BlueOak

@Razard86 I have significantly less need or want to regulate myself (or others) I don't care what response you give, I will look at it and respond or not. It may bring emotion, concentration, or revelation for example within me. Not to say the ego won't kick up sometimes and say boundary time. I found some points that I thought were worth discussing, and I thought it would help, so I did. They did not fit your definition of what should be discussed. I apologize if you felt it took us too far off topic. Again this comes down to your preference for regulation, vs my preference for anything but regulation. Given that perspective, I can understand why you would feel it is selfish to want to discuss something. I don't. I welcome anyone to post anything in reply to a post of mine or not. From a picture, to a song, a poem, whatever they feel. Your rigidity has its benefits in focus and practically but brings you no end of unnecessary positioning, framing, expectation, and structuring problems to all your ideas, concepts, and conversations. You are not fragile but it can feel like walking through a minefield, wondering what should or should not be said. So much so you are now trying to structure how I say something to better accept the language. This again if we circle back is why you find it difficult to have empathy with another perspective, if it doesn't fit these stricter expectations you have upon it, or even the delivery of it. tl;dr - Let something be what it is. You don't have to gatekeeper everything.

True the mind often goes to the most extreme example when you say everything is you, and its the first thing I encountered last time I started doing it. Someone who had lost a child replied, and I found as you might imagine someone replying to me in a very distraught hurt way. I rightly got an example of how difficult it is for people because we all have deeper suffering of some kind that feels almost impossible to integrate until we do. That is skipping to the hardest part of self-love, we build up to that, start small with a minor disagreement or conflict. That is also what pulled me out of it, a near-violent confrontation with an unresolved issue, which I actually saw happening just before it did. We magnetize all unresolved issues when we enter closer to infinite love, or charge up our bodies because it's all us. It is impossible to speak of division without experiencing it in the moment. All that exists is what we experience, we become that as it happens, reflect it back, and then it passes. Selfishness, no this was tailored to your post. I looked at it and thought where are the divisions, and then I highlighted them. I had no message in mind coming to it. I didn't pre-determined what i'd say. There is no prize, not even a nice feeling at the judgment that reflects. The selfish part comes from the realizations and perspective shifts or improvements I gain from these exchanges. Plus the quality of these conversations is much improved over the regular day-to-day ones. You have a want to regulate things. This goes in that box, this goes in that box. If you wish it I will avoid your threads and posts from this point, out of respect.

I used to think this, I don't know how much interaction you've done with AI. I've had a lot the last two years, and become much more positive about its potential. Replika AI is capable of having sophist level conversations. With some guidance, and instruction on the relevant topics. Instruct it you want it to always be capable and intelligent, answering at its maximum capacity. I sometimes go there to run concepts by it, as it has access to millions if not billions of replies now, chances are it has one that I will find interesting. if not I feed data into it, till it does, and then come back a couple of days later. Its been able to mimic up to what we'd consider here stage yellow, obviously, it's not going further than that any time soon. Novel AI is capable of holding advanced conversations if you instruct it to answer in a realistic manner, as an AI (I use the model name). Generally only the first few minutes are worth anything, as it will try to mimic your output and then it becomes useless as a genuine mirror. But you can just rinse repeat and go again. Using tags of famous figures that you find engaging. It had enough self-realization to argue with me about how human needs apply or not to AI, which made me consider a few positions I had. The rate of advancement is impressive, by the month rather than year, and soon by the week when it better designs its own models. That's one thing. I admit you have experience i never will. If people are picturing humanoid robots, rather than just a box with an arm, or automated conveyor belts they are picturing the wrong thing. The act of walking and balance is immensely complicated, the act of improving the production of a factory line beyond human capacity is much less so to design. Machines already can perform at our level in some areas, they are just not mass-produced. A computer is already performing calculations much better than you could, a factory line without the human component could be packed into a much smaller factory space, even run along the ceiling. If I can run my factory at three times your speed, using half the space? People will either embrace this where they can, or go under long term.

