Karmadhi

Is Ben Gvir and Smotrich popular in Israel? Not to your friends per say but in general. Non Israelis tend to use them as proof whenever they want to shit on Israel "Look at these 2 guys, this is the face of Israel", is a typical comment you will get from people living in Europe for example.

Totally agree here.

Look I am not denying that they ORIGINATED from the Middle East. But when you stay 2000 years in Europe, you adopt European values and even your genetic composition changes you basically can be considered European. I mean, we all came from Africa originally yet we do not all call each other African. DNA tests are not allowed in Israel. Bibi came from Poland for example. He does not look Arab and even his last name used to be different, a Polish one until he changed it for political reasons. Same for Smotrich, he is Ukranian. There are some Arab Jews, like Ben Gvir is from Morocco for example but most are not from that region region. Palestinians tend to come from that region region. So they are more indeginious imo. The connection Israelis had with that land 2000 years ago is a legit thing, but it does not justify displacing locals imo. Key word here is IMO. Maybe some see it differently. I know Putin does which is why he thinks Ukraine should be 1 with Russia, because of shit from 700 years ago. But I do not agree with Putin on that one.

@Danioover9000 Bruh i cant...

Jesus Christ. I will explain to you in detail to avoid confusion. Basically, what I mean is this. German citizens born during that era who were prone to propaganda, hatred, self bias and group think, tended to support the Nazis. That is how the Nazis gained power. By creating this view that Germans are the most important group and everyone else is totally irrelevant in comparison. This is called self bias and Leo talks about it a lot. When you say that you are down to kill 240.000 civilians just to save 4 of your own, you are basically operating under the same selfish biased frequency that many Germans did during that time. Sorry but when you say "A fingernail of a Jewish person is more important than all Palestinians" you sound genocidal and extremely hateful and biased. Just like the Nazis were. I am not saying you would support a genocide out of the blue like the Nazis did. I am saying your mind is equal to the immense bias that most Germans fell into and became Nazis. Hope it is more clear now. Well considering Israel is the most hated country in the world right now, it seems so.

That goes both ways. If Jews went back to Europe from Israel that also would solve many issues. And they are more compatible with Europe than Palestinians are and Europe has a soft spot for them now. Better solution to me, if you want to go down that route.

Israel is a prime example that moral development is not linked with techonology development nor economic development. If you see interviews of people in Israel they seem to be openly ok with genocide and ethnic cleansing. Here in Western Europe where I live it is out of the world to openly have such views. And Western Europe has also suffered from terrorist attacks in the last 10 years. So that is not an excuse.

Considering most of them are Europeans it makes sense. They are not Middle Easterns “Killing Of Innocent Is Not Unique Here” | Ex-IDF Soldier Slams Israeli Government For War In Gaza (youtube.com) Some facts from someone that has been there. One example of humanity s best.

😂 Im still hoping its trolling man

I think this represents what is wrong with Israel. People like you would have supported Nazis if born in Germany during that time. Self bias beyond belief. Comical level to the point where I cannot tell if it is troll or not. You seem like your average Ben Gvir supporter. Thank you for giving us insight into how the radical Zionist that supports Ben Gvir in Israel thinks. @Danioover9000 @lina @zazen Check this out. We have a winner for the most biased guy on this thread.

@Samsonov Thank you so much. Your unbiased analysis is needed in a sea of pro Israeli shameless bias. I had one last question. Here you basically described to me why IDF people enroll and why they want to kill Hamas. That I can understand and I find reasonable. What I wanted to know, is why they do things like snipe childreen and other stuff like that which is not related to killing Hamas fighters. Why post videos with women lingerine making fun of it etc. How is this related to killing Hamas fighters which are adult males.

If they do a peace deal they will have much more reason to rejoice when 100 hostages get freed. And nobody would have to die. What is the issue with that?

What unconditionally? Are you blaming Palestinian kids now? Get it over your head. Palestinian kids are equally innocent to those hostages. They got no blame for what Hamas does. None. If mostly Hamas was killed to get those hostages, it would be acceptable. When you kill innocent people that are living their life then basically you create 10x the devilry Hamas created. The issue with you is that you seem to think most Palestinians are responsible which is a genocidal mindset. Sad.

Why is it so hard for the pro Isarelis to realize this? Esepcially the ones that do not even live in Israel but support Israel current actions like some of the people here. I can understand if you actually live in Israel and live in the echo chamber there, but if you live in Europe or the US, why not realize that much? Ironically the most hardcore pro Israeli actions here do not even live in Israel.

