r0ckyreed

Sounds like Thanos logic. If I kill half the population, the other half will thrive more due to more resources. While that may be true, no good deed can outweigh a terrible deed. Tate could start a puppy charity and sexually abuse women, and we as a society should still prosecute his ass for it. That is the problem with your utilitarianism logic. From whose standard is Tate a net positive or negative? Tate can continue to gain a business sexually exploiting women and have a business for healing veterans that “outweighs.” That is irrational to even think that your actions can be excused based off of the value you can provide. That logic gives him no reason to change and stop exploiting. If you wanna be objective about it, he has been a net negative in terms of the toxicity he spreads. Tate and Trump are both Narcissists. Tate would still support Trump today, which shows you the kind of person he is.

One of the best arguments to use against religious people is to ask them if something can come from nothing. Almost all of them I have asked so far have said that it is impossible for something to come from nothing. But there is a problem with saying this because if you say that something cannot come from nothing, then you are contradicting yourself because how can you claim you have free will if your thoughts and choices are always coming from something outside of you. That is essentially determinism in a nutshell. And their God would have to come from something too since God is "something" by their logic. But if God is Nothingness, and they claim that something cannot come from Nothingness, then they are basically saying that God is impossible and doesn't exist. On the other hand, if you say that it is possible that something can come from nothing, then you are at least opening the possibility of free will because free will is being able to make choices independent of past influences. However, this does not escape the problem because if you claim that it is possible for something to come from nothing, then you admit that there is no outside creator separate from creation. If something can come from Nothingness, then the something that came from nothing is Nothingness manifested into somethingness!! There is no existencer of existence. There is only existence. Therefore, God does not exist. Argument from free will is that if your choices come from something, then you do not actually have free will. But if your choices come from nothingness, then you have free will. But claiming that you have free will is also saying that you claim that you are God, which most religious fundamentalists do not agree with. They think God is separate from them and creation. Argument from determinism is that if something can only come from something, then determinism is correct and you cannot have free will. But this is dangerous to religious thinkers because then that would also mean that sin cannot exist since sin is a freely chosen act against God. You cannot be held responsible morally if the causes of responsibility go back infinitely. Compatibilism seems to be the correct way of viewing the relationships between free will and determinism. Consciousness isn't entirely free because it needs to limit itself in order to experience itself. Neither is Consciousness mechanistic. The past/future don't exist outside The Eternal Moment, so extreme determinism isn't right either. The correct answer lies in the balance and non duality of freewill and determinism. Think of it like Free Will is the Yin and Determinism is the Yang. Just like how the Universe is hot and cold, dark and light, and neither one or the other. Convincing a Religious Person What God Really Is My thoughts on all of this are that everything you see around you comes from nothingness. There is no such thing as an infinite regress because everything goes back into nothing and not something. Infinite regress assumes the past exists, but you have never experienced the past, only the present. Infinite regress does not exist, only an Infinite Process. For instance, you can look at a pencil and can use your mind to trace the ''causes'' back forever. But that isn't because it is an infinite regress. That is because the Present Moment is an Infinite Moment and can keep imagining past/future forever in this Infinite Moment/Process. All of your thoughts tracing a pencil ''back'' is actually one thought of an Infinite amount of thoughts occurring in this Uncaused Moment. Consciousness is Uncaused. What would cause consciousness? Everything you trace as a cause is Consciousness! Everything you experience or define as a cause is occurring within Consciousness! A pencil is nothing but a figment of Consciousness. Every object, sound, perception, music, art, brain, and person is a figment of Consciousness! The cause of a pencil is Nothing! But Infinite Consciousness can imagine ''causes'' forever because Existence is Forever and is Uncaused! There is no such thing as an Infinite Regress (never has and never will) only Infinite Consciousness! What atheists call the Infinite Regress is actually ''God'' or Infinite Consciousness! I actually do not prefer the term God. I think The Force is more accurate. Think of what you call God or The Force as being Gravity. Gravity is God! Why do you think George Lucas calls the most fundamental substance of the universe, The Force? He is pointing to Gravity, which is a figment of Consciousness. The Jedi are using The Force (or Gravity) to manipulate Gravity!! God is Gravity, Consciousness, The Force. So yes, you have free will but you also don't. Black and white thinking is one of the main problems of the religious mind. What are your thoughts? Do you agree or disagree? Share your insights.

