Natasha Tori Maru

@AtmanIsBrahman Oh - rhetoric is not a comment about the substance of your posts. It is the way it is said and the type of language you employ to make the point.

What emotions / feelings come up for you? Sympathy, heartbreak, disgust, sadness, pity etc So you feel compelled to action?

You have adopted Leo's rhetoric.

@Raze So the claim was that most women would have sex with Justin Bieber. Let say thats 51% Between my mum (60) and my grandmother (97) - do you think either of them would? Just pointing out how crazy/poking fun at the example, given no additional demographics or information

@Jirh Values can provide stability, but they aren't set in stone. You can reassess them as one gains experience and new information. Logic can assist in pursuing goals consistently, but it cannot determine what is worth pursuing in the first place. My point is that decisions are value-based, and values involve feelings and emotions. I feel like you might be conflating logic with emotional suppression - unless I am wrong in understanding.

I don't understand. Right vs wrong is usually a value based judgement. Values have an affective dimension. How can you decide what is right and wrong without values, preferences, goals - all of which do not arise from logic alone? I see a difference between using logic to evaluate a judgement and having a basis for what matters in the first place.

I just asked 3 girlfriends on my weekly lunch catchup. Then my grandmother, mum and sister. For shits and giggles I also asked my dad's partner who works downstairs. I did some recon! Not one of them would sleep with Justin Bieber. All of them commented on him looking like a crack head these days and "only a small amount of women are full groupie mode" was the consensus. Even when he was younger - no go.

I'M FUCKING DECEASED why do I want this so bad, it looks delicious. gief to me

This is closer to my understanding as well. Just one example are rates of violent crime perpetrated by men. That is a huge amount of emotion/feeling based decision making. I just don't buy that women are more emotional/feeling and make more decisions from this space. How can you make a decision without values, which are based on feelings/emotions? Reasoning does not determine what is worth pursuing. Values, goals and preferences supply that direction (but reason/emotion are not mutually exclusive). Expression is something different from influence.

So the fundamental issue is a lack of direct feedback with reality. That would do fucked up things to your ability to navigate and interact with the world. Reality is the feedback mechanism through which you learn how to navigate reality. Imagine trying to navigate the real world with only an abstracted representation as your wisdom/guidance? The pushback/feedback would be really unexpected and lead to cognitive dissonance.

In no particular order: Health Epistemic clarity/Truth Integrity/Honesty Intellectual independence/Autonomy Connection Integration Competence/effectiveness Beauty/Aesthetics Compassion Fairness/Justice All of these seems to be coherent around the broader themes of contact with reality, ethical consistency & development through engagement when I think on it. I find my values conflict the most around my commitment to truth and intellectual integrity and my commitment to fairness and humane treatment.

Why Belief Is Wrong Shamelessly millennial coded: Perhaps Bull-Shit and Belief-System were always synonymous

Can you explain this a bit more? Expand on how one makes decisions without emotion/feeling being a component?

@Schizophonia one anecdote

@Jirh I appreciate the insight (⁠⊃⁠｡⁠•́⁠‿⁠•̀⁠｡⁠)⁠⊃

@Jirh I do agree with most of the above - but this was not what the post was saying I was responding to.

No. Correlation isn't causation. I reject this. If appreciate you don't tell me how I am. You don't know anything. I can think of many examples that might question if men are less emotional.

Weakness makes Humility I really enjoyed this. It will be a good slow burner for many. Long enduring and intermittently resonant. The implied reversal of the usual moral hierarchy is very well done. A strong person may be less developed in one respect than the vulnerable person; strength is doing the work to insulate them from realities they have not yet to to confront.

Low dose mushrooms seem to be okay on me. I seem to reach some threshold very easily where I lose it. Repeated experiences of losing all my teeth, regrowing them from strange locations (knuckles, between toes, from my forehead), and people turning into incorporeal wraiths with huge, floating red orbs for eyes. The eyes are particularly demonic. Sometimes they fall out of the faces I see, or burst. The variance of drug effects across individuals depending on physiology is crazy. LSD isn't too bad on my system!

@Olaf yes, children mostly cry as a way to signal distress. Regardless of if that "distress" is warranted or not 😁

@Olaf I've always been like this. If anything, becoming more conscious increased my crying! I feel my emotions much more authentically, in a much wider range and with more depth. They are more transient now though. Intense, then done. Back to baseline. I don't feel the need to act on them or solve them any longer. 'Solving' emotions isn't quite right. They are there to be felt, or inspected as a pointer toward an interpretation of meaning,

@Olaf A romantic relationship? Based on history, very little. I tend to cry from sadness or distress mostly when overwhelmingly frustrated (not often, as I am a very capable person with enormous capacity for stress & pressure) or after a breakup. The men I have been with have cried more than myself - and it is not a turnoff for me to witness. I don't experience crying from movies or touching moments. I have cried more in relationship for the happiness of my partner in jubilation than out of distress. I cry very, very often because of music that touches me. This is my biggest "cry" release. Often it is because I am so moved to joy. The tears are happy for me. Based on feedback from people I know, I do not have a common pattern of emotional display

Gotta agree with this. Phenomenology of AI - no reliable basis for claiming it does. Awareness of itself - no reliable basis for claiming it does. Does AI experience itself as a subject? On the flip side, there isn't evidence for any absence of these capacities. 'I don't know" seems to be the only reasonable stance.

You do realise there are many, many other possible explanations for tears, right?

Oh, fuck! I heard he passed and was dismayed to see he was 34yo - I didn't know it was suicide. My heart is broken for victims of suicide