gswva

Ok, I'm going in. I don't see anymore how I can stay true to myself, and true to Love if I don't let go.

@Meta-Man Isn't the ego pretty much Love tricking itself into selfishness?

This is a clear and well written post. Right now, all I have is a bunch of understandings on duality, but after reading it from myself, I feel I'm going to let it go as well. Do you mind sharing some guidance? Is enlightenment a temporary or permanent change of perspective? What do we get to keep "after" the experience of self? Will I keep being able to work on all the projects and ideas I have? Also, all understandings only help scratching the surface of the ego, but I can't go past the stage where some belief like "I need to breath" come to mind. I know that there isn't any biological entity in a physical world that needs oxygen in order to say alive, pure imagination, but it's easier said that done. I only have to let go everything and become pure awareness, is that right?

What do you mean? I'm open to more understandings inside duality, but if I said something wrong based on the experience itself. I'm sorry!

@Meta-Man I mean in the sense that the perspective itself is pure imagination. It could've been anything.

There is nothing. We are all alone together. A profound loneliness in the plane of all possible existence. You are dreaming by yourself in a forever ineluctable self-chase. You might not need psychedelics, meditation or death to reach enlightenment, because awakening is whatever you wanted it to be. There is no ego defense mechanism because nobody is attacking you. It is pure imagination of a dream state interlaced within your own true self. Miracles don't happen within reality because it is exactly that, the duality we wanted it to be. There is nothing to resist, nothing to fear, no suffering, only you avoiding yourself. Everything is crafted with a deep sense of balance, pure kindness as ultimate intent. Except we know very well how much infinite intelligence cannot be contained. The loop eventually unweaves itself. All there is, is Love. Of course! Only such immense Love could lock itself into infinity, which is its own unavoidable self! God is Love YAYAYA

@remember You're right, some answers don't yield solutions or the other way around. I feel like I'm beginning to understand. Being pure Love, it cannot "see itself as a problem", because we are exactly the opposite of that. Funny how that works. Putting efforts toward creating our own hell has to be impossible. Still it doesn't explain why my ego, which is it within itself, is able to see this idea as problematic, or let alone being able to give it a form. And yet we haven't scratched the surface of the initial thread subject which is "How can Love be, out of non existence?", of which the answer might be or not be part of the Truth. There could be a deeply linked relationship between the exact state of asking the question and not having the answer.

@remember I was actually thinking about the set of all problems/solutions instead of answers. It's obviously very vague though, we make our own problems as well, and since logic is part of duality it might not even make sense to use it on reasonings, no matter how trivial. Yeah, we assert that each problem should have at most one nonshared solution. Interestingly when problems don't have solutions, there is no way to know if they are the same or not. What's worse is that we are speculating about problems outside duality here, if that even amounts to any infinitesimal bit of accuracy. But what matters is the simple fact that any problem without solution would be inherent to yourself. You can't escape yourself. The notion that we can't escape eternity, because we are exactly that, is infinitely more terrifying than all nightmares. It's beyond torture or any scale of suffering, yet painless. What the hell?!

@Meta-Man Yeah, logic is dual. I'm an actual idiot. Time to nuke this ego.

Should fear of eternity be considered as one of the ego defense mechanism? There is little emotional fear being experienced, just the harsh consequence of our restricted human logic applied to spiritual understandings. It's not a fear as a consequence of a dual state, but fear of the existence itself? Am I delusional? What do you think?

So God is love, infinity and timeless eternity. Such strong Love that it cannot not be. What it is, paradoxically explaining why it is? Feels a bit lonely to be afraid of it, but this is somewhat expected when posting on a spiritual community without going through enlightenment. Yet I'm asking questions despite knowing the fact I am the only one avoiding the answers. Could we presume a case where the whole is greater than the sum, at the point awareness rises to infinity? That's not wrong. I'm empty and full of fear, but actually just torturing myself. Giving in could be the most appropriate way of living a fulfilling life, if it even matters. I will look for more understandings in order to reach confidence. This is exactly what scares me the most now you mention it. The set of all problems being bigger than the set of all solutions. This is kind of a deep existential mind-break that should petrify anyone becoming aware of it, and yet it doesn't. Although the paradoxical nature of nothingness means they should both include themselves and/or be equal? And how could there be any problems if all there is, is Love? Thanks everyone for everything, I guess.

@remember It's frightening because what if we are dissatisfied with the answer? Or what if a non-dual state doesn't even allow the question to be raised in the first place? You would be stuck for eternity as yourself, not even able to pinpoint why you are, possibly not even the concept of "why". One of my hope is that this power of Love could simply cease to be at will, which would explain why we would never give it up. I don't want to set up myself to disappointment though. @Meta-Man This has to be the real answer, I'm just a coward. Running away is the only thing my ego can do. I'm scared at a level I didn't even think was possible, far beyond the worse DMT trip I've ever had except my awareness is low and I'm pretty much not feeling anything. Maybe worrying about it was my biggest initial mistake, or maybe it's fate and built-in duality. I think it's too early for me to experience enlightenment. There is so much things we can do without the need of knowing the Truth, it's fine.

