) Why do people seem to skip stages? It seems like the most common spiral dynamics transition is stage red to stage orange. Also, the combination of red and orange seems to be very popular among hip hop stars who became successful, such as Kanye West, Lil Wayne, etc. I know that stage red --> stage blue is considered a classical transition -- somebody goes to jail and comes out as a religious fundamentalist -- but the stage red to orange transition seems just as common if not more. Could this be because the individualism of orange feels more familiar to red? 2) Why do people from higher stages such as orange like the vibe and aesthetic of hip-hop? They're definitely not working on integrating low spiral stages. But they must be aware that it's a lower stage of development, as you don't normally go shoot people and brag about it as a stage orange or above person. One possibility is that they enjoy the power fantasy and themselves aspire to wealth and power, so they can imagine themselves feeling powerful like the rapper, except through career or business rather than criminality. It may also just be that the genre is fun and people like listening to it for its unique sound. But that still wouldn't explain why the lyrics remain so blatantly stage red and don't adapt to a higher-spiral market. __________________________________________ These are just some things to think about. It seems to me like rap is a strange combination of red and orange, and it's interesting from a sociological point of view how it works. What do you think?

Of course humans don't have value. Nothing has value unless you imagine it does.

I'm not against it. The idea with this thread was just to compile information on manifestation so people can decide for themselves if it's real and try it out. If people have results and would like to share them here, please go ahead!

This is a thread -- potentially to become a megathread -- for posting resources about manifestation, magic, reality shifting, and anything similar. I will be posting videos explaining the theory behind manifestation, practical tips and tricks, scientific evidence, and testimonies. Post any high quality resources you find and would like to share. The goal here is open-minded investigation into whether manifestation is real, how to do it if it is real, and what the metaphysical implications for reality are. "Magic is the science and art of causing change to occur in conformity with will" - Aleister Crowley

I know right!! Check this one out as well

To show the positive sides of rap: This is a good example of lyricism.

I think this is a little too extreme. Yes, rap is very conformist, but it's a serious art form. Coming up with intricate lyrics and flowing over a beat is way harder than it seems from an outside perspective. There is at least intricacy and artistry to the lyrics, if not depth. Rap is also some of the best music for pumping yourself up and feeling on top of the world, which can be a good thing to experience sometimes.

I don't know but pickup is pervertry

31

I get the idea. It just sounded kind of funny, and I honestly don’t know if it’s true. How would you know if such a thing is true? A similar example he uses is that if you are worried about disaster, you are more likely to end up in a plane crash than somebody who doesn’t think about it. My question is, how would I know if this is true?

@Carl-Richard I get what you’re saying. This “Russ” thing indeed has elements of red, but not the full package. Red isn’t just about daring behaviors, it’s also about egocentrism, violence, conquest, etc. Teenagers doing crazy stuff is not stage red. About your second point, yes, I do think even young children can be stage green (in a less mature form).

Higher spiral rap is a huge untapped market.

I'm on the Balance chapter of Reality Transurfing right now. The book is a mix of good and bad. His explanation of law of attraction stuff is pretty good, and the concept of pendulums is interesting, but I think he's overly paranoid about some things. At one point he said that if you feel guilt, you are inviting punishment, so you're more likely to be attacked at bar, which felt ridiculous.

I prefer a formal style on the forum because it's more serious. I don't really try to be fun or likeable on the forum. It's more important to me to maintain the highest standard of truth and integrity.

I get what you're saying, but I think it's more complex than that. A teenager in a red society is different from a teenager in a green society, even if they are both teenagers. The red one will likely be violent, prejudiced, egoistic, and behave in other ways characteristic of red. The green one will have some egoistic tendencies, but will have some idea of the relativity of different cultures and beliefs, be tolerant of different ways of thinking, and be more open-minded. I don't think spiral dynamics stage develops as you grow older in the way you're describing. A teenager raised in a wealthy, forward-thinking Silicon Valley household, for example, is basically born into stage green. They may have some regressive behaviors, but they're definitely not red or blue at any point in their life. People seem to only increase in spiral stage if 1) they started very low or 2) they try to do so on purpose. If you start at red in American society, you're practically guaranteed to move up at some point in life assuming you don't die first. The other thing I've observed clearly is that higher education (at least in first-world countries) tends to bring people to green if they pursue it seriously enough for long enough, simply because the academic standards force people to engage in relativity. As for the yellow and above, though, it's extremely rare. Especially where I would evaluate myself as right now -- yellow moving into turquoise (with some elements of even higher stages and perhaps a slight orange shadow) -- there is basically no one at a similar stage in normal life.

