LfcCharlie4

@ElvisN wouldn’t call it Semantics, none of the people you mentioned are Fully Self-Realized, it’s not like a 1=1 scenario where all awakenings are of the same depth and understanding. This is emphasised pretty clearly by Neo-Advaitans and teachers who haven’t awakened to love. these teachers may be awake, but have they had the 10th Ox Herding picture kind of awakening? Most haven’t. again not doubting these people have all had awakenings, and probably incredible experiences on Psyches and they’ve helped them so much, but they are not at the depth of True masters such as Ramana and Nisgardatta. If you want to see an embodiment of true western masters, go read/ watch Rupert Spira and Francis Lucille.

@Arzack i would just say there’s better teachers to “learn” from than Martin Ball, that’s all, such as Ramana, Nisgardatta, Rupert Spira, Francis Lucille, Adya, Shinzen Young to name a few. im also not denying the power of psychedelics for giving you insights and experiences. I do just feel, for me at least, nothing has beaten that lasting peace and happiness that a true awakening brings. if Psychedelics can help people realise the nature of their own being, then I’m all for it. The question was whether they alone can fully awaken someone, (Ramana, Nisgardatta depth of awakening) and I’m yet to see it, that’s all.

@Arzack I would look a bit more into that guy and how he is right now before using him as an example.

@mandyjw Sounds like a fun year full of growth Naturally, we go through periods of time where interests and hobbies drop away during the seeking process and when we are on this journey. However, post-seeking, when there is no need to listen/read more Non-Duality, the bulk of shadow work is worked through (ongoing process forever), and you have 'found' what you were after, the absolute peace and happiness. Then, we can begin to express this new understanding through our hobbies, passions, and interests, and even through our work and relationships, in all areas of life. So, it's almost like being reborn again as we integrate 'life' into this understand and act, behave and think/ feel with our new understanding, this is the integration work. But, maybe, like Rupert you want to express this understanding mainly through Teaching and writing. Or, it could come through your artistry once more. However, it doesn't mean you only talk about and think about spirituality. Rupert was saying when he's with Francis they literally don't mention a peep about this, as why would they? They have both realized the true nature of their being and aren't teaching at that time, so often he said do normal things, chat about family and play tennis for example. Basically, enjoy life. Ramaji and Ananda said on a Satsang how if they weren't teachers (and unless someone asked) they'd also be little need to talk about Non-Duality, they would get on with raising her children, playing Golf, 'normal' things. The ordinary is the extraordinary. At the same time, you could just go and become a Yogi/Monk if you wish, that's the point there is absolute freedom to do as you please. And, of course, a full Awakening these activities will come from a place of love and joy, so it's unlikely you'll go around harming or hurting people for example. One student even started acting post-awakening, simply for the joy of doing so!! This is what I mean by complete freedom So, while doing all this you could still have hobbies/ activities etc but you're no longer searching for happiness in them, simply doing them for the fun of it and to express the happiness and joy you feel inside of you. This way we actually have complete freedom and can dive even deeper into our activities, without any resistance and fully enjoy them in the now. Isn't that even more beautiful? My advice would be, follow your heart, your intuition and come from a place of love, and do what you love to do for 'work.' But, if you're financially free and secure then you have the freedom and time on a relative level to make this 'choice' or you just go about living life- Freedom is beautiful.

This is a follow on from the thread about money/ work post-awakening and how it can be expressed in a number of ways. And, why not all motivation comes from Ego, and how this understanding can be expressed in a huge number of ways. A touching watch, Rupert is an incredible example of doing just this, and following his desire to share this understanding through Speaking, Writing and his retreats. Teaching Non-duality isn't the only way to express this understanding, it can be expressed in literally any way. A mother/father staying at home raising their children(Imagine how sick being raised by 2 self-realized parents would be, Rupert's kid is so lucky), a schoolteacher, an Entrepreneur, an Animal Rights activist, a Musician, an Athlete, a Comedian. If it comes from a place of love and understanding and a desire to help/entertain others and treat others as they are- your very self- then who's to say it is the 'wrong' way to express the truth of reality. Each Body/Mind has a unique set of skills and traits which makes them equipped to different professions and interests, and these should not be denied but expressed and explored. Awakening shows us we have complete freedom to express and be ourselves in any way we see fit, that is the beauty. Also, helps make a distinction between relative/ absolute, even though the absolute is all there is. A great paradox as always However, as always awakening is the greatest service one can bring to the 'World.' Your own Self-Realization is the greatest service you can render the world.” Ramana Maharshi.