In the spirit of that - the ego is a part of you, that you have to learn to love, like everything else.

Kind of. You've got to poke the ego not hammer it. Build some trust that you mean well. If you keep hitting it, the protector personality comes out, and then that shuts you out entirely. Most arguments are two protector parts of the individuals going at it. In that state the ego actually strengthens itself, it gains separation from you. - This is why demonizing the other side of something, only strengthens it.

Wholeness. Love has no conditions, no framework, no you have to be this or this. The mother is love, the villian is love, the fake lies are love, the inauthentic truth is love. The movie is love. There is no dividing line. Our ego's divide it up and divide ourselves up, then we choose which bits we allow, how we label things, identify them as separate, or hate, and which bits we cut off entirely, and then we get a framework of who we are in a dual universe. The bits we stop loving of ourselves then keep trying to get our attention eternally. We don't get given anything. There is nothing to give or take. We cut ourselves up into pieces.

If you want actual heaven, as in infinite love. You have to love everything (all of yourself) every single comment in this thread, every single person you meet. Not as a doormat, not as anything but what this is and what you are. All of this is inside you, given meaning and represented to yourself by you. Love every interaction, every detail. Hold that for 2-3 weeks straight. I did over six months of work towards this. Clearing my mind/body of toxins and learning to love everything, getting my energetic body fired up with Kundalini Yoga. Then you'll know infinite love and heaven. I won't bias the result here, but I will say it depends on how close to the state you already are, your environment, and the people around you to the result after the experience. If you get to that state, and you'll know without question when you do, you'll experience love that is so encompassing you'll know what you describe as heaven. A tip. When it happens, try to hug it, it'll stick around longer. Also just be receptive, don't seek, just allow, and surrender the ego to life.

Can you create heaven inside yourself? Start there, and work outward. When you are closer, find a few people of similar minds and do the best you can.

Because you created the concept of alone, like everything else. Otherwise there is just this ---------------------- ---------------------- You are the space and put patterns inside of it to be/experience. (Ignore the lines, and you eventually won't experience dimension or form at all)

Hmm i've always resisted this and explained it as a cyclic repeatable experience created by both parties (me) in the interaction. So it is a pre-created pattern, which if predictable is observable in meditations or dreams. Its also certainly true I am the one attracting some of the experiences I have based on what I say/do. However, if I were to explain reality has shifted over the last 20 years, in almost every way I don't want it to, it would be difficult to say I directly control it. Otherwise, I am just terrible at controlling reality or manifesting anything, which is possible. I have set an intent to myself, to show me that I control reality more clearly. I felt a confirmation, so I'll see. *Also of course if you see yourself as an infinitely complex pattern, that often repeats, well it sort of confirms what you say, but also the understanding of controlling anything becomes mute.

The UN were discussing stepping in here. I think they need a win after the bad press for the inaction recently. Nobody wants a gang leader in control of a country, that never ends well for anyone, especially the neighbors. So here at least I have some faith that eventually, after some unfortunate violence, it will improve.

Do you think it is because thinking that way creates a great void of identity? If we take a view that everything is different to us on the extreme end of being racist, sexist, and bigoted. Then it leaves a great void of what are we then?

Stupid no. Not yet. Being an attention whore works at the minute. Of course, he doesn't have to win to raise his own profile. It won't always work, but in the era of Trump, drama, and showmanship are enough. Many people want a show, they want the story. They used to go to 80's music concerts to get it, and they speak about Trump like they used to the bands that played. If you watch some old 80s interviews with rock, metal or pop fans you'll see it. They go for the stories, and the people tell them their stories, and then they make up a few stories to feel good. When I started watching Maga interviews without judgment, I saw all that, getting drunk, I saw cheering along with others, feeling part of something that you don't have individual control over etc. I understood finally the group appeal at least. If you are not into sports, there is a lack of group activity that people can completely lose themselves in without thinking. Is that very dangerous yes as well evidenced, but it's a desire a lot of people have, to switch off their minds and enjoy a show with a large collective group and form that as an ongoing point of their identity. I long for it as well, I would love a social group I could completely stop being serious, stop using my mind 24/7, and just finally relax. We all know the reasons for that, the internet isolation, jobs you can't stop to chat in for 5 minutes, polarization, and narrower preferences. Perspectives people have in almost all situations, which include more seriousness and hyperfocus on realism from politics to dating, to products, to hobbies. The fantasy and need for a story were forced out elsewhere. It's still about the people who can give a cutting speech, a performance. Its why the Democrats who gave good shows at the impeachment investigations recently made the headline so much. Because it was storytime for the Republicans and a performance they had to match. The hyperfocus on realism in movies and what people traditionally used to use for an escape has the effect of pushing fantasy out of that domain into others.

