Tenebroso

You don't need to have your shit together to get laid. You just need to be sexy enough at the right time to a particular women. Some men are luckier than others and some men will never be sexy enough for any woman.

@Princess Arabia Ok well let's agree to disagree. I will stop responding to your post for the foreseeable future, I don't enjoy antagonizing people when it is not my intention at all.

Toxic and healthy is a false dichotomy.

The bolded. I felt all of these had a harsh, aggressive tone. There seems to be an emphasis on disgust. I feel this is insensitive to trauma and how it influences a person perception. Everybody is dealing with something maybe not everyone is as open about me but it is not a reason to be dismissive. I do post on other sections not anywhere as much on this section but I feel that is necessary. I am allowed to have a particular interest in a specific section. Maybe it's an area where I need to develop and work things out. A more immature young man would take this comment and run away to some forum or discord server where there is no one to challenge his views. I don't like echo chambers, I like being challenged but it should be respectful. I made the point about spirituality because often the response on many topics comes down to essentially everything is about love, self awareness and doing the work but on the topic of dating dynamics specifically the tone is completely different. It feels as if I don't agree exactly with what is said about women I am on the verge of being insulted. Yes it's not exactly what you said here but an overall pattern which implies that I should know my place.

@Princess Arabia I think I deserve an apology. There is a vast difference in my tone towards you and your tone towards me.

So are you just being joyfully mean now? Again I have never said anything personal in all our discussions. I don't understand what you get out of responding to me like this with such venom. I feel like you are maybe channeling your frustrations with men and what others have said about you into your responses to me because these responses seem out of place for what we were discussing.

Tale about Jazz. Talking about the fact that I am responding while relaxed listening to music is a tale. Why do I trigger all of you so much? I don't really get it. I am not elevating my credibility. I am listening to my favourite genre of music while I responding, it's that simple. Nobody's views are 100% based on fact and reality. Everything is coloured by perception to some extent and I simply sharing mine with no personal insults. It is very hurtful to be treated like this by people I have either interacted with respectfully for long periods of time or by people I have barely interacted with.

@Princess Arabia That's fine if you don't want to respond or interact with me anymore. However, I don't think it's necessary to be so personal. In all our discussions and disagreements I have never once insulted you or judged you sexually. I am simply defend my views but it seems simply disagreeing leads to vilification that to me seems beyond necessary. Writing about my scars is uncalled for. If I wrote like this I would receive a warning. Even if I am stubbornly disagreeing, I am always measured and respectful in my post. Far worst is said on this forum with less decorum and respect. There is a lot of talk about needing to be more vulnerable and open up about their experiences but look what happens when you do that, it is used against you. Supposedly women are better communicators and more emotionally intelligent but these response don't indicate that. There is nothing enlightened or evolved about these responses to my post. A trend I have noticed is people who think they have reached a certain level of spiritual and emotional development look down on others and treat people who disagree with them with contempt. Maybe my views and observations are related to my stage of self development and your views are related to your stage of development but nothing I have ever said warrants that response. I think you should apologise but I don't expect it because I sense you think I am beneath you.

Interesting that sharing my views triggers people so much. I don't make personal insults or comments, I am never vulgar and I don't dismiss the experiences of other people. I simply challenge mainstream perspectives and defend my observations stubbornly perhaps. I never write what I write with venom. I am not in my mother's basement seething, I am listening to Jazz music and creating a new vision board. It seems not agreeing with the status quo really hurts people. It is what it is.

Women are just as shallow after their 20s. It is a myth that they stop chasing hot, emotionally unavailable men. If anything their standards become even harsher. Men never become equally attractive to women at any age.

Women get the ick from attractive men. An attractive man and an unattractive man could have the exact same habits and the unattractive man will give women the ick while the same habit in an attractive man will be seen as cute or quirky instead of putting. The sexiness of a man is more important than his behaviour. If a man is sexy his flaws are accepted if a man is unattractive his flaws give the ick. There is a big difference.

Again I think this is a myth. Women in their 30s and 40s are just as attracted to hot, emotional unavailable men as younger women. Maybe in the past when women had less freedom they would grow to appreciate more stable men as they aged. However, today women have never been more free to center their true desires and I think we are seeing that women are just as sexual as men if not more but just for a small percentage of men.

I am saying women do not care about those things. My hypotheses is that women are more shallow than men.

