mike41

My observations: 1. Cold approaches are only cold if you can't read the room. Just observing the way a woman interacts with the world for a little bit will tell you a lot about her. The same with her clothes, her friends and the way she interacts with you. I'd argue that good PUAs do better because they are able to identify women that are interested. There's a lot going on with little glances and smiles that happen before the introduction. Try going to a busy place where pickup happens and observe the people around you. When you can identify who is into who by their interactions you'll better be able to see it when it's happening to you. 2. If the point of the interaction is to go on a date with someone then does it really matter too much how their personality is? That's a thing I sort out on a first date. I can suffer through 15 minutes of a coffee date with a woman I'm not interested in. 3. Maybe you should try a place that isn't moving so fast. It just makes things harder than it has to be in my opinion. 4. The numbers game is a reflection of your ability to find the right girl and build a bit of attraction. I tried doing pickup recently and then quit because my evenings were more like 2 girls, 2 numbers, 2 dates and one accidental pickup. It became a nonsense way to meet women because it was just too much to be useful and too little focus on screening. 5. Learn to lead in partner dance. It will teach you all about having clarity and intent with your partners. It will get you used to touching beautiful women. You can use dancing to do pickup if you like. Just don't hit on the women in your classes because you'll be seeing them for years. You can just nab girls who don't dance from the sidelines for dates. 6. 370 approaches, 16 numbers, 1 date seems rough. Counting lays as a result seems.... odd. I'm sure you learned a lot about self confidence but that's quite a grind for not much in results. You would think that after approach number 200 or so your methods would improve.

Please only answers from actually enlightened people as in: you experience the state of enlightenment on a permanent basis with little to no traces of your ego left. The lived experience of enlightenment is quite frankly so different than the rest of my life that a person along the path really holds no answers for me. Do you tell people you are enlightened? It's so difficult to explain and everyone's idea of it is so wrapped up in their own desires and ego that it seems pretty pointless to tell people. Still I feel that people close to me perhaps deserve an explanation of why I'm different? Would you tell a romantic partner? When? How do you deal with the empathy and the emotions? Perhaps it's just me because I did not develop my compassion well in my earlier years until being immersed in the world made it impossible to ignore. It's easy for me to distinguish the right course of action but the intensity of feelings is overwhelming sometimes. On the other hand I don't want it to go away either. Where do you go to meet another person who is enlightened? I'm curious to meet someone else. Do you think that enlightenment alone is sufficient for teaching in the Zen tradition or does teaching require learning a more formal system? Should I learn yoga to teach others perhaps? I'm not sure where I'm going to take all of this, it's rather new.

By that definition I am enlightened. The light stays on and it has been on for some time. What needs to go in my life is all the past habits and ways of existing that no longer serve me well. I have previously been watching them dissolve at their own pace. To be honest the experience of the awakening has been such a rush that I've just been floating. Now it's time to be more intentional with destroying my self. It's a strange experience to take large parts of your self and dump them in the trash heap without ceremony, even stranger that it's so easily done. As an example, last night I lied to my date. She asked a question that had an answer that she wouldn't like. I watched myself do it and knew that it was wrong . So this morning I had a thought about it and realized that I lied because I was trying to control the outcome. I was trying to control the outcome because I was attached to it. I was attached to the outcome because I want to be emotionally and physically close to someone. But the outcome is her choice and she deserves to be given all the best information that I can provide, even if that means she decides to choose someone else. I could have a meaningful relationship with many women. If she runs from the hills because I was truthful then there are emotional barriers in between us which defeats the point of being emotionally close. So I'll just correct my mistake the next time we are alone and if that means I'm on a new date next week with someone else, so be it.

I know what you mean. I recently started dating again and I had to immediately scrub all the old methods of dating from 15 years ago. They were just wholly unsuited to my current condition. Well I have a date in an hour anyways, better go get ready for that.

I feel like I am melting into people. Not so much for stuff like chairs. Edit: I just started reading The End of Your World and it's really explaining a lot to me. It probably contains the answers to my questions within.

Enlightenment to me means that my conscious mind is calm and quiet. I am able to see more clearly the reality around me rather than being bothered by judgements, delusions and internal motivations. I no longer feel anxiety or fear in significant amounts. I still find the occasional attachment (the last was an attachment to understanding) but they are quite easily removed. My attention has turned from inwards to outwards and I experience people in a way that is new to me. I still learn, but from practical experience. It's the same life as before but the depth of it has expanded so much that it's quite different.

@Raze Thank you, I will read those. @Razard86 I did somewhere in the middle of this thread. I don't really have a lineage or anything. The Zen books I read were very focused on gaining practical experience of your own rather than sitting around reading books. So I read for a while, took what I could understand and made my way into the world to practice the rest of it. Then honestly I forgot I was practicing or about enlightenment as a concept. So now I feel that I can teach but I have not yet obtained clarity on whether or not it's my place or if it's possible for me to do harm. There are a lot of formal systems designed to achieve the goal of enlightenment from Buddhist traditions to yoga and I thought it might make sense to learn one. Yes a good point. I did figure out the answer to my own question above. People get so worked up about the idea of enlightenment that it's best not mentioned. I put that it was useless, but really it's worse than useless, it's destructive to the conversation.