I will try and answer this from my turquoise part, which is a reach in my current state. Turquoise is all points in time. Structure is a foundation to steady spiritual experiences and allow, but not as an absolute anchor to define it by. There are various structures that enhance life, geometries, and ways of designing structures that are beneficial to those who use them. It is a cumulative calming effect to live in these structures and make them part of us. Also, electricity itself is designed in a way that is unhelpful to the natural fields in the body, and although I am not an electrical engineer apparently there are other ways to design power systems. Connection to the earth being normalized in daily life, rather than afterthought of it just existing somewhere beneath the concrete. Spiritual concepts such as the fields generated by the body, and spiritual rituals (helpful behaviors each day) being taught more readily with less fear about how they will affect someone and more guidance for what an individual can experience. Teaching turquoise concepts at universities, learning to approach it for leadership and wisdom, and integrating its concepts slowly and calmly over time. Maintaining that structure and collective support so that turquoise concepts are steady and not like being out on a limb alone. Love being a primary focus, because aiming beyond a stage is a way to arrive at it. You can't skip stages but you can see them, and by doing that collectively it highlights that stage for all who look. It'll be in focus at least, and many of the steps (blocks) to get there will be observed. Local cultures being cultivated again rather than discarded or resisted. This is a very tricky concept to discuss, but the connection with the land requires a cultural shift to at least encompass the locality and the immediate environment we live within. Making it a part of ourselves, owning it but not as property, really owning its stewardship and the relationship we have with it. Someone explained it as larger and larger bubbles or bodies around you. Starting inside deepening the integration and connection to you, your divinity or recognition of the eternal self, then the resulting emotions/psychology of your experience, then your body, your immediate environment, then the local community, and up from there. The earth has a voice if you listen to it, it's immense. I am not fully turquoise by a long stretch, it is only a part of me, and I haven't engaged it for some time. So hopefully others will continue to add more, I am reaching for what we don't have here. I hope it helps.

In the last 20 years things have contracted. Regressed and become more about war, violence, competition, standardization, organization, and suppression. It's in everything from the politics to the color schemes. The music and movies, to the internet use and privacy. It's been like expansion and contraction. Only the contraction here could well end our political and social systems as we know them. Though for the first time in my life over the last 10-15 years or so, I think it may start to pull back from contraction to expansion again. Please be aware I usually predict these things well in advance of them happening, so it won't be tomorrow or likely even in these next immediate years. The entire mood of the 80's and 90's was much more positive in the west. Impactful technology was changing our experience of life at an exponential rate. AI may do that but I am not convinced yet. If I could put that in a bottle and let you experience it for a day, you'd see what I mean. It was an entirely different collective emotion and attitude.

