Natasha Tori Maru

@AtmanIsBrahman Oh - rhetoric is not a comment about the substance of your posts. It is the way it is said and the type of language you employ to make the point.

You have adopted Leo's rhetoric.

@Raze So the claim was that most women would have sex with Justin Bieber. Let say thats 51% Between my mum (60) and my grandmother (97) - do you think either of them would? Just pointing out how crazy/poking fun at the example, given no additional demographics or information

@Jirh Values can provide stability, but they aren't set in stone. You can reassess them as one gains experience and new information. Logic can assist in pursuing goals consistently, but it cannot determine what is worth pursuing in the first place. My point is that decisions are value-based, and values involve feelings and emotions. I feel like you might be conflating logic with emotional suppression - unless I am wrong in understanding.

I don't understand. Right vs wrong is usually a value based judgement. Values have an affective dimension. How can you decide what is right and wrong without values, preferences, goals - all of which do not arise from logic alone? I see a difference between using logic to evaluate a judgement and having a basis for what matters in the first place.

I just asked 3 girlfriends on my weekly lunch catchup. Then my grandmother, mum and sister. For shits and giggles I also asked my dad's partner who works downstairs. I did some recon! Not one of them would sleep with Justin Bieber. All of them commented on him looking like a crack head these days and "only a small amount of women are full groupie mode" was the consensus. Even when he was younger - no go.

I'M FUCKING DECEASED why do I want this so bad, it looks delicious. gief to me

This is closer to my understanding as well. Just one example are rates of violent crime perpetrated by men. That is a huge amount of emotion/feeling based decision making. I just don't buy that women are more emotional/feeling and make more decisions from this space. How can you make a decision without values, which are based on feelings/emotions? Reasoning does not determine what is worth pursuing. Values, goals and preferences supply that direction (but reason/emotion are not mutually exclusive). Expression is something different from influence.

So the fundamental issue is a lack of direct feedback with reality. That would do fucked up things to your ability to navigate and interact with the world. Reality is the feedback mechanism through which you learn how to navigate reality. Imagine trying to navigate the real world with only an abstracted representation as your wisdom/guidance? The pushback/feedback would be really unexpected and lead to cognitive dissonance.

In no particular order: Health Epistemic clarity/Truth Integrity/Honesty Intellectual independence/Autonomy Connection Integration Competence/effectiveness Beauty/Aesthetics Compassion Fairness/Justice All of these seems to be coherent around the broader themes of contact with reality, ethical consistency & development through engagement when I think on it. I find my values conflict the most around my commitment to truth and intellectual integrity and my commitment to fairness and humane treatment.

Why Belief Is Wrong Shamelessly millennial coded: Perhaps Bull-Shit and Belief-System were always synonymous

Can you explain this a bit more? Expand on how one makes decisions without emotion/feeling being a component?

@Schizophonia one anecdote

@Jirh I appreciate the insight (⁠⊃⁠｡⁠•́⁠‿⁠•̀⁠｡⁠)⁠⊃

@Jirh I do agree with most of the above - but this was not what the post was saying I was responding to.