Ethan1

(Wasn't sure if this belongs more in the emotions category or society category.) Figured I'd throw some thoughts out on this topic bc I don't see many people discussing the topic about toxic shame. I recently became more aware of some of my own insecurities with being shy and quiet growing up. This held me back for most of my life. I have been reflecting on my own beliefs and values. Just came across this and figured I'd share some thoughts that I keep in my common place book. Guilt vs shame.. Guilt is about you doing something that is wrong. Shame is about you as an individual being wrong, unworthy, or unacceptable. Shame is to feel less than and devalued. Love is to feel worthy and valued. Shame isn't necessarily bad but toxic shame is what I'm curious about. Seems as though we born into a world where we are socialized and taught to follow endless social rules and cues without question. Our family systems pass on belief systems and values. Society uses shame as a tool to keep people from doing something socially unacceptable. The problem I see is when people are shamed at such a young age by authority figures where their brain isn't fully developed to know what is true. The shame is now installed as a core belief. The mental thought of "I am not enough" or "I am unworthy of love" is planted in the subconious mind. This belief at childhood can be repressed so deeply in the darkness of the mind that the person is unaware that it even exists. Yet I believe this is what contributes to most problems in society. People feel unaccepted and not enough. Feeling the need to jump through endless hoops to feel worthy and acceptance. Chasing social status and validation to fill the void of unworthiness. Maybe when I get "xyz" I will feel enough. Chasing the hungry ghost. I sat down and came up with a list of things people are shamed for that deeply impacts how people see their self. Self-image and esteem are deeply impacted from such beliefs. Examples of shame: Shame for social groups. Shame for not being the same religion Shame for having certain friends. Shame for not having the same sexuality. Shame for making a mistake. Shame for failure. Not being an A+ student. Shame for a relationship status. "You're not married?" Shame for liking someone. "Kissing in a tree song? ". Shame for appearance and physical attributes. Shame for being too fat Shame for being too skinny Shame for being too strong Shame for being too weak Shame for being too tall Shame for being too short Shame for being too attractive Shame for being too ugly Shame for facial features Shame for skin color Shame for choice of clothes Shame for body hair length Shame for wearing a certain color Shame for having those tattoos Shame for a speech habit Shame for your accent Shame for going to jail or doing a crime Shame for Shame for possessions Shame for the car that you drive Shame for having too much money Shame for having too little money Shame for how you spend your money Shame for being homeless Shame for interests & hobbies Shame for a certain music. Shame for a certain band. Shame for a career choice. Shame for liking something unordinary. Slut shaming Shame for nudity Shame for the food you eat. Eating healthy or too unhealthy. Shame for being a bad parent. Shame for being a bad mother. Shame for being a bad father. Shame for not being smart enough. Shame for just being yourself. Shame for certain ideas. Shame for expressing yourself. Shame for being angry. Don't be angry. Shame for being sad. Don't be sad. Stop crying. Men can not cry. Shame for laughing too much. Shame for too much joy. Shame for talking too loud. Shame for talking too quiet. Shame for being shy. Shame for being emotional. I believe people try to escape reality to avoid the pain that the social conditioning and shame has created. I believe most addictions come from shame. Shame deep down comes to not meeting another person's standard of living. Not being what a person perceives is "right and good" . The truth is that right and good are purely relative. Right and good varries from person to person. Society tries to condition us to belief that we should be a certain type of person to be "worthy of love". That is a lie. We were born with love. From all the shame that society gives out. I question why self-love is less discussed. We aren't born perfect and never will be perfect. You should taught to feel self-love. You should feel self-acceptance. We all hold value and potential. You should be grateful for being you and be proud. Accepting yourself. Accept your feelings. Accept your thoughts. Accept your needs. Accept your values. Deeply accept yourself for being human. Love those around you. Love your enemies. Most importantly love yourself. ---

