Tenebroso

@Salvijus My articulation is fine, don't need your approval. Again, keep it moving, won't respond to you again, pretend I don't exist.

@CARDOZZO A human's individual development does not take place in a vacuum, there is always a feedback loop the individual and the social conditions of the particular epoch they live in. I do not believe the current conditions of our civilization require men to 'love' women more. Sure, get in touch with your own inner feminine, understand your shadow, face your subconscious but as I have already said young men today especially in the west have already been raised to place women on a pedestal and it only leads to resentment, since you cannot control the outcome of the other. True love comes from a position of strength which most men are lacking today. Men are listless, confused, indecisive they are not grounded enough to truly love, messages like the one from the book you are quoting sound good on paper but won't help. The modern young women as a vessel would not know how to receive such a man.

@Salvijus Whatever bro, keep it moving.

Going to be brutally honest. This is straight garbage that would lead young men into an even deeper hole than they are in already. The feminine is not that special period.

They want physically attractive men who also have some kind of social power in a context relevant to them and their interest. If women did not care about physical attractiveness, paternity fraud would not exist, genetic fitness is very important to women but they evolved to conceal their true sexuality and the most genetically fit (attractive men) are not always the most socially acceptable.

@NoSelfSelf I agree love between a man and woman is possible but you shouldn't seek or yearn for it as a man. Dedicate yourself to a cause, craft or ideal. If love appears great, if not even better but loving women beyond having the basic respect for another human being is another trap and red herring for men. I would go as far as saying the obsession with loving and possessing women actually causes more misogyny than a respectful indifference. If you build up the feminine to be this thing which must be cherished and adored it will trigger anger in you if does not respond in the way you wish. Young men don't need to love women more, they need to let go of women, let go of any expectations of them, give them space.....

Loving women has nothing to do with attracting them. If women feel misogyny very easily, how do they end up with abusers, murderers, all round terrible men so frequently. Actually the more amoral a man, the less likely he is to have trouble attracting women. If incels were as bad as people make them out to be ironically they would have no trouble attracting women, the truth is that unattractive men are vilified to justify the instinctual repulsion towards them.

Why is it actually dangerous, creepy are not detected by female intuition. These kinds of men seem to have a never ending trail of women who trusted them, while a regular man maybe a bit anxious is creepy. Isn't something broken there?

I would say to the OP don't worry about it, it's not in your hands. As you get older as a guy you develop your own intuition for when someone is really receptive to you, it's unmistakable and once you experience that you don't even acknowledge or really interact with the closed off women.

Interesting that the actually dangerous men seem to consistently surpass the feminine intuition and boundaries, while more self conscious harmless men come across as creepy.

I don't think new age women are any less narcissistic in this era. Modern life encourages a toxic relating style and overpowers any apparent self-development. The most narcissistic men do the best with women all types of women including new age types.

Put morality aside and the self image of being a nice good person, it means very little. Focus on attaining inner clarity and finding a way to express your inner work outwardly.

Most men are invisible to women, they don't really see you, you either blend in or don't exist.

@mr_engineer Great response although I fear we may be too far gone collectively.

@Amit Not being able to vote, have a bank account, being ostracised by a certain age for not being attached. Social structures that ensured dependence on men and allowed many men who naturally wouldn't attract women to have wives and families. Now with those barriers removed we see women find the vast majority of most men unattractive on all levels, even money and status are not as powerful anymore they don't overpower instinctive repulsion in women who have a choice and can make their own money.

I would say your instincts are actually right counter to most responses in this thread but you would develop a healthier understanding if you actually had a couple of relationships. However, it's true for the vast majority of men the juice is not worth the squeeze. The anomaly in social dynamics that the industrial revolution produced fooled all men into thinking they should and would have a mate for just existing. There are healthy paths you can take while decentering romantic relationships and women. However you must be radically honest with yourself.

Like many men today you need to develop an identity outside of women and sex. Most men are not meant to do well with women, it's not an accident that so many men struggle when the artificial barriers placed on women are removed.

It's not in your hands stop worrying about it.

It can be. It depends on who you are, the women you attract and the layers of desire you are able arouse in the women involved with you.

The women are the same in other countries they just don't have the economic means to behave as western women do. You see true female nature when a woman has some level of economic and cultural freedom. I am glad I was born and raised in contemporary western society instead of some 1950s idyll rooted in a historical anomaly. The fantasy of obedient, submissive women was always just a fantasy that is not who women are. Women lie, fight, steal, deceive just as men do just in different ways. Men are seeing real female nature for what is and are repelled but I see it as a gift. I won't denigrate the so called 'passport bros' but I prefer the challenge of dealing with liberated, complicated modern women in hyper competitive major cities there is great opportunity on both sides if you are open to it.

Men seem to be hellbent on destroying their lives in the name of being one of the so called 'good men' not understanding that the goalpost for what a good man is are constantly shifting. You owe nobody anything, put your self respect first in all situations. Everyone grows at a different pace but I feel men are being gaslighted, enlightenment and growth is not accepting deceit and disrespect wake up.

Zero tolerance regardless of the reason, I don't understand men who stay.

You could but you would need a shift in mindset and self-image that you can't fake. I know a solicitor dating a low level corner drug dealer.