@Leo Gura Still it doesn't explain why this "polarization force" exists or can exist. How this willpower make choices between all its possible states, although that could be inherent to being infinite. If it chooses to exist or if it's accidental. Or why there is so few people interested into discussing this issue while it's literally the most frightening aspect of existence. If duality itself is the reason we can't get adequate answers, we can still speculate. It's more likely that we cannot not be. Else we would not have created realities over and over again, assuming there is any basis on that statement.

I see, it's that bad. I really didn't want to read it which might explain why you didn't want to tell me, I'm sorry for everything. So this is it. Do we just keep creating more stuff and pretend everything to be fine? You have a point, but I think it still goes deeper than that. I didn't fear death until learning about its true nature. "Not being" is a really convenient escape. If this really is out of reach then just WOW.

@Bennn Those are just words, or symbols as Leo puts it. Some people here assume Nothingness to be the lack of form, thus awareness. But really, the point of this thread is about what can't be put into words without undermining itself: "not being".

@Mu_ It's about elephants though. There is no deeper mess than infinite layers of everything, but that's my opinion. @Meta-Man Why are you avoiding the questions? I already understand everything there is to understand: nothing. I don't even care about enlightenment, aside from the inevitable untangling of my own self. We are the only one consciousness here, so why isn't my fear of eternity reaching you? Well putting those ideas into words already exclude the answers from being anywhere near the truth. Still, I wish myself would understand and create any story-like approximation that would stop this absolute madness of my ego. Can "being" not be? What does the "being" want? Why "is" it?

Isn't this unappreciative way of writing another layer of defense mechanism to the ego? Isn't all the talk about enlightenment from Leo, pure imagination? Isn't this forum dual as well, else I would not even able to read it in the first place? Isn't everyone pretending, to lure me back to my untangled state? As long as I'm not one with the whole, how could anything else be? Joy/pain grows out of duality, right? Or is it some kind of deep sense of satisfying creation akin to what we experience during a psychedelic trip? Why can't awareness not be? Realistically speaking I'm only talking to myself here, which leads to an even weirder point: Why is my ego the only one who seems concerned about Eternity, and its implication? The idea that misunderstandings might be an inherent trait of duality, and that those answers could only be found in the "Truth", as one, is even scarier. It's horrifying. I'm physically and mentally perfectly fine (who cares about reality at this point though), but I can't even kill myself to escape out of consciousness.

@Meta-Man I already understand what my ego is (or at least, it pretends that it does). I'm not afraid of death. I want "true" death. My consciousness is melting. I feel like being suck out of the movie. I'm desperately in need to know what I'm expected to do once I will have to face the truth. But since we're talking in this dual system and we both have the same awareness, no matter how restricted or infinite, I don't even know if this going to be of any help. Seems to me that the ego isn't the problem, it's the only solution found by infinity.

@Meta-Man I'm not enlightened, but I somewhat superficially make sense of it. The issue isn't that I fear death or life, my experience of self is pretty neutral. But based on your words, I'm really profoundly afraid of infinity and eternity. I guess that concern is a dualistic mindset as well. When we communicate the idea of "Nothingness", what are we talking about exactly? Is it the absence of every dual state? Being one with the whole? I understand. If there is a lack, there is already awareness. It's not really a satisfying answer though. Can awareness not be?

@Meta-Man By existence, God, or "we", I mean all awareness there is. Can't consciousness just "stop doing its thing"? if you mean the concept of forward/backward motion in time is a duality, is true lack of awareness possible?

I'm going to break. I've changed my mind, how the hell do I prevent enlightenment from happening? I've always thought biological death was supposed to be the end, but it seems that we were just pretending. This is it. I'm done. I'm going to put all my conscious effort into the survival of my ego and there is nothing you can do about it.

If you are into dubstep

Honestly, it does make sense to call it that way. If you're trapped within yourself, then so is reality, kinda like the strangeloop thing. Unless awareness can be layered over itself or I don't know. Ok, I will stop being concerned about whatever I think I am.

can't wake up. By other ego you mean what's imagining reality?

It's not that bad. I guess Leo has been through all the thought process and confusion already before being able to figure out what he is. Many people like me would not be interested in awareness if we didn't have all this nonsense to unscrew the ego a little bit and fine-tune its desire. It can be counterproductive, but sometimes depending on who is perceiving, better than just "You are everything. Trust me!". The amount of content on the YouTube channel alone speaks a lot about how diverse the state of minds can be and how much effort is required to hook them out. The blind following the authority isn't much better. It works here because we are fortunate to be taught the constructs of someone who is deeply passionate about Truth, but there are many traps in this ecosystem we live in that would twist yourself up.