Yeah this stuff does get pretty confusing. Especially in group dynamics where ostracism is involved. I don't see too many people discussing the effects of ostracism or the social effects it has. I could be wrong on some of this stuff. I'm still trying to put the puzzle together. I'm wondering how far can a shame based society go before people become completely stifled to express their self without the emotional triggers of shame getting in the way. I see shame is repressed an emotional trigger that causes a person to want to hide. People create emotional masks to prevent facing such pain. This creates emotional baggage that harbors in the mind. I guess, you can choose how you want to respond to the negative stimulus. How you react is up to your emotional resilience and perception. I guess a person who has a fragile sense of self will be more offended by something and take it personally. A more robust emotional system could probably withstand a certain frame attack. I think loving someone who is shaming you is a real test. If the person is coming from shame then they are hurt. They are coming from a lower level of consciousness. I guess hurt people, hurt people. It's necessary to have boundaries to self protect and stand up for yourself. I still think from a fighters frame the person can still act in a counteractive defensive way even when someone's ego is doing the attacking. I'm trying to understand a childhood development and the impact a neglect has to create shame. Such as being disowned by your parents or being adopted. Has drastic effects on attachment issues. Feeling not enough. Such as, when being young in 1st grade and loving to sing. Then the teacher made fun of the person in front of the class and said the persons voice was horrible. The shame would cripple the persons voice. Feeling not enough. Is that not the power that words have? Or if my parents conditioned me that laughing is inappropriate. Or I grew up in an authriterian style household in India. If the parents didn't allow me to be me. Using negative reinforcement to assert authority to gain cultural compliance and socially discipline.

Just because someone isn't interested in your music does that mean it's bad or they are bad? Just because someone doesn't like your style does that make the style is bad or the person with a different perspective is an enemy? No. Perspectives are different. Seek first to understand, then to be understood. People allow social conditioning and fear of rejection to put a lock on the mind. Shame makes a person want to hide. Shame thrives in isolation. More keeping it secrete. A grip and life of its own. A malignancy on the soul. A soul wound.

Depends on how you're using the word. In regards to sociology I think it means your will over someone else. In other words... influence. Power is given to those that are perceived as most influential and valueable to society. I believe there's a natural power dynamic in all relationships. Power can be seen in different layers. Words hold a deep source of power. One man can speak words to influence a nation. Even nonverbal actions can speak louder than words. Experience and knowledge hold a power. A gun can hold power. Really anything can hold power depending on how a person perceives something. Also, power can be forced by acts of coercion too but it requires greater amounts of effort. Hitler used an excessive amount of resources to gain power. Whereas, Gandhi used less effort to gain power. Power came to him automatically with ease. A book called power VS force mentions power being calibrated to levels of conciousness. A lower conscious person has to use force to get what they want. Whereas, a higher conscious person uses less effort. It's like a momentum. Force is limited in the amount of energy to move. Power is exponentially stronger. Just a few random thoughts I'd add. I'm still trying to understand this idea. It goes deep. Funny how in society it's kind of taboo to discuss power but honestly it's involved in all aspects of social dynamics.

I'm trying to understand more about the complexity of social conditioning. There truly aren't many people on YouTube discussing this topic. Once I came across the concept of social conditioning it made me really go deep down the rabbit hole. Most of our world views are shaped based on social conditioning. The family dynamics, demographics, socioeconomic/social status, values, and other variables influence perception. Seems to me like social conditioning is just the default set of beliefs we are given. Which influences nearly every aspect of life from our core beliefs. A default program installed in the mind. Crazy how people can go through life being unaware of their social conditioning and cognitive biases. If people were socially programmed to understand more nuance truths compared to simplistic truths then society would probably be a little less corrupt.

Trying to understand this stuff. Just came across this thinking the other day. Sitting here thinking to myself about people that are more pragmatic compared to others that think more idealistically. Basically, I have a buddy that is horrible with his finances and wants to move in with me and travel. He wants to move 12 hours from Texas to live here. He only has a few hundred dollars in his name. Has been working all the time but no saving. For the most part, he sits around and talks about ideas but it never seems to be action focused. As if he is inflating a bubble of an idea. I decide to burst his bubble and get him to be practical. This causes him to become outraged as if I'm attacking him. I try to communicate the idealistic thinking. Get him to take action. Some (orange) people I have talked to are so myopic they can't even come up with a unique ideas. Lacking a clear vision or ideal. The more money focused person can be so caught up in the materialistic financial thinkkng to lack creative ideas. Stereotypically, it's like the (green) airy artsy creative person can be horrible with managing finances or being action focused. However, they can have some great ideas and thoughts. Confuses me on how to bridge these two mindsets. A person who is more pragmatic doesn't want to hear too many ideas or contemplation. On the other hand, the creative thinker or mental masterbater gets aggressive when the bubbles are being brought back down to earth. Honestly, I think I'm more of an idealistic person than a pragmatic goal oriented person right now. My mind likes to think about these ideas and go down rabbit holes. However, I also try to be practical in regards to finance and creating a small business(orange) so I understanding there's a balance of this stuff. I am working hard to being more practical and task oriented to make progress. .. I'm open to discussing this concept if it helps other people recognize where they fall. For me it has been eye opening to recognize this.