Okay. But I have also created the Vedas, Koran, and Torah, as well Donald Trump. The issue is that this human lifetime is limited, and no amount of reading books will awaken me. I want to reach the insights Jesus reached and beyond through direct experience. But of course, I would have to read about them to know it. So it is nuanced there. I just don’t see it worth my time to sort out all the gold from the crap. But I may change my mind in the future. For now, I am using Chat GPT to summarize the main insights and teachings from Jesus. I want to spend more of my time contemplating than reading.

I definitely had similar insights that reality is perfect and that if I was intended to die today, I would be okay with that. Because life is complete balance/perfection. I also realized that there is no glitch to life either. All diseases and disorders are all the possibilities of Consciousness. It is Absolutely Beautiful. I have no idea what awakening/enlightenment would even look like. If it looks like what we are describing, then we are both enlightened. But that doesn’t sit well with me because I understand very little about reality. I imagine that awakening, I would have 100% certainty of how everything in reality works and can exist. Awakening is the answer to all philosophical questions.

Omg!!! Andrew Tate is The Real Matrix!! He is Agent Smith spreading his seeds and viruses!!!! If only every Tate follower who had some brain left could seriously contemplate: “How am I being a Devil? Why do I need Tate to program my life? What if Tate is The Real Matrix? The idea doesn’t even come to a follower’s mind.

That’s why I don’t like using the word God to describe The Force/Infinite Consciousness. It just makes it confusing because how 90% of the people use the concept is a fantasy inside Infinite Consciousness. I only “argue” with people I deem openminded. I never personally read the Bible, so I appreciated those verses Razard. I just don’t see any value in reading the Bible. I would much rather contemplate and create my own philosophy by that point.

I hear you all. I do get that it is a distraction from myself. I’m not saying I do it 24/7. But when I get an in-person opportunity, which is rare for me, I like to challenge their thinking with logic. I realize that I get thrilled and entertained by challenging myself and others. It helps me develop witty thinking when I engage in debates every now and then. I think that is one thing Leo is not so nuanced about. Having debates every now and then trains your mind to be able to formulate your ideas to others. If you cannot articulate your ideas, then you don’t understand them. You just have to find the right person to talk to. Of course, when I smell a closed minded person, I don’t waste a breath on them. But if a friend or stranger is openminded and wants to have a conversation, then I use the arguments I listed above. There’s a lot of benefit in interacting and sharing ideas with others, as well as contemplating alone.

Openmindedness and skepticism.

The OP isn’t using logic. Proper use of logic would solve the OP’s problems. Contemplation is a logic process of deriving knowledge and can raise your awareness to truth. I guess I have a different notion of logic. What I mean by logic is using your mind and thinking deeply about things. I think in nonlinear ways because I have Asperger’s. We need to redefine logic if we assume that logic is only done in the linear way.

Update: Today, I reconnected with bliss. I listened to nostalgic music and went outside to contemplate reality. So much gratitude bliss and curiosity for just being alive. But this isn’t enlightenment. Enlightenment isn’t a feeling. It is a deep profound realization into the nature of reality. It isn’t some Buddhist idea you parrot. It is a genuine original insight. If you call feeling blissed and connected as enlightenment, then I have been enlightened since I was 4 years old.

Good. I would call ''just sitting'' a meditation practice rather than contemplation. Contemplation is using your wise mind to deeply think about something, whereas meditation is more concerned about taming the monkey rather than using it to get the bananas of insights.

The man isn’t taking the Dream argument that seriously. If you cannot know whether you are in a dream right now, how can you know anything is real? The OP just assumes he isn’t dreaming now.

I had an almost identical experience after playing Life Is Strange. After beating the game, I went out and hugged a tree. I am not an affectionate person at all except with my girlfriend. I saw reality as perfect and no longer valued anything other that reality. God could have offered me superpowers and wealth and I would have declined. I could have died then and be okay with it because I knew it would be all part of the balance of life. I wish I embodied that state more often. Though, my experience seems like it was identical to yours, I wouldn’t call it an awakening or enlightenment. Awakening is a deep understanding of reality and I doubt it has anything to do with having good feelings.

