Preetom

Yup Good boy needs to keep spinning the wheel and keep the fabrication going to create the sense of staying relevant. Or else good boy will simply evaporate. It will implode from its own contradictions

This is great! Until one sees there is no cake OR One cant make a cake AND eat it ?

There is a book called ''the end of your life" and also his free book the way of liberation where he talks about this stuff. From his own journey and from many of his students, he points out how one can have a sort of deep breakthrough and then how the ego can return through the backdoor and distort that entire thing for its own self agenda. How all of a sudden this ego can create an inflated god self image and think how it is above morality, ethics and nuance. Like a fish deluding itself by thinking how it is above the entire hydrodybamics of the ocean all of a sudden. Again, this ego fails to see the next step which is Nidhidhyasana(constant absorption) and instead nests itself in between a mixture of nondual theory and its own pet theories to remain there for life as a zen devil. He calls it a volatile complex between the real(consciousness) and unreal(egoic patterns) which is so twisted and dangerous.

Yes. But Leo never makes this distinction when he preaches about MANY degrees of Consciousness. I was pointing out the misleading contradictions of how he usually frames these things. The rest of the post was lol ?

Still this is contradictory and misleading. I added another paragraph in my previous post which points it out. The 'thing' that thinks it got enlightened yesterday and lost it today is not Consciousness. Of course there are MANY nuance and degrees of that 'thing'. But its sure as hell not the concern of solitary Consciousness. For Consciousness, there is no enlightenment and coming out of it.

Not everyone has balls of steel like good boy to withstand 8 bullets ?

But Leo?! Arent you making a serious logical contradiction here? Yes you can reduce and relate any objective system in terms of other objective system. But when it comes to Consciousness, we are in a whole different league now. It is of the nature of Ultimate, pure Subject, Pure sentiency and knowingness. And the ONLY way to 'know' Consciousness is to BE Consciousness. This is exactly why science or any objective operation will never be able to reduce/relate Consciousness into an objective system. Science has already debunked the so called 'life force' which we believed came and go with birth and death. In the future, Science might even figure out the mind, mapping out a periodic table of ''subtle elements", latent tendencies, causal realms, intellect so on and so forth. And all this is viable because all of them are 'objects' and thus could be further reduced into other objective operations. But the pure subject, Consciousness? Never. Isn't this why no metaphor, symbol, knowledge, system is able to 'touch' Consciousness in the first place? So the cat and dog example you gave is a serious contradiction. It's viable only while we are mingling with objective processes. Edit: And also your usual statement about MANY degrees of Consciousness is a huge contradiction. How can there be degrees or parts of the solitary, ultimate subject? Yes you can definitely say that there are infinite degrees and gradations when it comes to embodying, exploring, reflecting Consciousness and other relative realms. But saying Consciousness ITSELF has degrees, you are reducing it down as an objective phenomena.

no death no fun

Solipsism is THE most complimentary hypothesis to take on while going through the self inquiry journey. Whatever position you take, wherever you land on, there is this final gatekeeper(ego) in you that allows one to take the position. What is that ego? It kills all other philosophy and distractions and put the entire chip on this 'subject'. And when the truth about this subject is known, the truth of the entirety of Reality is known By the time you are done, you dont need solipsism as a theory or philosophy anymore because by that time, you'd directly know the Truth.

Lmao!! i got 60% GOD fat on my human body nibba ?

Yes some people even preach about enlightened ego. Absurd. Reminds me something from Adyashanti "There are few things more twisted and dangerous than an ego which thinks it is god" Cutest slave in the world ?

but Leo?! Are you in Vegas or is Vegas in you? ?

Totally agreed. Being in Truth has nothing to do with paranormal abilities. From Truth, conjuring up ghosts is as insignificant and irrelevant as snoring during sleep or any other mundane activities haha

The jokes are on you, joker You're eternally condemned to shine outwards As long as you are there, that is.

This is great. Thanks for reminding this

@whoareyou Martin is spot on! Thanks for posting that. Now i can clearly see what I was intuiting all along. Self inquiry, 5 meo, tantra etc. Doesn't matter. The bottomline is nondual absorption, in its fullest. Its not about insights, realizations, 'trying' to embody and integrate so on and so forth. Its like a ego trying to edit a semicolon or a letter in a code VS the entire OS being reinstalled. That is something no ego can ever accomplish.