@mr_engineer Good point about 'good girls'. They are often hypocritical and repressed and actually the cause of a lot of the confusion in the dating game. More interested in preserving a certain self image than connecting.

Psychological health is a dynamic spectrum there is no precise finishing line to self development and there is often a discrepancy between who a person thinks they are and what they actually respond to. All humans have the capacity to be intuitive. This idea that women even the most developed possess an intuition that enables them to identify and avoid toxic individuals does not seem to match the reality of what is actually happening day to day. What is true is that negative assumptions are made about unattractive men before they even have a chance to show their personality and positive quality. While they seem to miss red flags in attractive men. So this 'intuition' seems to exist to filter unattractive men out of the dating pool and then to justify this filtering undesirable men are vilified e.g "you are not really nice", "it's your personality, "your a horrible person, women can tell" etc On a macro level perception of beauty is not very subjective. Modern dating would look very different if women actually chose men based on whether she feels safe, loved, protected, sexy, and feminine in his presence. The majority of women are attracted to a minority of men, the stark difference between the love lives of the most sexually/romantically successful men is not due to maturity, kindness and all the supposed qualities that don't really come into play realistically until you are actually in a relationship. I don't think men should do nothing and harbor bitterness towards women for the rest of their lives. Women don't really need men today they can have successful, productive lives and even have children all without the involvement of a man. So primal attraction has become the most important factor to whether two people will become involved with each other, most men without the artificial framework that patriarchy provided do not have the natural desirability to really have a chance . On a macro level the masculine is being to challenged to reevaluate it's role. I believe many men who are struggling are not far away from being able to have great love lives, with minor adjustments in grooming, perspective, style etc they can do well. Unfortunately a large number of men way more than it is comfortable to admit do not have a chance and lying to them only creates more resent and bitterness. There are other ways to live fulfilling lives we have calculus and the sistine chapel because of men who completely devoted themselves to their art/craft. So each individual man has to take honest inventory of himself with unflinching honesty, ask himself "who am I", what do I want", "What has been the pattern of my life up to this point" and "what can I control" Men are absolutely not entitled to hot chicks nor do the vast majority feel they are entitled to hot chicks, this is a big myth and I have to say it is borderline gaslighting used to shut down conversation. The quiet plain girl down the road and the shy girl in the library are just as unreachable for most men as a supermodel there is little discernible difference. This is one of the most hurtful myths, the vast majority of men struggling are not where they are because they are chasing Bella Hadid wannabes it is a terrible lie that has to stop, regular women get attention but it is not the attention they want from the top men. They consider men on their level invisible. I agree men are not victims but they are absolutely being lied to and gaslighted. It is easy to speak of not seeking validation from sex if you have never dealt with constant rejection and shaming before you even reach adulthood. The essence of human beings is not a house with separate rooms isolated from each other figuratively speaking, every room of our essence is connected to the other there is no separation so while sexuality does not account for the overall well being and development of a person it is as vital as the psychological and emotional parts of ourselves and there is a constant feedback loop. True development does not really take place until sexuality is integrated and that is not done by ignoring it. To say it is just about validating masculinity is dismissive and not even close to the angle I am coming from. Most men I have to reiterate are not where they are because of a yearning for attractive individuals, the dating game is brutal for most men and most are bought down to earth very quickly. I agree a spiritual ego is not good but we are not really talking about that, most men have not reached the level of development to even have a spiritual ego. I have never met a man with a big ego who struggles with women whether that is a spiritual ego, an ego based on status, wealth looks etc A big ego healthy or not does not impede on a man's romantic success with 'psychologically healthy' or unhealthy women. If spiritual ego is so bad then why do women fall in love with cult leaders? I agree in the value and importance of all those practices you listed. Yes personal growth and developing a relationship with source are very important no disagreement there. I find the idea of "true spirituality" dubious. I think presence and objectivity are more important than humility or arrogance there are seasons in an individual's life where humility is necessary and there are seasons where a bit of arrogance is necessary, perhaps to complete an unlikely career move, go for that high qualification job despite not having all the credentials etc I don't think it is healthy to be an absolutist when it comes to humility. Again who decides what true spirituality is whether or not it is coming from a genuine place. A persons own true motivations can often be a mystery to themselves, life is inherently mysterious we don't always have the answers. Again with this myth women "featured in every magazine, porn, in nightclubs" such an helpful trope with little relationship with reality. When men are resentful and bitter it is not because they cannot attract a Claudia Schiffer clone, their favourite pornstar or the bombshell in the nightclubs, it is regular everyday women who reject these men and frankly feel above these men. The average man does not reach 30 years old without having a brutal reality check on what is possible for him. I don't believe there is someone for everyone, life is not fair. A person may develop spiritually and psychologically and attract nothing. For men particularly it actually might get more difficult the more conscious, aware and evolved you are. If there is such thing as an authentic self in other words a soul, an essence then it's primary task is to experience and learn and that may mean doing unexpected things including pursuing situations and people who on the surface level are not healthy so this idea that so called genuine spirituality magnetises the authentic selves of compatible people to each other is misguided in my opinion. There are many layers to a human being and the different parts of ourselves often have competing intentions i.e our sexual self might want something different from our psychological and/or emotional self, the old brain (amygdala) is in constant battle with the new brain (pre-fontal cortex).