something_else

Here's a very relevant story of mine from a few weeks back, have a read. I felt exactly like you felt and ended up having a blast of a night. If you go out alone I think you're always going to need to deal with your mind coming up with emotional shit like that Drinking some alcohol can help relax the shitty thoughts. It also helps if the place is really busy because no one knows you're alone by sight, and if you feel stressed you can just blend into the crowd. If someone asks who you're there with just say you're new to the town and you just wanna have a fun night. Ideally you won't even need that because you're right, non-verbal communication is key on the dance floor, it's a good skill to work on In my experience, if you go alone, the mindset you want is "let's fucking do it and see what the fuck happens". Clubs are chaotic, literally anything can happen. Try to get your mind to tap into the adrenaline and excitement of that prospect Tell yourself that anything else that your mind generates other than "fuck it let's see what happens" is an expectation and should be ignored as much as reasonably possible

Are you sure she wasn't being ironic? that phrase is pretty much universally used jokingly now

Yes, I thought so, was just confirming

It's kinda simple, you're free to wait as long as you want but if that's longer than the guy is willing to wait then you must accept his feelings on the matter, and he must accept yours Either you come to some middle ground or you part ways, neither side is right or shameful. Do whatever you want, but accept that by waiting longer you may repel some great guys who just happen to want sex sooner than you. Same goes for them, they miss out on great girls who just need a little more time If I remember correctly the main point of the other thread was more that expecting commitment before sex is problematic. Because a guy can't know if he wants to commit before sex, so it's unfair of the girl to expect that. If you're expecting commitment from guys first as opposed to just an emotional connection then I would argue you could be being a bit selfish and needy. But I don't think that's what you mean here anyway, correct me if I'm wrong

For what it's worth, the amount of action I'm able to take at the moment is going to a club every Saturday with the aid of alcohol, occasionally a Friday as well. I'm experimenting with going out to bars weekdays too, but that's incredibly hard for me. Starting with small steps like going in, buying a drink, then leaving. Like @flowboy said, taking action is hard. Reward yourself for small steps in the right direction. As long as you're doing something, anything, that's emotionally challenging, then you're moving in the right direction. Even if it's a tiny step. My own personal opinion is that viewing things through the lense of pickup is a bad idea. This is unverified and take from it what you will.

Oh man, this is a recipe for disaster. Especially given the post that follows it. You're on the knives edge of toxicity, tread carefully I'd stop consuming redpill shit and just focus on socialising with girls. Maybe look at some of the healthier pickup/socialisation theory if you need it This is a game of action, not theory. The theory is supplemental and secondary

Meh, I guess. I don't really know your situation, just don't get bogged down in theory vs action. Going out and socialising with those girls as much as possible is worth a thousand theories and systems.

Why do you feel like you need a system to follow?

@charlie cho @Karmadhi Yea, one of the biggest things I've had to deal with mentally is my mind telling me "oh this just isn't you, you're not a sociable person." Be especially careful what beliefs you have about what kind of person you are, they can be quite limiting. I wouldn't consider myself loud or energetic either @Karmadhi but I do notice that when I'm having a good time I'm far more free flowing, loose and high energy than I would normally be. But that high energy would be awful in day to day life. It has a time and a place.