@Natasha Tori Maru I don't know if I would say men are victims. I don't think women are actually doing anything wrong to men. Men are not entitled to anything and I would not turn back the clock to restrict female freedom. That isn't the right solution. However my issue is with the discourse around dating which presents women as having a kind of attraction which is more complicated and takes into account thing beyond the physical etc kindness, humour, intelligence etc....... What we thought once about female nature was based on an epoch where the true desires of women were restricted due to patriarchy, religion, socio-economic forces. Now that women are free at least in the west, we see that women are just as lustful and sexually driven as men if not more but importantly just for a minority of men. There are plenty of stats that support my views but more importantly observing what women say but watching what they do and who they choose repeatedly. I have attractive friends and live in a diverse major city. I know the experiences of my attractive friends are true because I have lived with some of them and know what happens behind closed doors. More women are in some kind of relationship than men, despite there being an almost equal number of men and women, why? because the most attractive men are often involved with multiple women, they have so many option that they have no incentive to settle down. Sometimes they are honest, sometimes they are not, so some women think they are in a committed relationship while the guy see her as just another option. There is a lot of discussion around single mothers. Women say well it takes to two people to make a child they are right but what they don't acknowledge is that a small percentage of men have multiple kids with multiple women out of wedlock yet women will continue choosing those men anyway. Most men are not out there creating single mothers. A small percentage of men out there cause so much damage because women find them so attractive that they never have any incentive to change or become better which reveals that character, virtue and all these qualities women claim are important are in fact not important. If a man is attractive enough all red flags go out of the window.

In 2025 men are not the gatekeepers of anything. A small percentage of men may have some influence over relationships because they are the men that women want. My point is that the fact men are attracted to way more women than women are to men, means nothing because for most men the women you are attracted to have zero interest in you, so those options mean nothing. Also women sexual desire is not as complicated as people make out it's just that so few men can trigger that raw sexual sexual attraction in women. Other qualities do not in fact have much influence in making a woman attracted to a man; kindness, humour, intelligence etc It is a myth. If women cared about these things, we would see a much wider spectrum of men doing well with women. That is not what is happening, there is a vast difference in the experiences of men. Some men attract nobody regardless of all their positive qualities while some men attract thousands of women. Women today complain about narcissistic players who lie and manipulate them yet these men are always chosen by women regardless of their reputation, why? because they are attractive and the type for many women.

I am sure I could have a great time if I woke up a billionaire. There is a long list of things I could do and acquire but then there is reality. The fact that I could enjoy sex and abundance with women if I could, means nothing basically. You are either that guy or you are not. Finding that one man she enjoys having sex with is a better problem to have than hoping that a woman will give you the time of day to just talk. A date is an achievement for a man.