I would maybe go and get psychologically checked out, how's your diet, exercise, and sleep? Are you deficient in anything? I would really sort these out if possible, therapy could also really help if you're struggling Before talking about existential issues it's best to get the basics and fundamentals sorted, modern lifestyles don't support a baseline of happiness, unfortunately. By 'Work', awakening isn't always easy, but it's worth it, but once it 'happens' it's like an absolute effortlessness of Peace and Happiness that results. I will leave you with some articles from Rupert Spira on this. https://non-duality.rupertspira.com/read/happiness_is_knowing_our_own_being https://non-duality.rupertspira.com/read/peace_and_happiness_are_inherent_in_consciousness Btw, that song is fucking beautiful, I remember the Jay-Z remix when I was like 11, to me that song is actually an expression of love and joy of life, and points to 'living forever'- Consciousness can never die, so yes we do live forever, but the body will of course drop away. Another topic for another day!

@Prabhaker OSHO saying it like it is, the guy had his problems but this is true. Many teachers are afraid to talk about topics such as Money and Sex and avoid them as much as possible, I have great respect for anyone who addresses these head on. It's what drew me towards my teachers, they're 'regular' people who are in a relationship, have sex, and the Women has 3 children, makes it more relatable Thank YOU!!! You can still enjoy material things without being attached and identified with them, that intense attachment and identification with them is the problem, or thinking they can bring you happiness. Some attachment quotes- “Try not to confuse attachment with love. Attachment is about fear and dependency and has more to do with love of self than love of another. Love without attachment is the purest love because it isn’t about what others can give you because you’re empty. It is about what you can give others because you’re already full.” Yasmin Mogahed “Non-attachment is not indifference. When you are indifferent, you don’t look at a person. You are walking along the street and somebody is dying of thirst, but you will not look at him. If you are non-attached, your inner being will compel you to give him a glass of water. But if he doesn’t drink it, you will not feel sad or angry.” Contrary to what some people might believe, there is nothing wrong with having pleasures and enjoyments. What is wrong is the confused way we grasp onto these pleasures, turning them from a source of happiness into a source of pain and dissatisfaction. Lama Yeshe

@Amandine That sounds awesome, I can almost feel your happiness and positivity radiating through your post. I can't imagine carrying groceries by bike everywhere kudos to you. But, that's kind of what the Blue Zones do, so you've got the perfect foundations to live a very long time!! Doing what you enjoy is key for one main reason, its fun! And, when you have fun you keep doing, and that makes it sustainable. What's the point in crash diets and crazy exercise if we give up after a month right? for me it's more about lifestyle than yo-yoing Also, yes I LOVE Sports, it's not just the playing but the socializing as well, which makes for an amazing summer full of lots of playing and socializing and just fun. Sadhguru speaks a lot about sports and taking life less seriously, it's definitely the way to go. You occasionally get the odd ego maniac who goes crazy when they get out or something goes wrong, but being competitive is part of the fun (until people punch holes in the changing room of course ) I'm only 20 and even I get nostalgic about my school days, I really took for granted seeing my friends 6 hours a day, 5 days a week and then seeing them at weekends playing more sports. You're right it's like one minute you're out until dark every day, and then suddenly you've got a job or career and things like taxes to deal with, like thanks life @DrewNows Yeah man, well just look at the Gym guys injecting steroids and training for hours on end, it's like anything you can take it too far and things get out of balance. All about doing what's right for you and what you enjoy. Personally, I still love the gym and building my strength and my body and I still find it very fulfiling as it's now about overall enjoyment, health, strngth and aesthetics. Not solely gains like it is for many, that's like chasing solely money, there's no end to the void you're trying to fill. Just like anything, there's a 'conscious' and more 'holistic' way to even approach the Gym and Weight Training! I'm glad you're finding things you love, life is love, and when we do what we love, we only express that love and joy- our true being And, man it's been the BEST season of my life so far, haha. Worried about the 2nd Leg Vs Athletico though, not sure we'll score 2 against their incredible Low Block, need Keita to turn up for a change! (sorry just went football Twitter mode there) Have a great weekend you two

