Prathibha

Put the headphones on, close your eyes and you will be in a mysterious space!!

Close to 5 hours of pure pleasure listening to this!! Very interesting conversation, especially for someone like me with glimpses of oneness here and there, but still trying to grope it mentally and gets frustrated and pleased at the same time doing so. This is a cherry on the cake for all the consciousness related talks Leo has done. Worth the time. Dr. Bernardo Kastrup is phenomenal in explaining this unexplainable thing. Enjoy!!

Thanks everyone for replying. I see some very interesting Q&A and feedback. I started 'I am a strange loop' by Douglas Hofstadter. That kind of put my question to rest. I dont know what took me so long to read it especially after watching 'strange loops' episode more than a year ago and being very intrigued by it. Anyways, better late than never. The book is taking me so deep inside that i have had so many piffanies while reading it and going into trans with it that, now i feel 'what is thought' question and expecting to get it answered in words itself was futile and naive. I really appreciate everyone who took a stab at it and helped me. Thank you, Prathibha

In my experience, the thoughts are always in words or images like stories or a short movie. If I was visually, audibly and speech impaired, who has never spoken, never heard sounds and never seen anything, how would I experience a thought? Please do not take these impairments literally, What I am basically trying to ask is what is there to an experience of thought underneath these complex, subjective layers of sounds, words and images. I experience the "hologramy" nothingness of my surroundings including my body when I sit with my eyes open long enough in a place and get deep into myself (kind of visual meditation or I don't know what to call it, I just do it for the fun of it) but I cannot escape the labeling of the things, like I cant help recognizing a tree and calling it a tree for example. How do I get underneath it where the experience is more raw, underneath the labeling and underneath the recognition of shapes and calling them by their names. It is so hard even to put my question in words, hope someone gets what I am trying to ask. Thanks in advance.

@Breakingthewall who is "you"? Isnt it an another thought or should i say a combination of thoughts so to speak? I see that fellow actualizers have said a thought is nothing, emerges from nothing. I do have had the experience of nothing. I see from my direct experience that it has no palpable, tangible material, but it is still percievable "something". When I dont give any meaning to it like i said in my example, do not call a shape of a tree by the name tree, then what is it or what that experience would be? That was my true question. I see many friends have addressed the question in the subject line. I tried to explain what my actual question in the details box. I am still where i was. How do i not label things and experience the reality as raw. It is almost impossible for me not to label things. Even not to call a thought, a thought. That is where i am stuck. ?

This is one of the high quality interviews where both parties are so open minded about the topic and exploring together. I thoroughly enjoyed this interview. Great material for what it's worth. 3+ hours long but doesn't lose the grip even for a second. Hope you guys enjoy too. Link: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CmieNQH7Q4w

Hi Leo, Can you please consider taking a stab at explaining how time and space are illusions and can be dissolved? I am able to get my head around the concept of time to some extent but the concept of space is something too hard to get rid of. Thanks,

@Leo Gura point taken. I must thank you for all your videos since last one year or so. 'What is god, no BS exp' video came as recommendation on Youtube slightly more than a year ago which i ignored few times. Then finally i gave it a listen when the recommendation wouldnt just go away. Thats how i stumbled upon actualized. You have answered so many of my questions i had for couple of years through videos on reality, god, truth, perception, survival, relativism (are my favs which i listen many times). Really appreciate your effort in spreading this. Great work buddy! Do you think i should up my dose for the next trip?