Thank you

That's a really good question. And i think it beautifully explains the endgame of all spirituality nicely. What is known as 'flow' in common parlance, is you(consciousness) seeping and merging with your specific surrounding. It can be either through a hedonic activity like being engrossed in a video game, movie, sex etc or something less hedonic like being engrossed in a math problem or a physically exerting activity. Notice what happens. The burden of sense of self is gone and thats exactly why we crave this flow state. The self destructive activities are not seen as such to one who is engaged in them. To him, it is the cessation of this burden of sense of self, which feels great! Basically all our desires and fears are but urgent cries to drop this ego. All of survival instinct is but a cry to get relief from this sense of limited self. If one recognizes it, one is a spiritual seeker. If not, he is just another folk surviving through selfishness. But this 'flow' is NOT endgame of spirituality. If it were, then the best spiritual practice would be to constantly bombard oneself with hedonic activities, extreme physical exertions(some tradition has it) or just sleeping all day(some tradition has it as yoga nidra). This is clearly not the case! The end game of spirituality is not to merge your conscious existence to 'things' and your surrounding to make it absent for a while. But rather, it is about sinking and merging EVERYTHING back into your own being. So 'being' as spiritual practice and the 'flow' while playing football, both tastes kinda qualitatively similar. But the process or mechanism is reverse to one another. In 'flow' one merges oneself in things, only to come back again as the sense of self as one can never part with ones existence. While in spiritual being, things get merged into oneself...revealing the "eternal flow" which doesn't come and go

Okay cool. Good luck appreciating science. But also see that there will be people who wont be satisfied with that, so let them go their way. It takes nuance and considerable reasoning to start seeing whats actually going on here. You come to a point, when you realize that actually everyone is a spiritual seeker, whether one is pursuing lies or being doesn't matter. When one wants a cookie, one is actually wanting enlightenment. When one wants the new iPhone, even though he never frames it like that, deep down he actually feels he will be infinite when he gets that iPhone. When one sees this dynamic clearly, one is consciously a spiritual seeker. If not, then one is just living, shitting, fucking, eating, dying as long as life lasts

Like i said, there is qualitative difference between just saying/preaching that and consciously being that. Yes conceptually speaking, doing/thinking is being. But when you are really being, it doesn't 'feel' like doing/thinking. One only calls that doing/thinking when being is seemingly lost, and so one can at best try to conceptualize being from memory. Are you open to the possibility that the state of deep dreamless sleep is still prevailing right now? You didn't wake up from sleep this morning. Rather, this waking state merely got superimposed on that deep dreamless sleep. Like an extra layer superimposed on a base. That sleep 'state' is the closest to your being where no objective knowledge functions. When you sink into being, you can verify this. Now there is qualitative difference in merely uttering that and actually sinking into that

Thank you for beautifully elaborating on this. On that final statement, I can see why many disagreement lies on what is enlightenment as that word gets thrown around so often. That discovery, understanding and conviction that one is pure knowing is so vital. But IMO thats only the beginning of real journey towards enlightenment. This is where neo advaita and commonplace flowery spiritual teaching falls short by stopping at this stage. They try to make a seeker enlightened by blasting them with non dual quotes and feel good spiritual ideas like it is all one, there is nothing left to do, you are god, all is love, no one is going no where etc. I notice this same tendency a lot in this forum where "enlightened masters" write as if their words will permanently awaken the seeker right then and there. In other words, Advaita turns into religion or philosophy. It makes me cringe ? At this point, arises this pernicious problem. There is still an ego mind. And now it tries to believe all the non dual quotes and tries to follow and emulate a non dual enlightenment standard in the name of 'integration' and 'embodiment', as if this ego will one day shine as all powerful God made out of love. But what i found out from research is the exact opposite. After having glimpses and being fairly convinced that one is pure knowing, the next thing to do is nidhidhyasana(constant absorption). Basically from this point on, one knows exactly what one is shooting for and knows what to ignore. This is where real meditation begins. Basically, one needs to absorb oneself more and more in this ''pure knowing/consciousness'' by any means (sell inquiry or psychedelic) and stay as little time as possible functioning as the ego. This is where psychedelic falls short, it is excellent to instantly show you what you are existentially but it can't help with absorption in that truth. Because staying 10 hours everyday on psychedelics will be overkill on your system. This is where 'harmless' deep meditation and being sessions come in. This is the original meaning of 'integretion'. It is NOT an ego trying to embody and living up to non dual truth, trying to be in the present, trying to be all loving and compassionate. But rather it is about slowly erasing the entire system of ego/mind/character by simply depriving them of attention, as ones attention is constantly absorbed in pure knowing. This is real spiritual integration. Its not consciousness that expands more and more, goes higher and higher to include everything. Rather, it is EVERYTHING that gets reduced and sunk into consciousness once and for all, only to find out this was always the case. The self literally dies as ego and gets reborn as Reality. The center of gravity called I has shifted from ego to Reality. And that attunement is done through absorption, not by books or listening to neo advaita. And traditionally speaking, only that is the original definition of enlightenment. Anything before that is simply just ego still deluding itself by pretending. God got punked by God

Joke Take care

@Key Elements You are like the only mod here who consistently fights with Leo ? Kudos