"All it takes for most men to WANT to have sex with a woman is her appearance. For most women, it takes more than a physical appearance to WANT to have sex with a man; but not just that, even if she wants to, it doesn't mean she'll go ahead and do it" FALSE. Physical appearance is enough for most women. It is a myth that women are not influenced by lust and desire as much as men. If a man is physically attractive enough, women will sleep with him very quickly without getting to know him. I have seen it with my friends time and time again. "Females have more men hitting on them, yes, than women hitting on men but not many she would actually want to, or have sex with. Wanting sex for us doesn't just come from feeling horny, but with a specific type of guy. A woman can have sex with someone she's not physically attracted to just like men, but a man will do it purely for physical reasons while a woman, in this case, it would be circumstantial. A man could be horny, and if an attractive woman hits on him, and is willing to sleep with him, more than likely he'd go, especially if he's single. For a horny woman, that takes more than just a guy hitting on her, physically attractive to her or not." Yes a woman has to be horny and in the right mood, phase of her life. That is a difference between men and women but if she is in that receptive state physical attraction is going to be the reason why she does it. Women are not having circumstantial sex with men because he is funny, charming, kind whatever.....even young women today are explicit in their disgust for ugly men. The fact she is horny and willing does not change that. Maybe 20 or 30 years ago an ugly man could use his personality and good timing to get sex but not anymore. Why would give these men a chance when a physically attractive man is in their DMs. Women already have attractive men as fuck buddies whenever they need to scratch that itch. "So no, women don't have more options for sex preferences - men do. Going out the door and having multiple guys hitting on me DOES mean I'll have more options for sex, but it DOESN'T mean my preferences are abundant. Sex for most women is different than what it is for men, please understand that. MEN WILL FIND MORE WOMEN THEY'D SLEEP WITH THAN WOMEN WITH MEN." Wrong, emphatically wrong. Men have more options for sex preferences is another way of saying that men do not have high standards for arousal but that is null and void because most of those women are not interested. Sex is not as different for women and men as people think. Women would like to pretend their attraction is more complexed and nuanced.......it's not, sorry. The truth so few men trigger that raw lust that women don't seem as sexual as men. With the most attractive men female lust is is even more potent and animalistic than men's sexuality. I have very attractive friends; male models, athletes, drug dealers.......I know what they are doing with women. Women who present a reserved, complexed face to the world but are completely different behind closed doors. Men finding more women they'd sleep with means nothing if those women have zero interest. It's like making a list of things I would like to acquire if I became a Billionaire tomorrow. Don't you get it distinguishing sexual preferences and options means nothing because those preferences for men are not true options. Women don't even want to be the preference for most men. "This is not about status, wealth, attractiveness, competence, confidence, security, etc. either, just in general. All a man needs is for her to be his type, and sometimes not, and he's willing if he's single and looking and sometimes not also. Women aren't generally out looking for strange men just to have sex with, so her options are limited in that way. Men aren't out approaching lots of women just to go have coffee or tea." Sorry but this is where you show your privilege and lack of understand of how difficult it is to date as a man. All a man needs is for her to be his type but many men like myself are nobodies type. A small percentage of men are lucky enough to be the type to many women. It takes an incredible stroke of luck if you are obviously not very attractive to be a woman's exact type. Men are not approaching women because most women are not receptive to being approached. Women have made it clear over the last decade that they want the vast majority of men to leave them alone.

@Princess Arabia Ok. I will quote and reply directly to the OP to point where you are wrong.

I am not mad at the world, if I was I would hurt people which I would never do. I am mad at myself for not being good enough. Life is not worth it at all as an unattractive man. Genuinely getting to know women makes little to no difference if they are not attracted to. It is a myth that you can make a women interested slowly over time especially in this era where her emotional needs can be met in other ways. If you are not sexy you don't get a shot. Women don't care about how smart, kind, funny, emotionally available you are.......men without these qualities have never been more popular because they have the right look. I have never been on a date or had a girlfriend you must be confusing me with another person.

You take for granted that every man is some woman's type. What if you are no woman's type? If dating worked the way you and many women present it then attraction would be evenly distributed and every man would have some kind of love life but that is not what is happening is it. Instead we have a dating scene where young women are involved in these long term situationships with players who lie, manipulate and offer no emotional availability. Why do women engage with these men? because those men fit into the very narrow harsh standards of attraction for modern men. Most men do not fit that and wil not be anyone's type and have little control over how much sex they can have.

Women's options are limited because most men are not attractive enough. Men do not have more options because they are attracted to more women, because those options don't care that you exist and would puke at the thought at being intimate with you.

I think you are trolling. If men have more options because they are attracted to more women but those women have zero interest in you and even find you repulsive, then those options mean nothing. The fact that a man is aroused by so many women and expected to approach means nothing for the majority of men. The end result either way is nothing happening because the woman is not interested.

Not only are you wrong but most young women today would disagree with you. Young women have never been more brutally honest in how they feel about most men. We are ugly and repulsive the women of our generations and the days of compensating with money or personality is over. Women have their own money now and get their emotional needs met through their friendships. So the only use for men is sex, lust and desire and for that only a very small percentage of men qualify. If you are not one of those men your desires mean nothing, they are a burden to women. Marriage rates have drooped because the days of women settling for average men who are not sexy but stable and nice are over. This is the reality.

Funny that you mention nightclubs because it's known in that the world that nightlife is dying because men have stopped going because there is no point. Women have zero interest in 99% of men they meet at a nightclub. Those days are over. I go out all the time and I see much older couples but young people are either alone or with friend groups if it's a young couple it is always tall, attractive man with average woman. I never see the unattractive man with attractive woman thing people talk about.

Most men do not have options for sex. I live in a city of 10 million people. This weekend I can't snap my fingers and decide to have sex, the fact that I am attracted to many women means nothing. They are not real options because pretty much all of them will not not be attracted to me.