@electroBeam Thanks for the explanation, that makes more sense. I guess it's because they're held in such a pedestal on here, that's why I felt like that. But, I do believe they're a very useful tool P.S. I would say why not also have a teacher help you and Psychedelics, wouldn't that be like going to the gym and using steroids in some cases Just some food for thought.

@Leo Gura This is so true, once you realize love is all there is, and The Self is literally everything, why would you want millions to needlessly suffer when they don't have to. I really hope Bernie wins, our progressive candidate got fucked by a nationalist movement and we will be under this government for 10 years I reckon, and the Labour party now are doubting being that progressive and want to go back to more Centrist-Left which would be a shame. Bernie could really spearhead a movement, but are we ready for that level of development? Will their be too much resistance that pulls us further back down the spiral after 4-8 years? Also, how can people (regular people not like interested in personal growth) actually start to grow beyond selfishness, as the education system is so flawed, it's almost dumb luck stumbling into Non-Duality and Personal Development work, the majority couldn't give a toss.

@Johnny5 I know you were generalizing but just to clear up any confusion OP may have. @Mongu9719 Thoughts and Feelings still continue post-awakening, however, there is no I-Thought they get attached to, so there is no resistance to them and no 'stickiness' to emotions and thoughts, they flow like a river. They rise in awareness, do their thing, and go again. Normally we get entangled in our thoughts and feelings and identify with them. Investigate who is at the center of these thoughts and feelings, is anyone actually there or is just spaciousness? The mind is then used as a tool similar to a laptop, when you're doing your taxes and planning a trip the mind is useful and helpful, when you don't need it you simply don't use it, just like when you finish using a laptop you turn it off.

@dvdas I do agree, it seems to produce peak experiences, but like you said I don't know enough to comment myself. I would be more interested to know how it effects people on a moment by moment and day by day basis after these trips. The integration so to speak. These amazing awakening stories are great, but if the trips aren't integrated and your 'baseline' Consciousness/ Happiness/ Peace etc isn't increasing then aren't you missing the most important part. But, I could also be wrong and maybe some on here do have lasting awakenings from Psyches, I personally just prefer the absolute sense of peace and happiness over lots of peak experiences. My first MDMA roll showed me true love, and speared me on to take spirituality a lot further and quit dabbling, so they can be incredibly useful tools. But, as @Johnny5 it seems people expect them to do everything for them without actually doing the work and going through the hard stuff that nobody wants to admit is involved. However, more research is going into these compounds on their healing effects, even over here in the UK which is awesome and will be interesting to see, although I think it's a much lower dose than what people take or more 'awakening' trips. Dr Rosalind Watts and Professor Nutt (I know) are two main researchers over here in the UK. Would also be interesting to see the long term effects of regular use on Mental Health/ Brain Health etc, unless that's already been studied. Before, my first awakening I was depressed on and off for 2 years at the breakdown of My Sense of separate self, and trying to understand all of this conceptually. It's called the 'Dark Night of The Soul' and it can be fucking dark. But, the lasting light at the end of it is worth it more than anything else. I think it was Shinzen Young who said he would rather live one day knowing the truth about his being, rather than 100 days in his old way (typical life) of being. I think that shows the incredible depth of this work

@TheAvatarState I liked your comment, on the varying levels of consciousness. I would add that everyone is The Absolute, yet many just aren't conscious of this yet. As Rupert says 'Each of us now is essentially the light of pure being, in some cases this being is still veiled by X, Y and Z. I have no sense of being an enlightened person. Just the nature of my being is clear to me.' 'I don't feel that I'm an enlightened person, I don't see any unenlightened people. I see all these beings, that in some cases beings is veiled by a veneer of thoughts, feelings etc, hence why we do these contemplations, meditations and conversations.' From this video- Francis Lucille- 'One is always in the absolute state, knowingly or unknowingly, for there is nothing else. To be in the absolute state means to be happy, content and at peace without the slightest restriction. What is said here is to be understood experientially and not theoretically.' How could it be any other way? All there is, is The Absolute.

