eos_nyxia

"The Fool" is the first tarot card in the major arcana for a reason, thematically speaking.

@bebotalk Many people never get to this point you described at all, which is a sort of cognitive empathy. (Which may or may not be accompanied by the classic "feeler" empathy!) People are people are people. Sometimes hardship and adversity become an opportunity to expand one's perspective and build character and fortitude, no matter what the hardship is. Sometimes people instead succumb to bitterness and cling to their dogma and all their preconceptions and "truths" for dear life. Some people have so little empathy of any sort that it is inconceivable that any experience could or would be worse than their experience, or experience which is categorically enough like their own experience. Like what do you even say to a bunch of dudes who think that being rejected or ignored by women (whether imaginary or actual rejection) is on par with being SA'd by your family members, or think that any of the issues you mentioned are nonexistent because apparently being "hot" magically fixes everything?? Their world is tiny, constrictive, and goes about as far as their imagination reaches. And yet, the suffering is real enough. I would not mock or pity people simply for suffering, but everyone makes at least some choices in response to truly uncontrollable factors and unfavourable odds. For loud and proud (?) self-identified incels: it's hard to help people who aren't willing to accept help, or do not recognize the "help" as being such. People will defend their right to be stubborn, etc. They certainly don't want my "help" as a woman, unless by "help" they mean "engaging in their self-hating echo chamber".

You could just be grateful that there are women who are not as superficial as you might be in their situation, haha.

I used to be pretty nice to people who approached me to talk to me randomly, even if I had no interest in them and their motives were transparent enough. I consider this to be an act of grace and openness since: 1) attention is not owed just because you think it is, and modern "first world" societies tend to be emotionally closed to strangers and insular. Is it emotionally healthy for human beings overall? Probably not. 2) I don't want anything in that way from people who approach me, especially now more than ever. But I'm also "old" whether I look it or not, so I think I deserve a break, lol.... But surely, it's not that hard to put yourself in someone else's shoes and to see why having a rando treat you as a sex ATM, "nice" or not, is not of great interest to many people. Especially if these people are just going about their business in their day-to-day lives. Sorry that you're not getting your needs and desires met.

There are often a lot of undersides to porn use, in the same way that there are undersides to sexuality in general. We humans tend to have a lot of undigested baggage about it, both directly inherited and self-perpetuated. If you look at porn, and you have unprocessed feelings about it that you aren't cognisant of and are not being processed, you'll experience blowback. If it's been used as an automatic substitute for human "love", attention, and affirmation as a human being, then there will be negative results. Maybe there is something that doesn't quite sit right about whatever you're watching where it doesn't completely pass the vibe check, so in reality, you're of split mind with what you're watching. Like you have separate "selves" which are clashing. Maybe what you're watching is too violent, too acted... and too unaesthetic. I suspect this is actually quite common with men. Not everyone feels good about watching brutal naked theatre, especially if you're telling yourself that it's Real somehow. Inherited morality (which is often Pavlovian and runs on shame/ guilt and the idea of "control") tends to create this split by default, but maybe what you're watching is not what you want to define your values, ethics, and experience as a human being on some level anyway. Or maybe it just doesn't mesh with your other values. There is where you have to be really, really honest with yourself to see the truth clearly. At the very least, you're using your sexual energy and the power of your focus to inadvertently reaffirm that of which you are not wholly aware. If there are unintended consequences that you didn't originally plan for or anticipate, that is the proof. If you simply see it for what it is, no more and no less, it's either not likely to negatively affect you or else it will be in plain view. You can simply take it and then leave it there afterward. On top of that, lots of people are apparently growing up using porn as sex education starting from a very young age. I've heard that this has had some deranged results in heterosexual relationships and messes with people's expectations. I really do not envy what younger women have to deal with. Real, mutually fulfilling sexuality runs on things such as openness (of the senses, and being open emotionally) and the willingness to listen and be fully present with who you're with. Think of yourself as a blank but eager slate. Another person is not, first and foremost, an extension of your fantasy narratives inside your head which has been fed by porn (and possibly even previous partners), and tons of people are just negligent sexually, emotionally, and otherwise, which in the long run is NOT a recipe for fulfillment. Pornography, at least how it presents itself presently in this culture; it's not a great value system. It's not even much of a substitute for a value system though it often seems to function as one. If you look to it for meaning and to nurture the human spirit.... well, take a look around and see what that does. You have to put "good spirit" into sex and sexual depictions or else there is really not much emotional sustenance there by default.

This whole thread is perplexing. What's the payoff for starting it, and what purpose was it supposed to serve? Haha.

