Miguel1

@Lyubov Lots of narcissists and people with more serious mental issues, that are good at hiding them and may not even know themselves, unless you know what you are doing.

Of course there is no guarantees in life but if you marry a psychopath, then you are just dumb. Likewise, if you marry a lier, an unconscious immature person, someone who hasn’t faced themselves and cannot be vulnerable, then you cannot expect too much.

@Natasha Tori Maru Yes, there is a clear disagreement between us. Either it is misunderstanding or real, but we definitely don’t see eye to eye right now. Relationships at my age is no children’s game. I could fuck around and find out in my 20s but right now it needs to be pretty strong from the get go for it to be worth investing in it.

@Lyubov Of course all of those are done. That’s a given. What it leads to is this thread. We are talking in circles.

The issue is I care about wasting time with the wrong person. Whenever I am in a relationship, I care deeply about the person, and so naturally I invest a ton of time and energy into it. If the person then ends up cheating or breaking up for some silly reason, because they ”fell out of fantasy / love”, it is a huge waste. I have become very strongly allergic to wasting my time in relationships, as I’ve done it so many times. I’ve learned many lessons don’t get me wrong (and very appreciative) but this is definitely one of the big ones. Besides, if you want babies, you do have a time limit. Even for men — and the worst part is that you cannot really afford to have kids with the wrong person, as it will ruin your and the baby’s life.

The dating space lacks integrity, honesty and vulnerability so badly that I am considering going back to my peak PUA phase and just spinning 10 girls for my own needs, treating them all as such: good for little bit of fun and intimacy but that’s it. Especially now as I feel like I have properly moved on from my ex partner, and no longer have that same longing for a partner. Ideally I would find one girl to build a healthy and sustainable relationship with for the rest of my life here on Earth. But how the fuck?

@Natasha Tori Maru Are you looking to date seriously? If yes, how do you go about it, making sure it actually is healthy and sustainable, and based on truth and honesty as early as possible? How do you make sure you don’t waste a ton of time with the wrong person?

Hip hop dance and dance battles

@MarkKol You miss the point completely. The point is that 99%+ people havent done the work, and are stuck in their survival ego, thus are not capable of real intimacy, vulnerability and love — but just uses the other for their own unconscious survival agendas, whether it is something gross like financial or someting sublte like trauma.

Yes, that’s the point. And that’s what conscious dating in the future should look like. Naftali is no perfect by any means, but at least he is pushing radical honesty dating, from the get go. And he is doing it very loudly.

@LordFall Of course both are important, that goes without saying. Without human survival, there is no human spirituality and deep connection. As always, you are deep in your orange pursuits, so you will rationalize anything for your favour.

Superficial dating strategy vs Depth Notice that superficial dating strategy is very survival orientated. Very shallow and not sustainable, as there will always be someone who can provide better survival goodies. She represents the ego in dating very strongly. This is an interesting conversation as it’s not two ”spiritual / integrated” people talking, so there’s a lot of conflict, and Naftali cannot have his way too easily, like he tends to have due to his strong frame. Notice how the ego uses higher conscious qualities like integrity and hard-working to rationalize in its favour.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DbbNV0jyVSh/?igsh=bTRxd2xyZGY0MnZ0

I think you can grow out of that fantasy. That being said, you can have threesomes in monogamous relationship with ur gf and another girl.

It wasn’t a healthy kind of anxiety.

@LordFall Yes, those are basically the arguments Teal makes.

I have met mostly fake green girls then But you are right, trauma work etc. are part of SD Green. But I would say there are levels to it. Basic trauma and inner work is part of it, but we are talking going all the way here.

@Natasha Tori Maru The point is that most people are not willing to do that. Even in our community, which is extremely niched, how maky of us are actually willing to face such fears in ourselves?

@Natasha Tori Maru Facing yourself and your deepest fears is WAY easier said than done.

I was in such a relationship for 5 years until last fall, except I was so much more unconscious and immature than now. It was the most beautiful relationship I have experienced by far, but also the most painful and the worst hell. That relationship + doing Leo’s work seriously, I grew in 5 years way too fucking much. Way more than I had ever imagined. Such a relationship combined with Actualized.org will show you all of your bullshits, self-deceptions and manipulations that you do unconsciously in the relationship.

@Natasha Tori Maru I will respond to you later more in-depth but as I said myself in the opener, I am still unsure about his work. Precisely because of the reason you said. He comes across very strong, which can easily lead to frame controlling. Which he is very much aware of, as he came from the PUA community. And one of the main reasons I made this thread is so you guys can show me the blindspots I might have. I am always careful that I fall into someone’s frame and it blinds me. Especially to people with such strong character. At the same time, it might be for marketing purposes and / or just a deep passion for the topic. See Leo in the past. Here the guest challenges him more.

@Rishabh R @AION Of course his work is about developing real strenght, which comes from diving deep into yourself, your fears, your shadows, and your weaknesses. Where did you even get the idea that this is not the case?

I got this vibe from him very strongly at first too when I first bumped into his content. And I am still not sure if this is the case or not. But remember this podcast was in 2024. There’s a lot of growing in 2 years, especially for someone who is serious about it. Also, he could be talking such boldly cuz he knows it works in the social media space, just like Leo used to practice. And / or it could just be that he is exceptionally passionate about it. Finally, perhaps it is just the masculine way to go about this. Very straight to the point, cut through bullshit approach. But no way is he perfect. And as you said, most likely still has a bunch of inner stuff to be worked on. But the stuff he talks about and the way he talks, is fresh in the online self-help / relationship advice space. I gotta give him that.

Yes, this is why you do all this from the get go. And this is why it is extremely hard to find someone to go on dates with to begin with — most girls are not willing to do this. Naftali is a very good looking lad, yet he says he rarely goes on dates (nor has ONS) cuz there’s nobody he deems worthy of. This is a guy with very high libido and comes from PUA background. He could get laid easily. He has a community of likeminded people, is relatively popular on the internet, yet he still struggles to find worthy people. What chances do a normie like me have? https://www.instagram.com/reel/DboWoQZkiQj/?igsh=MWZoZjN3MDZmdGs2dg==

You are probably more of a natural with a twist of trauma. I have talked to you before. It seems very natural for you to let go and have fun, and don’t care about what anyone thinks of you (these are the most important traits in game) + ADHD.