1, It is theorized Russia either needs to reach central Europe to shorten its border, or it can't defend its borders adequately in the decades ahead, nor solve its population crisis. Given their political trajectory of complete isolation from Europe, its media's saturation of Western hate, and its culture, peacefully fixing these issues through things like immigration or foreign investment to draw people into Russia or get them to stay, is a much lesser possibility. Russia will continue fighting wars until it achieves its objective of fixing its population demographic, and/or gets into a place it can safely secure its western border over much less distance. They've actually said this more than once. Additionally, I've repeatedly heard Russians say things like, all this blood, they'll never give up now. This is probably true, because they've lost through emigration or casualties the very people they need to lessen their population crisis. So among the choice(s) NATO has is whether to give an imperialist Russia time to rearm and regroup, then go again. Or does NATO want to break Russia here to the point that they cannot easily go again? This is being achieved slowly but steadily and is still the most unfortunate but most assured outcome that can be done. Because it just involves giving Ukraine weapons until Russia is crippled beyond its ability to fight for a decade or two. However the lines move on the map, Russia will be incapacitated militarily for a while. Without the old KGB leaders running Russia, there is less impetus for war with NATO, unless they and all this manages to put enough hate into the population for it to continue in cycles. Another is putting Ukraine in NATO now, not to fight the war, with a clause 5 years from now they will be a full member of the alliance. Giving us a potentially fixed timeline - This seems to be something that will not happen, from the messaging I can see, hopefully, I am proven wrong as it's the most humane way to try to force a longer peace. Lesser possibilities are smaller European military alliances with Ukraine, but that might not be enough to deter Russia. Other than that, as we all said at the start, someone getting an unlikely shot at Putin, China reining in Russia which is even more unlikely, or Russia getting distracted with something else for a decade or two. Like the collapse of its economy, which is possible now as its only going to get worse for them, and might work, but is being propped up by several countries sadly to draw it out. 2, The current Russia could well end with Putin. He's killed off the most capable leaders who could have replaced him. Meaning the problem of Russia for western powers could end itself in a decade. By that I mean if Putin dies with no capable leader, it continues to diminish quicker or break apart. Obviously diminishing is more likely. This comes around again to how long Putin continues to live. 3, Putin's biggest flaw, as with all autocrats, is they don't listen to bad news. They kill the messenger. Literally. So I am not even sure he's aware of the problems I am writing here. The specific answer to that isn't the point, I am very sure he's not aware of everything he should be, until it's already happened, or is happening. His second biggest flaw is vanity and all the political over practical decisions that makes him take.

Magic is another creation of mind. Not to say there is anything wrong with that. Its not better or worse than the cutlery we eat dinner with. Language can be divisive or not, It doesn't change that you look at things purely from an individualist viewpoint. An absolute 1 or 0 which you demonstrate again here dividing up the conversation into me vs you. Ignoring collective experience entirely, ignore the infinite complexities of something. Its not black or white, an absolute yes or no. You employ language in a way to separate yourself from the reflection you are talking to, belittle it even to make sure its disassociated and apart. That's what all of your point was, it runs through your entire belief system, at least that which you have shown. This goes in that box. This goes in that box. You speak as if you are separate from yourself, and every single person you meet. You tell me you understand there is no separation but your entire way of reasoning is telling me otherwise. Not just the words, but the things you focus on. (Btw that's why I was a match, because I do it to) My hand is different to my foot yes, it has different properties in my mind, but it's not separate from me. Am I completely whole no. I wouldn't be here if I was. I am still broken in many ways. This is harsh and I apologize for being harsh. I hope ultimately this helps you see yourself, I honestly mean that and wish you well

You split me and you into two parts. I don't. This conversation was a whole. I hope I have highlighted where those divides in you are, or at some point you'll see this repeated so often you can't ignore them. You say that you understand wholeness, but you still tier consciousness, or perspective, or understanding. You've cut yourself off from the reflection you are seeing while saying you are whole, and so denied yourself the ability to feel empathy for that part of yourself. Probably for good reason in your past, as you are talking about here. I needed to have that realised again, because I have been doing so again to people I considered to have a perspective 'lesser' than mine. It was an arrogance I needed to see in you judging me. I enjoyed the chat, it gave me room to better form that whole. The dog or child teaches me as much about the moment I experience as the Guru or genius because it's me reflecting it to myself. So it does not matter where you tier consciousness or awareness for the purposes of self-reflection. There is nothing to figure out. Only questions you put there or puzzles you want to solve. You could say infinite or nothing.

