Preetom

And if that didn't do the trick then listen to the master himself!

@Monkey-man Everything you need to know to start self-inquiry. Also debunking many usual traps and misconceptions https://selfdefinition.org/ramana/quotes/sadhu-om-self-inquiry.htm

This video answers precisely that question https://www.actualized.org/insights/skepticism-and-nonduality

All the meme and jokes aside, I think it would be great if death and suicide could be culturally re-contextualized. Actually there is nothing wrong in the the drive for death or to commit suicide. It is one of the natural(probably the most intense) urges of the mind. Why? Well because death is the ultimate release. It is the innate intelligence in us that does everything for seeking pleasure and avoiding pain, it knows that dying will be the ultimate happiness/release. Osho used to say that it is probably impossible to find a person who has never contemplated suicide. If a person never glimpsed the urge for his own annihilation or meaninglessness of life, he is either an animal or just plain stupid. In any endeavor to fulfill any of our desire, we actually don't crave the object of desire. We merely crave for the release after that desire is subsided, that even, clam, self-happiness or relief. Looking in this way, it is obvious that an urge for suicide is actually a wake up call; not something that is to be treated as taboo. It's a wake up call to wake up from the dream and be what one really is. But there are countless stupid ways to treat this intelligent message. Killing the physical body is probably the most stupid way out of them. The urge for suicide is not the urge for annihilation of the physical body. This flesh doll is already dead. It is the urge to get relief from the hideous cancer which is the sense of being a separate self, the ultimate tyrant there is

Buddha didn't spread his teachings on acid. "The pleasure that Indra(the king of gods) enjoys with his wife, Ayirani, is not better than the pleasure enjoyed by a dog with its bitch'' - Sage Dadhyangatharvana

they were supposed to be Gods who save lives

Yup. What does it matter if one is absolutely conflict free?

Thanks for sharing. I'm not at all belittling whatever experience you've had and the corresponding personal understanding. I'm trying to say is the idea/model that there is a personal oversoul that chooses to take birth and die in specific scenarios with some specific purpose and so on...is a belief or theoretical model. I've heard some spiritual teachers especially new age people proclaiming it with so much conviction. Nothing wrong it. If this model intellectually satisfies one, then great! If not(as no model will indiscriminately satisfy everyone), then he needs more investigation to land on a different reconciling understanding

You can look at it any way you want. But notice that like all other objective knowledge, that 'memory' is an indirect knowledge open to alternate interpretations depending on the eye of the beholder. Ultimately hollow and groundless, but could be interpreted in any way desired as long as it is believed.

yes!

Every single act with doership, even the search for enlightenment/death is an egoic act. If ''I am'' is ALL there is, where does the distinction called living and dying come from? Did you consciously choose to 'be'? Before coming into this earth, did you think to yourself ''Okay, now I am going to be!!"? Or every morning before waking up from deep sleep, do you consciously say to yourself ''Okay I've had enough sleep! I'm bored! Now I'm gonna wake up and be!!'' ? If Being wasn't something you consciously create/choose, then what makes you think you can get rid of it? Just investigate this hideous cancer which still thinks it exists inside a body and see that it was a non-existent optical illusion all along. You are already dead. Save yourself the trouble 2 days later sharp kid

distract them for few minutes from suicidal thoughts. That should do the work. probably 99% suicidal thoughts/attempts are not clearly and consciously chosen decision made over a long period of time. Mostly it is just a fickle mind virus that takes one over for a short time. If that short time can be countered by shifting the attention to something else, usually that suicide impulse die out as well.

I mean you can break hell loose and get away with some convoluted non dual reasoning

@Shin This is exactly how the devil takes over Reality. It can rationalize with any thing in any way. Playing the non-dual game is probably the easiest thing there is. As it is grounded in Reality, the theory and reasoning is impeccable as well.

https://www.dailyo.in/arts/osho-bhagwan-rajneesh-ma-anand-sheela-osho-exploited-women-group-therapy-wild-wild-country/story/1/23533.html This sure sounds ugly. It's very easy to talk about enlightenment all day after you've read 50 thousands books

We don't. We can only forcefully shove down all our knowledge down the throat and stay blind to it.

All this reminds of something I was reading in a Nisargadatta book 2 days back. Q: Why don't you make an ashram? Maharaj: So that I can be it's slave? This little conversation shows the reality of fame/validation. The so called bhagvaan/god Osho became the helpless slave of his own creation

Holy hell wtf I just watched

I think fame/validation was the start of downfall for Osho. It ended up producing a huge shadow spiraling downwards over the years. He got too much fame too quickly. He got 'Enlightened' in his early 20s even before graduating from college. His 'Enlightenment' was celebrated hugely by his devotees. Silver, golden jubilee and all that stupid shit. Fame/validation is such a pernicious bitch. The greed for women and gold sort of burns out itself and may wake one up from its grip. But fame isn't that obviously suffocating.

Good boy gettin' woke

Nihilism is just another trick of the mind. Another belief system to not accept the Truth as it is. The only way this hideous cancer can end is through the discovery that there is no such world and no such person to choose how to act in that world. Nothing else will resolve this dilemma once and for all

It is capable of experiencing godly level of pain and suffering as well. I guess it's a double edge sword. There is enlightenment as the greatest prize. There is also lots of ways in which one can fuck up real bad in life.

Actually all of this is very simple and raw, yet it's the toughest thing you will ever accept as a fact..the ONLY fact there really is. I don't get all the cryptic stuff in spirituality, it could be said much more clearly. Basically it boils down to this (you can test it right here right now). Notice that you are aware or present. Now look at all the thoughts, beliefs, sensations, perceptions you have right now. Do you see that only YOU (whatever that is) possess self-awareness? Do you see that only that 'self-knowledge' is direct and certain. The rest aka thoughts, beliefs, people, situation, body, world etc a mere imagination and indirect knowledge open to any alternate interpretation. Get this one more time. Only YOU are aware. No thought, people, body, world is directly aware. I am aware of everything. But no thing is aware of I. Every ounce of dilemma in our life is due to completely ignoring this basic (and ONLY) fact of Reality and instead taking all other unreal knowledge(thought, beliefs, interpretations, meaning etc) as real and true. If you can see the truth then congratulations, now good luck accepting it 100% in all it's ramifications. Do you see that every thought is bullshit? Do you see that every meaning is self-delusion, only possible to perpetuate as long as you are blind. Do you see that there is no world and no other people? Do you see that you don't and never existed as a located limited entity? Good luck stomaching all that. Right now, the bugs about 'other people' is killing me

I reached this same insight through self-inquiry. I'm in the process of stomaching the ramifications of this insight and accepting it 100%