No they didnt. There was every year fighting there. Plus who started it is irrelevant at this point. Why dont they do a peace deal to free them? There were countless proposals including from Biden recently. If Hamas rejects all of them your reasoning would make more sense but when there is another solution, then you have no excuse. I should remind you that from fighting there has been a total of 7 hostages freed, meanwhile from a peace deal you had over 100 in November which were freed. So negotiations work better. Truth is Israel government does not give a shit and is just using hostages as propaganda fuel to continue their true goal which is genocide and ethnic cleansing. Which is why he will have an arrest warrant for war crimes soon . Very ethical indeed. I expect you to take responsability and blame your policies as much as Hamas for what happened and put an end to them. Not double down on what created Hamas on the first place. Ask yourself, why Hamas is popular? Also ask yourself, why is the entire world so disgusted by what Israel is doing? Leo said it very clearly, as long as Israelis do not look themselves in the mirror and admit they are devils then this will never end. So I would avoid music festivals in Israel for some time now, because another attack will happen with the new Hamas that this genocidal war will create. "If we had to kill 270,000 to get four hostages we would do that as well". I wonder if you would go around in the world asking people, would you rather have 1 innocent citizen of your country live over 100 innocent citizens of another country, how many would pick the 100. Only in Israel i see this perspective where their own citizens matter more than the entire world. It may sound cute, but it leads to much devilry. The definition of bias.

And they follow Leo s work. Imagine those that dont. Bias times 100.

Exactly.

Fair point. Still Israel has a duty under law not to harm civilians in mass. Therefore they are still to be blamed. Which is why the ICJ and the ICC have cases against them. This argument is used as an excuse for collective punishment against the whole population, most of whom are innocent. What fault do the civilians have that some Hamas radicals end up in buildings close to them? Jewish, anti-Zionist activist describes her experience living in Gaza (youtube.com) Seems like a normal society to me.

Dude, they are starving. See images of them. They look like skeletons. The hostages I saw their footage. They seemed healthy and well fed. Hamas will not kill them. They are useful for Hamas.

@Nivsch Can you explain me how killing 270 civilians is worth saving 4 people and then being happy about it? It is a horrible ratio and a shame.

I think their goal is to basically make all ex USSR states, Russian puppet states or at least friendly to Russia. That is wrong but US does the same. Where I draw the line is when you start invading countries and taking land from them and deporting people. That is totally unacceptable. Which is why I am critical of this war. I want it to end mostly for humanitarian reasons. Mendling in elections, although wrong, is done by everyone so to me it is nothing new.

I have friends from Ukraine and they told me that in general Western Ukraine never liked Russia much. Eastern Ukraine before the war was more chill about them. To be honest, I can understand the sentiment. I am just surprised it is only towards Russia. My guess would be because Ukraine stayed with Russia during USSR. I am only refering before 2014. Now I would assume the entire Ukraine hates Russia and that is normal. No no. I was saying they should have done a referendum before this war started. Ideally in 2014. Before all the fighting. An honest referendum observed by the UN and see how people felt. Just like they did in Scotland. Depending on the results they would either stay in Ukraine or join Russia. Instead a war started in 2014. That was wrong. I do not expect now those regions to be much pro Russia considering the shit Russia did there. If it is such an European war how come Europe is barely providing weapons to Ukraine and US is the main provider? USA is much involved in it. It will appear like a US issue when the news are about "US decided or did not decide to give aid to Ukraine, without US aid Ukraine will loose etc etc". It paints a picture that basically the US decides the fate of Ukraine. Europe is not doing enough military wise. They should be the main weapon provider to Ukranine.

https://www.aljazeera.com/gallery/2024/6/8/hospital-overwhelmed-with-victims-of-israeli-attacks-on-central-gaza This is the price paid to release 4 civilians in Gaza. Only a sick twisted mind would consider this a victory and celebration material. It is a price too high to pay.

Name me some colonialism happening right now except that? You could argue with what Russia is doing in Eastern Ukraine but there is also tons of outrage about that. The Roman empire did indeed kick them out. But humans in time change and evolve. They may come from the land, but after 2000 years it is irrelevant where they came from. They no longer are from there. By that logic we all came from Africa. This is silly. By 1947 Jews were European and that land was Arab land. You could argue you had Arab Jews but that is something else. The truth is that Europe did not want Jews in it anymore so they just dumped them into Palestine because it was their colony so they could. Everything else is just bs they say to look like the good guys. I feel sorry for those Jews but 2 wrongs do not make a right. So because they got killed does not give them right to steal land and kill others. Point is that you do not use history from 2000 years ago to justify land grabing now. Imagine if the entire world started doing that. That is exactly the argument Putin uses in his illegal unjust war in Ukraine. He says "Russia and Ukraine were 1 unit 800 years ago so Ukraine does not exist, it is Russia. We need to take them". That mindset leads to devilry and war and bad things. You can blame the Roman Empire for kicking out the Jews 2000 years ago but it is not the current Palestinians living there in 1948 fault that it happened. Therefore their houses should have stayed as theirs.

The fault is with most of the world treating them like they are special. The West should sanction the shit out of them and cut all diplomatic ties, enforce visas on their citizens etc , that will force them to wake up and improve their ways. A spoiled brat will stay a brat.