“I’m surprised it is not talked about it on this forum. Talking to AI is like talking a super scientist or artist.” - Starstruck I notice that you say I am using chat GPT wrong, but you never once demonstrated that you know how to use it right. It’s all talk and no evidence. You never provide any logic or evidence against how I use chat GPT. Nor do you have any idea how I use it. If anything, what you are doing is a projection. All my claims were derived by your “super scientist.” Chat GPT is smarter than you and I combined. Deal with it.

“It’s not about who you are underneath but what you do that defines you.” - Batman

Consciousness cannot be created nor destroyed.

The Book of Not Knowing is his best one in my opinion.

You are contradicting yourself. Your past post was all glamorization for using chat GPT to contemplate, while I was the one who advocated for using your own brain in that post. You are switching up your positions and aren’t being consistent. Anyways, have a good one. I’m out. ?✌️

Sounds like if Chat GPT doesn’t give you the answers you like, then the question must be wrong. Ok. Lol. I’m dead. ??

I do want to say that if the OP came up with those lists on their own, then I am impressed with that. I agree with those lists. Just not idea that excellence is more important than purpose/passion. That’s like saying success is more important than happiness, which is a bit misguided because being successful at something doesn’t guarantee happiness. And what we really want in life is to feel fulfilled and happy with our lives. Why would we pursue success if it doesn’t fulfill us and satisfy our desires? No amount of success will. That is the illusion of success. The hedonic treadmill never ends till you step off of it.

For someone who advocates using Chat GPT for contemplation, you failed to use it for this thread. And I am not sure why. It is important to think for yourself, but don’t confuse that with swimming in your biases and BS. Thinking for yourself is more nuanced than that and requires a genuine curiosity for truth. Here is what Chat GPT said, which is basically my whole point all along: Q: Can you master something without passion? “It is possible to become highly skilled or knowledgeable in a particular area without necessarily feeling passionate about it. However, whether or not you can truly "master" something without passion is a more complex question. True mastery of a skill or subject often requires not only a deep understanding of its technical aspects, but also a level of creativity, innovation, and dedication that can be difficult to sustain without a genuine interest and passion for the subject. Without passion, it can be challenging to maintain the motivation and focus necessary to push past the inevitable obstacles and setbacks that arise during the learning process. Additionally, passion can help drive the pursuit of excellence and the desire to continually improve and refine one's skills. Without this drive, it may be difficult to achieve the highest level of mastery in a given field. That being said, there are certainly examples of individuals who have achieved a high level of proficiency or expertise in a particular area despite lacking a strong passion for it. In these cases, it may be that other factors, such as a sense of duty, financial necessity, or a desire for recognition or status, have motivated the individual to continue developing their skills. However, it is important to note that these cases may be the exception rather than the rule, and that sustained success and fulfillment in a given field often depend on a genuine interest and passion for the work.” There you go. Case closed.

That’s exactly what I’m arguing. He is confusing expertise with mastery. An expert is knowledgeable and good at their field. But a master is that plus mastery of mindset. A master fundamentally has a different mindset than that of a newbie. If your mind is not changing in the process, then you aren’t really mastering anything. To get good at something requires a change in yourself.

Sounds like you have never experienced major depression, which is good. However, it seems like you are putting trailer in front of the car. That's the problem with following the philosophy of Andrew Tate. Besides the misogyny, he makes you think that depression is not real and that passion is not required for mastery. Passion is a necessity and not a luxury. You are run by passions and not by reasoning as you may think. A depressed person is not going to master things in their current state. Mastery is a relationship to life and the activity you are engaging in. Don't be fooled into thinking that if you change everything on the outside, then the inside will change too. So many people have become experts at their art and still been depressed and have killed themselves. I would not even call them ''masters'' because they failed in their mastery because mastery is much of a more psychological process than it is a physical one. But you haven't quite answered the question of how can you master something without passion/purpose? Purpose is primary and mastery is secondary. You gotta build a strong foundation before you can build the roof. You got it backwards, mastery is the outcome of a strong commitment to your passions. Passion isn't the roof, it is the foundation. Despite what Andrew Tate says, everything he does is emotional and led by desire.

Meditation teaches us that we don’t need anything to be happy. True happiness comes from within and from becoming independent. Being independent is very philosophical. You can never be independent as long as you need things which subtract from your health and independence. You need vegetables and fruits, but they are a need that allows you to thrive. Don’t confuse addiction with genuine need. Strive to be independent of addictions.

Yes. But what you didn’t get is that mastery requires passion. Desire and discipline go together.