A little background I had been planning to do this for over five months now. I made all preparations to get hold of the substance last December. When it was time to take the last few final steps, I wandered off fooling myself around with excuses, rights and wrongs, reasoning how busy I am and blah blah blahs.. More than a week ago, I finally knew I had to do this and cannot put it off any longer for the sake of my own sanity. So I ordered. Once it arrived, I took a day off from work before the long weekend and decided to do it very early in the morning when my husband and little one are still in dreamland. I did not want to be disturbed. I prepared my husband few days in advance and asked him not to freak out if he heard me making noises in the basement early in the morning. He just gave me this unbelievable smile that said ‘You are crazy’, but he also knew that everybody has got an itch that they must scratch. He is very familiar with my spiritual endeavors, the frustrations I go through, the insights, breakthroughs, craziness everything that comes with journey, even though he never understood why I put myself through this rather than just being happy with what is. He is so simple and content that sometimes I suspect that he is already enlightened and is just messing with me.. LOL. Two days before ‘The day’ I went and reread the trip reports online, gave Youtube reports another listen. Even though most of them were very encouraging, DrMobius report on 40mg trip in actualized forum really shook me (Sorry, no offense meant DrMobius). Last thing I wanted was, me screaming on top of my lungs in the basement and my neighbors calling 911 on my husband for domestic violence. LOL. I was super nervous for two days just for that reason and could not sleep well at nights. I even thought of dropping the whole idea but I knew that was not an option. I read Rupert Spira’s ‘The presence, The intimacy of experience’ which really helped me calm down and put things into perspective. The beginning I had prepared the dosage a day ago. So early in the morning, I listened to a video that would help me with this journey to calm my nerves. I just settled myself in the basement and snorted those tiny lines, massaged me nostrils, sat my head hanging down for a minute. It had bitter smell like a bitter melon but didn’t taste anything in my mouth though. I was so excited; I was anxiously waiting for it to start any moment. I lied down and started staring at the ceiling listening to the loud sound of the furnace in the basement. Nothing happened for what felt like 3-4 minutes, but just the smell of 5 meo and the sound of furnace and my heart racing of excitement and nervousness. Then my vision slowly felt a bit blurry and I could feel my heart racing at a pace which was beyond I had felt ever before. I checked myself, my thoughts, asked myself if I am scared. It was a strange feeling, I was excited and scared of the unknown that would follow but not really fear of losing anything. I followed Leo’s suggestion and relaxed my body, took deep breaths, kept telling myself ‘relax, surrender, let it happen’. Last thing I wanted was to let go of this opportunity. I started feeling drowsy and loose. Felt my body having thousands of tiny vibrating cells and they were popping and disappearing one by one making each part of the body so light as if it didn’t exist. That continued and the whole body felt light. I checked my thoughts again and took deep breaths. The middle I don’t remember how far in the journey this happened. I knew I was there, I had a body (from memory) and I knew which room I was in. I couldn’t feel the body as I usually do. Even though I was lying down, it felt like there was no ground underneath me. Not a floating feeling either, just very light or absence of heaviness that come with body (I didn’t realize body feels heavy until this moment). My heart rate felt close to regular but there was a backdrop of scared feeling all through. First thing I did was to make a fist and open and look at my hand. All of a sudden, the hand was in super HD - every contour, line, color, smallest hair on my arm. I knew it was my hand but it had never appeared so clearly. I desperately wanted to feel grounded again, I rolled to my left and then to right just to feel the ground beneath me or to hang on to some anchor. I felt the rustle of the sheets but nothing substantial. The touch was softer, the vision was HD, furnace sound in the background was audible too but much sharper. Furnace stopped (as it always goes on and off to regulate the temperature) and everything was so quiet. This was even scarier as sound was the only thing that was familiar in this state and it was gone. I felt the feeling to get out of this situation rushing in. I reminded myself that the resistance would make it worse and I am here for a reason. Again, deep breaths, relax and kept telling myself to allow this whole thing whatever it is. I touched the wall as I could reach it from the place where I was lying down. I saw my hands touching it and wall resisting my hand but I could not really feel the resistance. It was only visual. I kept on looking at my hand, moving fingers, rolling from left to right to feel the body, feel something that I can hold on to. Everything was just visual, no feeling of touch or any bodily sensations except the sound of my breath. The walls were sometimes closer, sometimes farther, I was geometrically challenged at this point. I wanted to stand up but there was not enough willingness to stand up, also everything felt slow as in I could not do rapid movements. It felt like there was no willingness to move rapidly even if I wanted to. I really was scared and at some point I was hoping that my husband would walk down the stairs and hold me. I just wanted to feel some bodily sensation which was not happening at all even though I could see it. It didn’t feel like I was in that state for too long but it was very overwhelming. Then, I felt a sudden heaviness of my body and I thought its over but it was momentary. I was back in dangled situation. This happened few more times, I didn’t know how much time had passed. I slowly started realizing that I am coming back to the known reality and I kept telling myself not to resist anything that is happening. Everything will be over in 45 mins as they said in the trip report. I saw my phone lying on the other end on which I has set the timer. I wanted to check it, but there was no willingness. The Ending After few more times of back and forth between feeling the body and not feeling the body and my mind trying to understand this while it was all happening, I felt like just giving up. I felt very drowsy and I thought I might fall asleep. I so wanted to come back that I thought to myself ‘F* this, let’s just fall asleep. By the time I wake up it will all be fine’. By then I was able to move more than before and I drew the blanket over me and tried to sleep. Closing and opening eyes changed the visual but had no difference in the state as such. After tossing and turning to grope on to the known reality, sensation, it slowly came back. I just lied there until I knew for sure that I can see my ‘regular-definition’ hands again. Finally, I reached my phone as everything started feeling more normal and I saw 55 mins had passed since I snorted the substance. It certainly didn’t feel that long. I took few long deep breaths and let myself feel heavy again as I have a body, the familiar me. I was not at all in awe. I was more like ‘what was that?’ Not in a bad way, just curious, surprised and most of all relieved to be back. After an hour and fifteen minutes, I was able to walk upstairs and curl up next to my 4-year-old, deep in sleep. I smelled her, kissed her cheek and touched her hair. Everything was so real and tangible. For me, this felt like reality and what happened in the last hour felt like a dream. I thought to myself, if this is an illusion, then what a wonderful illusion it is. I snuggled closer to her and tried to sleep. I couldn’t. Aftermath It was a very interesting experience especially for a person like me who had never done any psychedelic before. I have no point of reference since I never had high experiences with regular socially accepted substances like alcohol etc., The farthest I ever went was feeling super sleepy after a glass of wine. So, I have no idea what to make out the whole experience. From other reports that I have read and heard, I know that I did not reach where I wanted with this experiment. However, I do not know how far I got either. I am a bit disappointed that I took this leap and it was no more than an interesting experience. On the other hand, I am glad that it was an interesting experience. Though I may not try this again for few days, I have not completely shut the doors to psychedelics. I did find meditation more satisfying than this experience. May be the dosage was too small, the resistance was too high (even though it did not feel like I was resisting hard), not sure. Thanks for reading.

@lostmedstudent . I will consider it if my next trip goes south too. Thanks for the inputs. Appreciate it.

@EntheogenTruthSeeker thanks for the input. I will give it my best.