Brain dumping some thoughts I'm thinking about. What exactly is "Value". Seems like a word that people don't really think about but interact with all day and everyday. Google definition : The regard that something is held to deserve; the importance, worth, or usefulness of something. a person's principles or standards of behavior; one's judgment of what is important in life. estimate the monetary worth of. consider (someone or something) to be important or beneficial; have a high opinion of Things that come to mind.. Social status in a group Personal & family value system Social values in society Monetary value & worth Social proof I find it bizarre how we live in a world that appraises the value for nearly every single tangible or intangible object. A unique price. Such as the cost of land to the cost of a bottle of water. Which creates this very complex financial system. Even complex financial institutions that create value from playing with the accounting system. If that's not enough people inherently measure the social value of a person through almost every spoken word or no words. Through nonverbal communication or verbal communication. Funny to see how value is relative. As is beauty is relative to the eyes of the beholder. Yet even beauty is a means to measure social value or social status. Even information and knowledge is way to measure value. People will go into great amounts of debt for a perceived source of value. People hire & invest based on the value they perceive they will generate in the future. People can also value their time. Time can be a way to measure one's worth. Interesting how people are paid based on the hourly value of their finite time. Imagine that every decision has a value and opportunity cost. The cost of starting a business vs going to school. We measure with the value of priorities. Even if the materialism thing holds little value to you or me. We can personally value many different things. A persons value system is so unique. Such as large interests in certain hobbies or small interests such as food. I may really value self-actualization. You may value working on a car instead or singing. The things that are usually free hold some of the greatest sources of value. The value of a man's words to another. I believe words can hold value. Soo what is this "value" thing? Small word but complex idea.

@Milos Uzelac I've been trying to understand social conditioning more. Seems like on YouTube not many people discuss the depths and influence it has on our lives and society. I appreciate you saying that because I think about social conditioning all the time. Yeah, looking at meta-exhange as a value is outside the box thinking. We can only take value so far. I want to add that I'm reading a book called Goals by Brian Tracy. Today I read chapter 4 which is about "clarifying values" . Funny to come across your response and share this. He talks about at the very core of a person is values. At the heart creates most actions we do in life. Values Beliefs Expectations Attitude Actions Like you said it's probably social conditioning which creates these values in this situation. People don't know theirselves and what they truly value. Let alone why. They adopt value systems that society programs and brainwashes to hold for the sake of conformity and survival. The unexamined life is not worth living. A person feels most valuable when they are living in alignment to what they value the most in this life. Also talked about how self-esteem is determined by how much you like yourself. Which self-esteem is determined from self-image. Self-image is shaped by having a self-ideal. Self-ideal is based on values, goals, hopes, dreams, virtues, aspirations. Not living up to the ideal self creates a lower self esteem. When I hear the word self esteem I hear self-worth. Self-worth or Self-value. Even self-love. How do we know this isnt just an illusion or story of the mind that is false. By being born you are worthy of value. Others may not recognize the value but it is there. Even one may not see value in certain ways but there is value. Love is an essential value. Value is highly relative. How do you know your values? By how you see your self or by how others see you? Is it even worth acknowledging? A dollar to you may be worth a sense of freedom or great pleasure for the perceived value it holds. To me it may mean nothing as merely a piece of paper or an illusionary promissory note that is like a carrot on a stick that holds just a promise of this thing called value. I'm personally trying to go through the process of examining my internal values. To prioritize what I value the most in this life. Examine from the top down. I personally haven't done much self-actualizing or interalization to know this stuff. I really am just figuring this stuff out. Not necessarily to feed this false illusion of an ego. More to understand these web of beliefs and values I hold.