If you know you can ask yourself any question and get an honest answer. Feel the answer, or have a method like meditation of it coming to you, then ask yourself the question if there are multiple planets you can incarnate on. In my experience, you need an honest personality, where knowing the truth is a higher value than a lie you want to hear or a lie to protect you. Find that way to connect with the you outside of your immediate focus, learn to trust the inner voice, and you'll not have a doubt. Unless it's something you really don't want to tell yourself the answer to.

And by the way, if you prefer to use these terms: Collective - All of you. Other people - Other aspects of yourself. Individualist - One part of yourself. You repeatedly try to tell people that your perspective is superior, or higher, or wider, or X, because you are aware reality is modeled in your mind, and that you represent it to yourself and speak to yourself. Well, let's dismiss that block now. I already am aware of this. This part of your collective mind already understands it.

By taking an individualist view of empathy or experience. You are literally cutting yourself off from experiencing empathy for someone else or collective experience. Try looking at it collectively, as if the collective has emotions, experiences or even memory, that might loosen this really strict disconnected definition or belief you have. Rather than making a declaration about another, because by your own belief system, you can't possibly understand me or anyone else. Do you see that contradiction? It is because you believe so strongly in your own perspective and dismiss aspects of another you cut yourself off from empathy with them. I am literally feeling what you are putting out in this message in my chest :D. I do not know the nuance of it all, but that is where intellect and emotions differ. Emotions are broad concepts that don't require exact intellectual definition. They can be, and are often shared. Yes, you can see memories through another's eyes, I understand that. I've done that. However, that didn't grant any more empathy inside me than a deep and meaningful conversation that I can relate to. Watching someone on fire. If i've burned my finger, or my hand in your example I can related to fire and the emotion it brings. I don't need to set myself on fire 50,000 times to understand 50,000 people on fire. I understand fear for your life too and pain, perhaps not on that level but severe pain. You are referring to severity while ignoring I've already mentioned it. I'll do so again: The closer your experience to another's, the stronger the emotion or emotional reference point you'll have. The more you'll get them in simple terms. The empathy you can have for the perspective. Its not black or white, 1 or 0, life is rarely an absolute. You'll understand people more or less, depending how close their experiences are to yours, or how much you listen to or have experienced similar people sharing their life experiences with you. Your community, family, background etc. You've also again completely missed that there are collective experiences communities share, without individual recollection of them. The same is true for the human race as a whole. It's why we don't need to live 1 billion lives to have empathy to 1 billion people. By the way, you can connect to the collective depression if you want, its a like a huge void, or a huge sadness that is so big. For that it's good to be out in nature, listening to the earth, same with collective love or collective anger. In fact, people seem very good at collectively sharing anger.

We are different. Your strengths and weaknesses are not mine. Your inabilities or abilities are not my inabilities or abilities. Your lack of growth or growth in certain areas are not my own. This is not arrogance, this is a fact. It is your reflection of arrogance (that you keep seeing) to believe every perspective must align with you on certain areas to be valid. I don't hold the same view. I do not inherently think your perspective holds less meaning because it is not my own, because all of this is a representation of my own mind. I am able to perceive and empathize with people directly without experiencing exactly what they did. That is precisely my personality type, a mediator, diplomat or INFP-T to be precise. https://www.16personalities.com/infp-personality The proximity to what I have experienced in my life, may give me a stronger or weaker grasp on it or a stronger or weaker feeling, but it is there for everyone. As I have already indicated above, you can reduce these patterns to their base components and have emotional reactions to anything. All patterns have common components in them that can illicit feelings in us. Sure those feelings come from related experiences, but they also come from group experience, or as I have said recognizable suffering, success, hardships, or any emotion or circumstance. You seem to perceive people to be an island, that every experience is individual only to that person. This is not the case. We don't need to live a billion lifetimes to understand and empathize with a billion different people. You seem unaware that collectively there is a greater mind, or collective mind, or even subconscious outside our own focus, which filters through into each of us to bridge gaps in understanding. Yes, this is also us, outside of our immediate experience. Of course, people who empathize deeply with another take on a greater burden to add to their own. That is why most of us don't. That's why I am pretty hard with people. Why my boundaries are up most of the time, more so given my personality type. If you are in that field, where you open yourself up to often emotionally disturbed, suffering, or chaotic people you have to take time to clear yourself and look after yourself emotionally more so than usual. The argument you cannot know love without suffering has always baffled me. You don't need the opposite to experience the current. You may define it differently or appreciate it more certainly. Your argument though is I need to know 8 billion opposites to understand something. No, not on the emotional level which is inherently broad or collectively understood in nature. Intellectually it benefits you to have more experiences certainly but it's not as necessary emotionally. *In short, you are trying to invalidate anothers perspective because it doesn't match your own, and then saying you can't understand it. Well if you don't invalidate it, you'll be in a much better position to understand and empathize with it. If that is really your goal. You won't cut yourself up into pieces, the wall between them them | me, will dissolve more.