I made a thread last week about a shitty experience I had in a club where I ended up getting thrown out and just generally having a really bad night. I realised that may have been discouraging to anyone else who is starting to socialise a bit more via clubs or just going out in general so I figured I'd make another thread about a much better experience I had this week with some insights. This is long, and almost more of a journal entry so perhaps it'd be better suited to that section. I'm really just summarising my experience for myself and if it happens to be useful/helpful to anyone else that's great. In short, this is only my 3rd time in a club and I've already had some great times. And I'm someone who has been socially deficient since I was 12. Choice of club I know nothing about clubs, to be honest. There are three in my town, I chose the closest one to me last week and apparently I chose wrong. I ended up getting thrown out of it as I mentioned but I care even less now because it was absolutely terrible in comparison to the place I went to this week. It had far more people, and they were much more reliably in my age range (it was mainly 18-25 year olds there, and one 41 year old Greek God of a male specimen which I'll get to later ) Drinking I should make it clear that I do drink. I know most often the advice if you're doing pickup or whatever is not to drink alcohol but frankly I'm not approaching this as pickup or as using any kind of system, I'm reading almost no theory on anything. I'm just going out, having fun and seeing what happens. I can see how structure would be helpful so I have nothing against it, it just doesn't feel like the right approach for me. Maybe that will change. Start of the night I really really didn't want to go out at the start of the night (around 10ish), like my mind was generating literally every excuse possible to make me sit at home instead of going out. One of the most powerful excuses was "well you feel like shit and you're anxious so you definitely won't have a good night, go another night instead". I ended up telling myself I was just going to go for a walk around the busy town areas and talk to some people instead of facing the full intensity of a club. But I'm so so glad I went out. That voice generating excuses not to do difficult things in your head is a total bastard lol. Literally the second I started talking to some people (a group of girls and a guy) all the weird negative shit in my mind just vanished and I ended up going to the club with them. I've noticed that I'm absolutely fine talking to groups and I can be super confident in a group dynamic when I'm the new person in the group and all the attention is on me. It feels like a performance and I can come across as interesting and engaging. It helps that people here are usually very friendly and inclusive. But when we got to just outside the club they started talking to some other people they knew and suddenly I didn't know what to say and I just kind of clammed up. I've had similar experiences before. I don't know why this happens, probably just lack of social experience. I think it's also my mind freaking out that I need to do something to keep their attention but at the same time not knowing what to do exactly. Anyway, one of the girls was showing clear signs of attraction (the most attractive girl as far as I can remember that has ever shown clear interest in me) until we got to the club and I went quiet and awkward like I mentioned. I went in with her and her friend but I could clearly tell she was awkward around me now so I went in and just left them. Oh well. It still made me feel good. Rest of the night Most of the rest of the night was just dancing, I made out with 3 girls on the dance floor, one of them literally grabbed me and started kissing me out of nowhere, turns out she was trying to make a 41 year old dude she was crazy about jealous cos he wasn't showing her any interest He was legit the most objectively attractive male specimen I've ever seen which made it even funnier. I ended up speaking to him later, really chill dude, and he told me she was absolutely nuts and he wasn't into girls half his age anyway. Another girl was not that attractive to me but I kept running into her so I figured why not, let's dance and see what happens. Got her snapchat, if nothing else she seemed kinda chill so might make a good friend since I'm in a new town and want to build up a bit of a social network anyway. The last girl was really short, like 5ft tall which is super attractive to me. I can't remember if she came up to me or if I came up to her on the dance floor, but we were doing all sorts, more than just kissing, hands all over each other. This was my first proper experience of sexy dancing and making out with someone I met on a night out, man it's so fucking hot. I whispered (well, shouted but that sounds like a whisper in a club lol) in her ear that I live a couple streets away and pulled her by her hand off the dance floor, she still seemed super into it, then she said she was gonna go tell her friends where she was going. I figured, that's fair enough, so I waited. I gave it like 30 seconds and then realised she might have just bailed. I probably should have given it longer but part of me didn't really believe it was actually gonna happen so I thought she'd just left. I still don't actually know whether she would've come back or not, I regret not waiting a bit longer. Rejections I went back to dancing and I don't really think much more interesting happened after that. I danced with a few girls who ended up having a BF (these were polite rejections usually) and got absolutely tons of less polite rejections. The nonverbal ones where you get looks of disgust and contempt after just making eye contact or signalling you wanna dance are the worst, but I'm used to it now and the few times where I wasn't rejected just helped me start to laugh at the more rude rejections Conclusions I am not a sociable person. I have probably got some form of social anxiety although I'm not diagnosed or anything. But in just 3 trips to a club I'm starting to actually open up, have fun, attract girls in ways I wouldn't have imagined doing in the past. I find clubs even easier than bars to socialise because you can just vanish into the crowd if need be, compared to a bar where if you're not talking to someone you're kind of sitting awkwardly on your own. Yes, the alcohol helps and I don't want to turn it into too much of a crutch. But I don't really see the problem with having a few drinks to match everyone else's energy. And it helps with dancing, which is not something that comes naturally to my sober self lol. My overall point is that you might not necessarily need to do thousands of pickup approaches or tons of work to start having great and fun social experiences. Especially if you're young, in like the college/university age range like me, just start going out to busy places and see what happens.