@Nahm I appreciate you seeing this as a divine calling. Really do feel like some of these thoughts hold a deeper meaning. A spiritual awaking or a process of enlightenment. I get confused because people talk about an inner light with enlightenment. Light is also an energy that comes to mind. Shining light in a dark room. Shining awareness in a room of ignorance or distraction. Even the colors that light projects are different levels of energy. Our eyes pick up this color energy. Light is information too? I question how eyes pick up this light to even create perception. I'm open to learning from this community. I'm really trying to do some inner work and hear new perspectives on consciousness and energy stuff. Everything you said resonates with me and I feel it. Trying to come with the beginners mind. @Serotoninluv Makes me question reality following these chain of thoughts. I do see where it's important to be grounded with direct experiences rather than mindlessly thinking or being distracted by thoughts. It's easy to let the monkey mind to get lost in this. I agree with finding the healthy balance between this. It's all an act of balance of feeling vs thinking. It's one thing to think about energy but another to interact with it. I'm clueless to Reiki but I'm open to new experiences and learning. I did something similar with a yoga teacher a year ago I met that claimed to be a healer. She did some form of tapping or psychological acupressure on me. I'm still not sure what I think about it. No clue if it was a placebo effect or what. Was relaxing though. I can relate to what you experienced last night.

I'm trying to understand more about the nature of beliefs. I watched the video. I'm just really curious about these things. Why are beliefs so stubborn?? Are there different levels to beliefs? Such as core beliefs to surface level. Why is it so difficult to change a belief? What's the quickest way to change a belief? What is cognitive dissonance in regards to beliefs?

OK so I've been wondering about the difference between complaining and people who are genuinely grateful for life. I have been dating this one girl for the past few months who always always always chronically complained. She worked as a TV reporter so it's likely she's around negativity 24/7. Even though I would listen to her complain. Seems as though some people complain habitually. If you make them aware of the complaining they get more aggressive. Seems like complaining is connected to being unconscious. Being grateful is connected to a greater level of consciousness. Also seems like people complain to avoid taking responsibility. To gain attention from others. To find fault outside of one's self. As if a coping mechanism for protecting the ego. Best thing was to separate myself from her. She doesn't want to change the behavior. Best to not let the toxic emotions infect my state of mind. What's your thoughts on the idea of complaining vs being grateful?

@Moreira Why would a person choose to take everything for granted to begin with? Is this just a lack of awareness? Like you said if it is a lack of awareness then people need to slow down and smell the roses. Funny how the mind out weighs the bad for the good. If we see one small bad in a person it overshadows multiple good actions. Like a cognitive bias of some form.

@Nahm Yeah, I can now see where I am being the opposite of mindful and creating multiple rabbit holes rather than contemplating one thought to the bottom. I dig too many small holes(breadth) instead of staying focused(depth). So all thoughts are dualistic... Hmm When I hear what you said I think of.. Feelings are the opposite to thoughts. As to say, the body and mind are both connected (Depending on one's level of consciousness). What one feels one speaks? What one thinks, one feels? They are interconnected in a weird way. If I think negative, I will create feelings that are negative. This is a heavy thing to contemplate. Hmm Feeling of gratitude vs appreciation.. They seem to be the same thing when I think about them. When I feel them.. Im having a hard time processing my emotions. From my understanding it seems like you're saying a person who is detached from their feelings will produce thoughts that feel disconnected too. In other words our emotional systems are meant to help recognize & reconnect with thoughts that are out of alignment. To become more attuned to what we are feeling. Instead of repressing emotions and hiding them. Seems like gratitude works like a belief. If I believe I am confident. The the "loop" will follow with certain perceptions & actions. I will act with confidence. People we give confirmation to the actions. Then I will feel confident which reinforces the attitude/belief. Then it's like an upward spiral. Where being grateful for the small things in life creates a sense of fulfillment/eudiamonia. Then it creates a cycle of noticing more things to be grateful for. Such as being grateful for my body. Which branches out to other smaller things like my lungs, heart, eyes. Which I spread more awareness of gratitude to.

@NahmThank you saying that! I really have no clue if I'm being rhetorical. I throw ideas on this forum that I've been thinking about over a few months. I recognize that there's so much I'm unaware of. I'm open for opposing views to shine light on my unawareness. I go down these weird rabbit holes but don't truly understand the depth of them fully. Feels like I'm going scuba diving with a small flashlight(awareness). I can see certain things but I have no clue how big the abstract idea is. The deeper down the less you can see and the less people around to shine light too. Takes too much energy. I just enjoy the process of going diving. Personally I love scuba diving as a hobby. Another thought on this energy thing. I find it interesting how the sun is our main source of energy. The solar heat and energy it produces supports all of life. Without the sun then what would life be? Even gravity is a weird form of energy. Magnetic energy is bizarre too.. Makes me question how much people who study engineering and physics know about this energy thing.