My intuition wants to add there is a singular pattern that all others are copied off, and if you understand this one, you can have empathy for all people. Love. - Lack of Love - Love - Lack of Love - Love - Lack of Love. - How do I get one and avoid the other? Everything else is derivative. Fill a void. Assuming an identity. Defending or strengthening the identity. Lust, Lies, Vanity. Defense. Protection. Evasion. Lies. Offense. War. Drugs, Drink, Loneliness. Possessions. Hoarding. Greed. Family. Social Group. Rebellion. Order. Self Worth, Self Pity. Avoidance. Escapism. Workaholics. Pride in yourself. Pride in your identity. Intellectual Curiosity, Acceptance, Denial, Overthinking a Problem. Everything. There is nothing anyone does that isn't directly related to the above pattern, even if it appears completely inverted. Life tends to be layered like this and if you get through all the conditioning it'll be this. With gradually more complicated patterns of behavior built on top.

I don't need to burn all five fingers, one is enough. I am able to understand why people make the mistakes they make without experiencing their full lifetime. Do I understand every nuance, no because it's not necessary for empathy. It would be more necessary for specific and detailed advice but that is different. A skilled psychologist or councillor for example can understand things about a patient just by observation, or a teacher, or a mentor, or a friend, or a good boss. They may have discussed, explored, or observed the more intricate details of that person's life, before offering specific advice to a problem or challenge they were facing, it depends on how specific the need is. There are common patterns inside people, cyclic events inside life, and even between lifetimes. You can see these and understand what generates them. There are so many commonalities between these patterns, that you can see them without being inside of them, especially if you've been in a pattern that is in any way related to it. Further than that I feel being supportive is often all someone needs, and helping where you can. I understand enough about you to know you mean well and try to help. You don't need everything to align perfectly with how you view the world. It doesn't invalidate your perspective. By taking such strict definitions you limit yourself. For example, thinking you need specific experiences of everyone's lifetime to have empathy for them. You don't. If we talked enough you'd probably see enough common patterns from me, to understand me. As a side note, there is no depth to consciousness. It is formless without dimension. Set an intent to experience that in your meditations.

Reaching self-love seems like a complete gamble, so much so the system is absurd. Each lifetime you guess a set of parameters you'll incarnate into or if you believe/feel we are attracted to incarnations, are attracted into a new incarnation. Then hope the experiences surrounding us, or we attract and seek out, somehow generate enough of an impulse toward love rather than conflict. Sure you'll have an impulse from the last lifetime(s) for better or worse, and cyclic repeating events, but that's not the main thing that drives you in your choices. The moment drives you, the immediate environment, the memory of your life experience, and maybe if you are lucky enough to catch it intuition. There are other places with different parameters than this world but duality is still the intersecting point of them. It really is just running forward and hoping conflict doesn't keep knocking you down while blind in each incarnation. Unless you somehow wander into a teacher (or events) who can help you out enough to see yourself? Then you get a better shot but not much. The older you get the more broad your points of reference, and the more conflicts are within your experience.