Well thank you all, this thread has answered the questions. 1) Do you tell people you are enlightened? No - at best you will experience a complete lack of understanding, at worst everyone will project their own delusions of enlightenment or it's impossibility on you. 2) Would you tell a romantic partner? When? I'll just leave that for the reason above. 3) How do you deal with the empathy and the emotions? Not really sure but I suppose I can let go of that like everything else. It's not the worst anyways. 4) Where do you go to meet another person who is enlightened? I'll just try a few places that seem likely.

Not really on topic. I do understand now why these threads never go anywhere. I'll just write a letter to somebody enlightened instead.

When I want something I just ask. Sometimes it works. I have not demanded anything of anyone. I'm certain that the answers to these questions will arrive with time but sometimes it's easier to just get a direct answer from someone who has already worked through it.

Sorry I missed that in all the junk. Enlightenment to me means that my conscious mind is calm and quiet. I am able to see more clearly the reality around me rather than being bothered by judgements, delusions and internal motivations. I no longer feel anxiety or fear in significant amounts. I still find the occasional attachment (the last was an attachment to understanding) but they are quite easily removed. My attention has turned from inwards to outwards and I experience people in a way that is new to me. I still learn, but from practical experience. It's the same life as before but the depth of it has expanded so much that it's quite different.

This thread is like posting "Hey, I'm in Indianapolis and I'm looking for a good place to eat." and then the entirety of the comments are people insisting that Indianapolis doesn't exist or that you can't possibly be in Indianapolis. What harm does it do to answer the actual question as asked even if I'm not in Indianapolis?

I don't generally. It seems like it might be handy to explain some things but then again it probably isn't any better of an explanation that something with less associated meaning. I don't feel qualified as a teacher. I just try to do what I can to help. That's a fair point I suppose. Actually it would probably be worse if she was into those things. That doesn't make any sense to me. I'm not new to the study of Zen, I'm new to being enlightened. I started working on Zen a decade ago. I was just wondering if anyone had any practical recommendations about the types of places where you might be more likely than average to come across someone else in the room that is enlightened. It's not hard to spot but you need to be near enough to see it.

My intent is to have my questions answered. If you are unwilling or unable to do so then there's no particular need to respond.

OK

Sure, it's just not useful to me.

That wasn't an answer to any of my questions.

I hate to break it to you, but your girlfriend is in stage red. This is coming from a guy who's wife is in stage red. > For instance, we have a conflict and I say "Ok, I realize I did this and that etc and I am sorry" while she just goes into accusations towards me and refuses to take responsibility for her actions. Conflict is personal.. yup. > or us right now it looks like a constant strech-relax cycle. Things seem fine for a while but I realize more and more that they are not. Every month or so there is a situation where conflict happens and the tensions discharge. Then I see what things she has been holding back in the phase before. But the core issues are not sufficiently resolved. And the cycle begins again... Classic red relationship cycle. You push real hard on point X, she concedes, she minds her P's and Q's for a month and then goes right back to where she was when you've forgotten about it. She hasn't budged an inch but now you are a month later in the exact same spot. She wins. > In this moment, her whole mood changed. All the easiness, calmness and balance from the retreat went away in one instant. There was an energy as if you blow air into the embers of a fire. She looked at me with fiery eyes, her tone became sharp and she said "But if there is something that makes me feel bad, I will not tolerate it! You poked her world view, the red came back out. Alternatively she may have absorbed the retreat in stage Blue fashion (quite literally) and retreated to stage Red when provoked. > "She also experience things that challenges her beliefs as personal attacks" Yep... red > She is also very provocative. Testing the limit of how far she can go. Quite cute when it's playful, but she very often crosses the line and goes beyond what she knows is considered as respectful by me. What you make of that? What is your advice how to handle it? This is classic red. > Father seemed to be a narcissist, or at least some narcissistic tendencies. Very impulsive behavior so that the kids had to watch out every moment to not do anything wrong Dad was clear stage red. You have multiple things working against you seeing this situation for what it is - Projection - you want to believe that others are more aware than they are because it fits your world view Deception - Red is level where manipulation and blending in and subtly getting your way are the highest skills possible. Your gf is an expert at repeating back to you what you want to hear. And you are quite willing to believe it. Unfamiliarity - If you grew up in a family that was Blue or better you may not have been exposed to adult Red personalities. Tough to see if you've never seen it but once you start connecting the dots it's easy to spot. Denial - You really want your gf to be more aware than she is because you like her. If you disagree that she is stage red, consider this - has she really demonstrated qualities of blue, orange or green beyond the trivial? Are there rules and principles she lives her life by? Is she thinking hard about how to make life better? Are there causes she puts time and effort into?