@Nahm Soo basically, perception contributes to a person's attitude. A person's mental programs and beliefs help shape the reality. Appears like the subconscious beliefs create the perception which create the attitude. Or are they separate. I wonder if intentionally expressing gratitude will rewire a belief to rewire an attitude. I could be wrong. Overthinking all of this but I'm really curious where gratitude is connected to attitude. The two sound sorts alike. Attitude + gratitude = Altitude?

Another idea : Decision fatigue. The amount of decisions the mind can make in one day. The max amount of thoughts before the mind is exhausted. Or just fatigue in general which is the opposite of creating energy. Lacking energy. I question the different forms which cause fatigue: Stress can drain energy Certain food can drain energy Arguments create fatigue Physical fatigue Thinking fatigue The more energy you generate. The more you can create and do. So makes sense to maximize energy and minimize fatigue. Probably explains why people abuse certain energy drinks to artificially create energy.

@Nahm Thank you for your input! Hmmm so interpretation is what you're referring to? I could read something and determine how I want to understand it which shapes my personal reality. Something bad could happen to me but it's the meaning or story I give to the situation. Such as learning from a significant accident. In other words, we are like the film director and actor in this silly movie called "life". We actively and inactivily choose how we want to create this movie. The roles we perceive. The scripts and words we act out. For many others, they feel they are in someone else's movie called life? Correct me if I might have misinterpreted what you said.

Thanks for the great response @Epiphany_Inspired! I find it tricky to notice when one gets sucked into a complaining mindset. It's much easier to notice in others than one's self. Yet if someone is emotionally poison dripping and doing tiny complaints that add up with time. Especially having the emotional intelligence to be aware when someone or something triggers a reaction in you or me. I notice some people are easily triggered and others have few to no triggers. Such as a person with a more nonchalant attitude. So.... If "attitude is everything" . What exactly creates a ➕positive (optimistic) vs a ➖negative (pessimistic) attitude? Perception? Mindfulness/awareness ? Will power? Environment? Finding something to be grateful for each day? ?

@Serotoninluv @assx95 When I think of focus vs distraction, I think of energy flowing to something. "Where ever energy goes, energy flows. Where ever energy flows, energy grows." As if like we plant a seed with intention. The focus of attention is like the water or sunlight for the seeds. Take away the focus it stops growing. These seeds of thought build neural pathways or a highway system to a certain thought. Repitively driving the same thought then this highway gets faster and more efficient. Even when driving. When you first learn to drive, your brain is hyper focused on each aspect. It would be over stimulating to focus on each aspect individually all the time. Too much information for the brain. With time it becomes a habitual skill and the mind is doing multiple things without even thinking. Selective focus helps with sorting out large amounts of information. I believe this is the process of habitation. In classical conditioning they did a study where they would probe a sea anemone and get a response. This reponce was important for the sea anemone to eat. They would count the number of probes. Repetitive brushes lead to a weaker response with time. After like 30 touches the sea anemone would nearly stop responding to this stimuli. The sea anemone was nearly handicapped from eating. Same with living near an airport. The sounds become habituated. There's another word which is the opposite of rehabituation which they did the reverse pattern and retrain the brain. This type of focus or classical conditioning can be seen in the military with training soldiers too. The drill sergeants will call the group to a "position of attention". To command a group of people to be obedient and follow orders. I'd argue the reason the military is sharp and disciplined is because of the focus on attention training and laser focus. The body will be moving while the mind is asleep. Talk about getting things done. You could be making your bed at 4am not even being fully conscious of this. Just muscle memory. I question if this is how beliefs are programmed. I'm deeply curious about the nature of creating a belief. The book "thinking fast and slow" kind of touches on this process of attention/focus. Distraction on the other hand is more of a blockage. If a person is consistently being distracted then it's hard to build this momentum. Most professional sports require like a tunnel vision focus. If the player listens to the stimuli from the crowd or other opponents, then this can be detrimental for the team. Distractions can be anything. Some times it's good to be distracted if the brain is becoming addicted to something. Addiction just seems to be where the brain is more focused on one thing. Stimulus response from a reward cycle for pleasure. Breaking a cycle or distractions aren't always bad. Seems like society is both really distracted from phone/social media addiction. You could be on a bus and everyones on their phone mindlessly. Distracted from surroundings and tunnel vision on the phone. Probably the reason for so many accidents while driving too. Not paying attention. What we focus on the most grows flowers or what we neglect to focus on can grow weeds. Can be the opposite way too. Hope this adds to the thoughts on attention, awareness, and focus.