I used to answer this question one of three ways, but I haven't been asked this in a while anyway. If I'm feeling neutral and open to having a conversation, or I'm talking to a certain kind of open-minded person from a 1st world country, I'd say: "I'm spiritual but not religious". If I'm not feeling like conversation or opening a can of worms and potentially dealing with conflict or other draining and time consuming things, I'll say: "..... I'm nothing." (And if asked: you mean like, you're atheist or agnostic?" ME: "no... literally. I'm just nothing." (I believe that all beliefs and perspectives are generative rather than intrinsic, and are as flexible and rigid as you can make them to be.) If I'm feeling like defining myself by descriptive -isms, I'll probably say that I'm a secular occultist (describes the practical and ritualistic aspect) and pantheist (describes my worldview, perspective, and attitude).

I’ve been observing this thread for a while. For these conversations, it would be convenient if there was a sidebar or some indicator of people’s backgrounds which makes their skin in the game obvious. For example: Are your spouse, children, and friends Israeli or Palestinian? Are you Israeli or Palestinian, or more aligned with one side or the other due to shared cultural or religious reasons? Did you have formative experiences with either group which intrinsically predisposes you toward taking one side or the other? What sort of educational system and values were you exposed to as a minor, or even in higher education? Where did your set of geopolitical biases come from, and as a result of what formative factors? Who are you most loyal to, basically, and who and what will you bend for? (As one way or another, people tend to wrap their logic around their feels first in order to dress up their convictions, and not the other way around. “Logic” or “facts” is not much of a frame or skeleton for anything.) It would save other people some time and energy figuring out if people are dropping “facts” while also actually being able to have a good-faith conversation, if it is somehow not already obvious from the way people speak. (Mostly it is obvious, IMO.) It would also make it easier for people to have meta-conversations about what all of this means.

This is a fun challenge! I'll bite. (I think there are online travel trackers you can use too, though I haven't found a good one yet.)

@Julian gabriel Everything gets easier when you don't take on the collective zeitgeist of a space, even if it's a limited aspect of that space. Of course, not being here as frequently makes things easier too.

Hey now. What's the point of being extremely efficient and effective with your time and energy if you don't have at least a little extra of it to piss away somewhere?

I don't think they need people (or countries, or institutions) against them to dig a hole for themselves at this point. Even if many are helping them and justify their actions near-unconditionally. They'll do it themselves. Their cultural psyche will be their downfall. So I guess I'm going to just sit around here and watch it happen.

Well, it looks like the gloves and pretense of civility have finally come off. It's in these moments of crises where people feel threatened that you see an essential aspect of what people are truly made of and what they value. Or at the very least, what they're willing to excuse, and what they really call truth -- their bottom line.

If people read more history or talked to more people who had suffered brutal serious systematic trauma at a macro level (as opposed to just as an individual), would they still react and feel in this way? Like... "innocence lost"? Sometimes I guess I don't understand. Some of us know that the world has always been this way. Not just "knowing" on an intellectual level, but felt it too on an intuitive level. It's just a part of the truth of who we are as humanity, right here and right now.

Excuse my ignorance, I wasn't following the Palestine-Israel situation before recently too closely or participating in these types of dialogues. Do you mean that the state of Israel exists at all as a settler colonialist state? What can feasibly be done about what's already been done at this point? Someone's going to have to give up some claim to land somewhere. It's just a matter of scale and degree. On an emotional and psychological level, perhaps at some point, we can all prioritize stopping the playing of zero-sum games when it comes to physical things, whether it involves our survival or not. If you can choose to do this at your weakest, most emotional, most vulnerable moment, even if it's simply to decide on some level: I've had enough of the way this makes me feel and how it defines my experience.... you are extremely powerful and you have an immense amount of self-restraint. People apparently think of this as superhuman or something, I guess. Realistically speaking, and not just in worldwide conflicts that involve large groups of people, but also on the individual level: perpetrators and invaders end up getting more, and people who get invaded and violated lose more. Even long after the original violation has occurred. That's how systemic oppression tends to work. Perps and invadors tend to be blind by default to the opposite side. And realistically speaking, often the invaded person (or people) have to give up the right to conflict and ownership (at least temporarily, at least in some way) without somehow being completely and utterly disempowered and defeated in the process. Disempowered people unfortunately tend to get stepped on by default. Privileged people COULD give it up, but rarely will unless you convince them that somehow something is fundamentally in it for them. You have to sell them sugar rather than offering acid and spice, etc. Such is humanity. On a purely personal level: I both empathize and find it understandable, but I also think the attachment, self-identification, and entitlement to specific bits of land is a bit mindboggling. Which is why I sometimes feel like monoethnic/ monoculturally identifying people are going to be death of all of us, lol. You don't own land and you don't own the Earth, at least no more than it also "owns" you. It doesn't intrinsically belong to you. Not in that tight-fisted way. It's not your God-given right as a human being, not from some "God" or from some religious or cultural prerogative or doctrine. It is a space on a planet that is so graciously hosting your body and human experience right now for a rather short period of time. You may identify with it and you may live in wholly, but it does not strictly belong to you and whoever you designate as being "enough like you".