Exactly, I was bullied as a child and that's why I'm pretty anxious socially. The solution to that is not really provided by RSD or any pickup techniques, but I suspect many of their customers/viewers are in a similar situation, which RSD undoubtedly exploit. If you're not especially socially anxious or struggle with insecurity and you just struggle with knowing what to do then I can definitely see the value in something like RSD or any other set of techniques/systems. I'm naturally really sociable when I can get by the anxiety and I imagine this applies to many many people. My problem isn't knowing how to socialise, it's just learning to let go. And the conclusion that I've come to here is that the solution (for me anyway) is just exposure without placing too many goals or expectations upon yourself. Just go to busy places and see what happens @flowboy You seem like a super chill guy btw

@Leo Gura @flowboy I had to stop watching the newer RSD videos on YT because of this tactic. I realised most of them were making me feel inferior and basically like total shit

If I was given a choice between being a total extrovert and a total introvert I'd choose total introvert. I feel like learning to be social is easier than learning to deeply introspect, so if you can more naturally introspect you are in a sense better off. However, most people are really somewhere in the middle and can do both to an average level. So it's probably not worth thinking about all that much, especially if you start developing some beliefs about how you can't do x y z because you're an introvert or an extrovert

Look at every thread he's made. There's no point. @Leo Gura I think a good option could be to restrict the kind of threads that can be made in the dating section a little bit more. A lot of the toxicity comes from threads that start with things like "why do girls do x" "why are men like y" "do all girls want this". These are essentially an invitation for everyone to start discussing their frustrations with the opposite sex by generalising way too much and essentially creating literal straw-men and straw-women in their heads to bash and take out frustration upon. It doesn't help anyone because it's way too general and people are arguing against the ideas of men/women they have in their heads rather than reality. When I think back, a lot of the toxicity I've seen arises from these kinds of threads, and I think it would be a sensible idea to crack down on them a bit more. Some recent examples of overly general threads: Though this is by no means an exhaustive list. To be clear I have nothing in particular against the authors of the threads, I just believe these types of threads cause more harm than good. I think some of the practical dating threads are really quite productive and I do enjoy them, but I don't think anything productive comes from threads like the ones above, and they're very very likely to result in toxicity. Dating advice needs to be practical, it's so fucking easy to get stuck in your head and discouraging threads which promote this 'getting stuck in your head' would be very beneficial to reducing toxicity. Spending too long in your head is part of how you get inceldom

I actually noticed myself feeling a bit crappy after reading a lot of the threads in the dating section, yet I keep doing it. It happens to be the section most aligned with my development at the moment so I tend to view it the most. I'm not actually convinced it helps though, and in fact like @Raphael said it might even hurt. It certainly doesn't make me feel good. I think many guys use it as a distraction, I'm certainly guilty of that

The point of the video isn't to become a hermit, you should still try and cultivate some meaningful relationships. The point is that you should not be completely dependant on maintaining and controlling these relationships for your happiness

