Moksha

Completely conceptual. My humble question: are you still suffering? If so, maybe concepts aren't all they're cracked up to be

As I see it, enlightenment is experiential, not conceptual. It is not an understanding that you achieve; it is a resonance that you experience, where You become one with You. Literally, the word means "being filled with light". You will experience enlightenment, not when you suddenly know the answers to all questions, but when you recognize the dissolving of ego and the end of suffering.

Yes, this is why I see enlightenment as a journey rather than a realization. Many of us have experienced the awakening of ourselves to ourselves, but that is only the first step. The spiritual practice is to then sustain that awakening regardless of what is happening around us, and in the process dissolve our attractions and aversions. I doubt anyone in this forum is completely free from suffering yet. It is possible, but it has happened to very few people on the planet.

I believe the end of suffering begins when we realize that we are more than our conditioned mind. We still experience pain in life, but suffering is self-created pain: the state of mind-identification. When we are present in the Now, we are free from suffering.

Maybe that's why Source creates. Eternity.

I believe enlightenment is nonconceptual. There is no understanding beyond simply experiencing yourself as awareness, and learning to keep the flame of your presence steady despite what happens in the world around you.

For me, it's not that the existential questions have been answered, but that they no longer matter.

I see enlightenment as a journey, not an event. It begins with the realization that we are more than our conditioned minds, but that is only the first step on the path. Existential questions can be fun, but they can also become a distraction. For me, enlightenment is the process of sustaining presence in this moment, and participating in the creative purpose of the universe. It is ultimately dissolving our attachments, because we experience that everything we need is already here.

I just came across a Buddha story on the subject of this thread, and it taught me an important truth. Enlightenment is the path to living, not a course on metaphysics. Sometimes we (at least I) get caught up in concepts instead of focusing on the message of the Buddha. If you're interested, here's the story:

The word "exist" literally means "to stand out". For something to exist, it has to be manifested. Source doesn't exist, but it is real. Matter and energy exist. They are real, but are restricted to the dimension of form. They are caused and enlivened by Source. As such they are part of Source, and they cannot exist without Source. Here's a passage from the Bhagavad Gita that I came across last night. It summarizes how I see Source interacting with the world of form:

@James123 Peace.

People aren't thoughts. We are physical bodies/personality (Form) paired with consciousness (Source). Our Form identity is ephemeral, and dissipates at death. Our Source identity is unchanging, and is one with the Source that enlivens all beings. And yes, duality exists, but only within the world of name and form. Transcendent reality is nondual.

Practices for learning how to love others: Be in a healthy relationship Raise a child Serve a cause that helps society or the planet Ponder the collective wisdom of the ages and apply it to your life Recognize the light of consciousness that is within you, and that connects you to every other being

It's popular to dismiss our little-selves as pure illusion. I see it differently. The world of form isn't unreal. Matter and energy exist. Humans exist, if only for a very brief period of time. We are waves on the vast ocean of Source, but we are still waves and we are still born from that Source.

Lol, I hear you. The ego is the illusion and all of us are the same dreamer. You are not alone; the rest of us are here too, but we are one reality discovering and having a conversation with itself

Just pointing out that enlightenment implies time. Unless you are born enlightened, time has to pass before you become enlightened. That is the paradoxical interaction between the transcendent and form dimensions.

Good to hear. I'm a noob on psychedelics, but I can see it being a pathway to initially getting past the natural limits of the conditioned mind. My sense is that there is still a lot of personal work involved with letting go of ego and the mind's attachments. Durable growth is more than just a realization or a thought experiment.

How can you awaken unless you were once asleep? If you were once asleep, how can there be no time?

Yes. Duality exists in the dimension of form; it couldn't be otherwise. Time and form are essentially divisive. Just because transcendent truth is a nonduality doesn't mean this world is unreal. Matter and energy exist, whether people want to admit it or not.

It's a paradox of this dimension. If being is always, how can it exist in the world of form and time? Enlightenment requires time, but if enlightenment is the realization of being how can it happen in the first place? On your question: In the dimension of time, death is the separation of being from form. In the transcendent dimension, being always is.

In the transcendent dimension, there is only being. In the form dimension, there is only doing. Human beings are a hybrid of the two dimensions, and we have the capacity to both be and do. Until we die, and then we dissolve and we're back to only being

I once dreamed that I dreamed that I was dreaming. Yes, even direct, undeniable, nonconceptual experience could be an illusion. But it's the closest thing we have to existential knowledge. Descartes took a step when he deduced, "I think, therefore I am." The gurus take it one step further: "I observe, therefore I am." And the ascended take the final step: "I am."

Ultimately, Self-knowledge is the only knowledge. I don't frequently agree with @Someone here, but his last post about direct experience was spot on. You can only know the truth of who you are by experiencing it directly. If concepts are involved, that's not it.

@Someone here You are Awareness, which is aware of itself. That Awareness is peace, intelligence, creativity, and love. You don't feel these qualities, you are them. On dying, yes. The little self will die, and it's ok to mourn that. Reminds me of the aspirant who discovered his Zen master on a rock crying. "Master, why are you crying?”. “I have just lost my son.” “But if everything is an illusion why are you crying?” “Because this is the saddest illusion of them all.”

@Someone here Yes, you are peace. You are love. You are joy. If you have experienced that, you are on the awakening path.