Tucker is very dense and opinionated. To find out how to do not knowing, just do the polar opposite of him

hahaha same That's funny. Maybe it's because I tend to use proper grammar and write in a more formal way. I try to be a productive member of the forum, putting thought into what I say rather than posting whatever comes to mind.

I think you are biased against stage turquoise approaches to self-help. Your approach to self-help still has a lot of traces of orange. One piece of evidence for the latter is your advocacy for pickup and business, which are at their core anti-spiritual stage orange exploitation. One possible rebuttal could be that you have to integrate stage orange, but that's something you do mentally; you don't act it out. You don't need to rob a bank to integrate stage red. There should be a more conscious approach to resolving the needs that are provided for by stage orange business, pickup, and similar things. As for your bias against stage turquoise self-help, the biggest example is the idea of thoughts influencing reality or manifestation, which I have posted about. I get the sense that you immediately dismiss this because it doesn't fit with the stage orange self-help paradigm that you've invested many years in, which is understandable. But this isn't something that should be dismissed out of hand. Similarly, you have talked about how you think highly of Bashar's life purpose advice but dislike his woo-woo and UFO stuff. Here, I would ask: How do you know he's wrong about these things? Granted, maybe UFOs aren't coming within the next year, but Maybe he really is channeling an alien Maybe it is true that nothing bad can happen to you when you're following your passion (he considers this a metaphysical manifestation-principle, not just a simple self-help rule) Maybe you really are constantly shifting through realites and can pick the one you prefer This is just one example of the broader idea. I think you may not extend enough generosity to other spiritual thinkers/teachers because they haven't gone as deep into the metaphysical and intellectual side of spirituality as you, although they can still have valid insights that you might not have yourself.

https://youtu.be/104RRwAV5nE?si=LnYKvm2rgQ32QB6F A bashar video explaining how you're already manifesting your form, mental and physical, and how you can change it.

One bias is a mind- rather than heart-centered approach. The primary mode of communication is highly intellectual. There is also a lack of spiritual presence compared to teachers like Sadhguru. This might suggest that you haven’t fully embodied certain insights. Another thing is the tendency to try to appeal to non-spiritual people like scientists. It might be worth biting the bullet and accepting that they won’t like the teachings, and assuming the viewer is more spiritual and openminded.

Big Self as in God?

I've started reading the book. It's very promising.

@Leo Gura The finger pointing post reminded me, I recently had an insight that God is the only thing capable of self-reference. Of course, God is the only thing, so this is kind of redundant, but what I mean is that in some way what it means to be God is the same as what it means to do self-reference. Is this true according to your experience?

Bashar believes in manifestation fyi.

I've been contemplating the question, "Can two consciousnesses exist?" I came to the conclusion that the answer is no, and that's why solipsism is true. Here is an illustration: It's impossible for 2 consciousnesses to mutually see each other because that is just a possibility imagined by consciousness. Consciousness is imagining the two people, and it itself is neither one of them. When you're assuming that other people exist, it's because you don't know what you are. You are not the body, nor any object of sense-perception. You are nothing. As is shown in the drawing, the human "you" imagines yourself and someone else mutually seeing each other, but really there is just you seeing the other person. At first you think that "you" is your body, but the body is something that appears in consciousness, so it can't be the one that is seeing. The one that is seeing isn't the brain either, that's just more mental content. The source of seeing is NOTHING. In other words, the thing that is seeing is seeing itself. You are the SEER, and there are no other seers. If you think about it, it's obvious that the idea of two consciousnesses existing is absolutely ridiculous. What makes more sense, that there are millions of consciousnesses somehow seeing each other or that there is one seer imagining all of them? As Leo has explained, there is only one self-luminous Mind that could possibly exist. This means that when you are looking at someone in the eye, they can't actually see you. All people and things are moving sense-objects generated by your own mind, and as soon as your mind stops they will stop moving like a wind-up toy. This is why no one survives your death, as Leo has explained. When you die, all of your imaginings get taken back with you because they were never real in the first place. So being worried about anything happening after your death is delusion -- it means you still believe in an external world.