I've just graduated, moved out, got a solid job making good money, now I'm living on my own in a new town. I know I'm socially not as developed as I need to be and that's where most of my efforts are going just now, the new town thing makes that especially tough. I've been socialising quite a bit, had some great experiences. Covid restrictions finally lifted enough for nightclubs to open. I still haven't made any solid friends here yet so I've been going alone so far and had an absolute blast the first time I went to this particular place. However I went back again this Friday and had a really shitty experience. Initially I was denied entry because I was on my own, despite going there alone before. I then found a couple girls round the corner who said they'd pretend they knew me and got in, I never saw them again after that but it felt great at the time. I was there for a couple hours, spoke to a bunch of people, danced etc. then I started talking to another pair of girls, it was loud and they couldn't hear me so I cupped my hand around one of their ears and spoke into that, just some some basic shit about if they were having a good night. No more than 30 seconds total. They clearly weren't interested so I just moved on. I didn't think anything of it, really, I'm pretty sure that's normalish club behaviour but it was the most forward thing I did. After that, I saw one of them talking to a bouncer and pointing directly at me while I was just having a good time dancing. Next thing I know he was telling me I had to leave. I don't know why but this has actually made me feel like total shit. I know it's relatively inconsequential, but I feel unbelievably guilty and confused because I don't really know exactly what I did wrong, but clearly something. The idea of being seen as creepy seems to hit something really deep inside me, I really hate being perceived that way. And being denied entry for being alone in retrospect reinforces this in my mind. It makes me feel like a creep somehow, or like I'm an outsider, like I'm doing something wrong. I'm really just venting because this has been playing on my mind a whole lot over the weekend. I'm definitely overthinking it, but if anyone happens to have any insight on anything I've said then I'd appreciate it

Thanks, I'm feeling a lot better about it now, in fact I find it a little funny thinking back. I'm new to clubbing and it was entirely unexpected, it just took me by surprise so it left me feeling shitty for a few days

Yes

Yes. And the world is full of immature people. One day one of them might try to beat your ass up in front of your girlfriend, what you gonna do if that happens? Tell them they're just being immature and should back down? Even if someone is verbally abusing you, you need to be able to deal with that shit and skillful use of aggression and confidence is necessary to either de-escalate (ideal) or respond (if necessary) Stand up for yourself or people will walk all over you

There are times where aggression is necessary and it makes sense that a woman would be attracted to men capable of standing up to attackers verbally, or physically when necessary. Life isn't all sunshine and roses Obviously an excessive attraction to violence is not good in a stage orange/green first world country but violence still happens in these countries no matter how developed you think you are, especially to women. So of course they'll be attracted to guys who make them feel safe

@DIDego I haven't seen a place try to enforce social distancing here. One place wanted me to wear a mask which is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. I'm all for covid restrictions and masks, but if you're going to open nightclubs making people wear masks in them is just a bit silly. Everyone's going to catch everything anyone there has whether they wear masks or not. In fact I'm pretty sure I caught covid from a club last month, it hit me pretty hard and I'm young and reasonably healthy. It's the worst I've felt in a long time and I'd already had my first vaccine by that point so I'd have had a little bit of immunity. I didn't bother testing (though I should have in hindsight) but I did isolate for 10 days. I still don't have my sense of smell or taste back, it's really fucking strange

Not when you add alcohol to the situation Ouch. Guys get into fights all the time here (Scotland, it's part of the culture). My short Indian friend's strategy is to go straight for the eyes, he goes from 0 to a 100 real quick when people get in his face. Great guy, happens to be quite good with woman too, funnily enough. I'm honestly surprised you've never ended up in a proper fight in all that time lol Amazing. Guess bouncers being dicks is just part of nightlife to get used to

Dude. Dial it back a bit Being sexual is good, but you gotta be a bit subtle and playful about it. You sound very young, I'd recommend you focus on socialising in the ways younger people traditionally socialise. If I could give my past self one bit of advice it would be that

This really is what I needed to hear, thank you. I mean I'd had a few drinks, it's entirely possible I was giving off generally bad energy without realising even if I didn't do anything tangibly bad. It's not entirely about what you say. I also understand what @blueberries said about girls being particularly on guard in clubs if they've had bad experiences. And venues are going to side with girls in 99% of situations regardless of what actually happens anyway. That's the plan @Preety_India it sure doesn't feel hot, that's for sure. Maybe if you got kicked out for chatting up the girl the manager was hitting on, or for stealing shots from the shot girls' trays or some other shit like that you'd have a case here hehehe. Not for some random girl thinking you're a creep and reporting you @Leo Gura This is what excites me about clubs, I like the idea of letting loose and rolling the dice, see what the fuck happens. Turns out when the dice don't roll in your favour it feels bad, who knew. Two questions: Did you get beat up? Have you ever been rejected entry into a club for being alone or any other stupid reasons?