Maybe she's just talking about vocal people on social media rather than the actions of the Israeli government? I have seen Israelis on social media doing what basically amounts to this, in their state of hurt, anger, and fear. Their mind is only for their own (which is understandable) and convincing others to side with them in an extremely polarizing way: you're either with us and agree with everything we say, or you're pro-terrorism. I don't think that they particularly give a shit about any Palestinians at this point. Perhaps they once truly did, perhaps not, but clearly not anymore. The opposite has been true too for the other side though....

Personally, I tend to separate the need to defend oneself from the sort of endless moral justification and brigading that tends to go on when people are rationalizing their actions, and trying to feel good (or as good as possible) about playing their zero-sum games. Because hey, survival is involved. There may or may not be other options, especially when it feels like your back is against the wall. Like, if someone is actively trying to kill you (like they're physically coming at you), and then you kill or maim them, yea. That's undeniably self-defense regardless of history. (Or say someone is trying to rape you also kill or maim them.) You were, in fact, actually defending yourself. It can be seen as a pragmatic thing (even if it is an unfortunate and far less-than-ideal). Adding extra rationalizations on top of the sheer survival need to defend yourself, that's strictly on you. If you pre-emptively harm people in self-defense... even if the risk and response to your life are arguably justifiable.... you're still killing people. You're supporting the killing of people, including "innocent civilians", children, etc. Even if the deaths are actually accidental or not intended. Death is still death, if you actually care about that. I guess it really rubs me the wrong way when people deflect from this truth. Yes, you're endorsing death and suffering to preserve yourself. Be honest about it and don't deflect from it, don't avoid it, and don't douse it in layers and layers of moralism and justifications in order to deflect. You're also basically having other people do your dirty killing work for you, and then parading around on your moral high horse as if you have clean hands. Ick. The blood is there on your hands one way or another, you being a part of that collective and also choosing to co-opt into it, despite your motivations, morals and values. Even if you're just nicely supporting the IDF and the state of Israel's action.... Death happened. You supported it for whatever reason that you did. Deal with it.... This is straight-up just sick. They're the mirror half of the people on the other side doing the same thing.

As someone who has generally preferred to avoid the circularity of most political discourse (but who is now trying to make sense of what's going on ATM), I really appreciated the thoughtfulness and compassionate nature of this take, including the willingness to look at the bigger picture and to see and feel the pain of the other side in the most direct of ways, and taking pains to understand why people have become as violent and desperate as they have. Hats off to him for putting in the work, being willing to change and to grow, and breaking the cycle on a personal, emotional level, and at the level of perspective.

It's always the dudes having a woke competition too (either with others, or themselves). They always need to be the best, or declare themselves the best, or whatever. Probably couldn't even keep their mouths shut if their lives depended on it (like the OG JC). When are they gonna understand that it's not their era anymore? It's done already?

Relevant Bill Hicks quote: It's always the basic choice.

Some men's willingness to follow, go to bat, and even be cannon fodder for some person who pretty openly does not care about anyone other than himself at the end of the day, who'd throw you to the wolves... that's beyond me. And then to think of yourself as a boss afterward, because at least you're better than women? At least you're doing something more with your life now. When you're a peon. A follower. A grunt. To him, you're just there for your wallet and to spread an ideology. So if you're a 11-13 year old boy, that's one thing. (In fact, I remember this issue coming up with school teachers.) But if you're a 20+ something-year-old man or even older, I guess I would have expected you to have developed some basic people sense to have not gotten screwed or scammed already. But then, maybe you don't really need to in order to manage well enough in this society. And I don't just mean getting swindled with money, but getting swindled when it comes to belief systems. If you want to become a "stronger man" (in a "myself against the world" kind of way) or even a garden-variety, painfully transparent sociopath, do you really need some other man's permission or inspiration to do so? Does this even feel manly?

And be replaced by what, do you think?

Where I live, it was 7-8 CAD for one. I'm not sure how much liquid was in the ones that I got, maybe about 1 cup, give or take? I'm guessing it probably depends where you live and how far they have to ship it. It was yum but really expensive for regular hydration purposes. MMmm. That sounds amazing!

Thirsty Buddha is the best Western brand I've tried! The price is pretty reasonable too. Personally, I really like this Thai brand which is normally quite cheap:

Yea, the quality is all over the place when it comes to prepackaged coconut water. IMO a lot of the western brands taste like crap (like dirty sock water or strangely soured) unless they're the expensive ones. Most of the Southeast Asian brands I've tried are at least reasonably good though! Straight from the shell like this is always really expensive where I live.