@Nahm Yep, we're going down a very John Lennon path here! (Someone who lived their purpose but died way too young ) But, I completely get you, and we will get there one day, whether in our lifetimes or not, that's another question. @VeganAwake @electroBeam For as smart as Hawking was, he had his flaws. He also said we are computers that shut down when we die and that's it, seems a very materialist POV, amazing scientist nonetheless! I see both sides, AI is basically a tool, in the wrong hands it could wreak havoc, in the right hands it could develop humanity immensely. Maybe, it'll get dystopic before Utopic- who knows

@JonasVE12 That sounds fucking awesome man, I also go 3 days a week, but get nowhere near the volume, it's very Minimalist I don't like jumping ship so I'll keep this up for at least the year, but 5x5 is defo something I want to look into. Although I have slight lower back issues so may need to get them addressed if I am to start doing heavy deadlifts 3x per week, and when I'm playing my sport in summer it could be overkill. @Arcangelo Sorry I'm a noob, MTB and BTK? Laundry sounds awesome That's what I meant about Low-Level throughout the day, everyone can do some jumping jacks when the coffee is brewing or some mountain climbers in between Netflix episodes- no excuses @Soulbass Awesome. @Gili Trawangan Using Non-Duality as an excuse, I'll let you off @Preety_India What @Arcangelo said, even daily 10 minute walks will help, start small and gradually build up @DrewNows Good vid man, excess dopamine is no joke! And, I get you, everyone has different focuses. I personally believe some form of routine is great without becoming completely Anal about it. Like if you only workout 'when you feel like it' you probs won't get very far, but if you make it a habit that you hit the gym 3x a week, you'll go regardless. However, proper eating and rest and you'll usually get addicted to exercise so it won't take that much discipline Like I like to have a structure for Work and Working out usually, for me it just helps me stay focused and know what I'm doing, I've found without it I can easily get distracted especially when working.

@TrynaBeTurquoise Yep I'll happily admit I still want to look good- 'OMG EGO!!' I think it's natural to do so, but like you said a lot of women don't even like the bodybuilding look, so if you're in it for that, go learn conscious game and social skills! And, taking a more holistic approach improves many other areas of your health and fitness, and focusing on exercise you enjoy = way more fulfilment. Like if I stopped enjoying weight training, I'd find something else because that's not sustainable at all. Enjoyment is such a big piece of the pie many forget, and talk about the grind/hustle etc, but training is meant to be fun in my eyes. And looool, if you have a second look at his latest smoothie video, shit you not there's like 20+ ingredients in there, he said all in all per smoothie you're looking at like $8-10 but is open about it. Obviously ridiculously healthy though.

@TrynaBeTurquoise Awesome man, thanks for the detailed reply. I think I remember checking out the podcast on Intuitive eating you linked a while back. Sounds awesome, I feel the transition for purely training for gains, to overall health and wellbeing is a huge step as it really makes you go down the rabbit hole. Ben greenfield is fucking shredded for his age as well, that reminds me I need to get my Tabatas in today!

@GreenWoods To me it just seems like you're trying to make some sort of equation or science out of behavior post-awakening which I don't think is really possible. Can I ask; have you had an awakening? And do you 'live in Non-Duality'? Basically, that's a fancy way of saying are you stabilized in absolute Peace and Happiness and have you recognized the truth of your being. When you truly awaken to love and realize The Absolute/Self is all that exists, and you abide and live the understanding, yes you will of course act from a place of love and truth. This is why I don't believe people like Mooji/ Betinho have had full awakenings, how could you manipulate and abuse Women sexually if you know you're only abusing yourself. I also see your point about Veganism, but I'm not sure many Non-Dual teachers have actually investigated this deeply, so could genuinely be ignorant about it. The Separate Entity doesn't exist so it's not a matter of whether free will exists, the question doesn't need to be asked. From the point of view of a separate self it SEEMS we have Free-Will, so if you add a belief, 'There's no Free-Will' that's just another belief, not the truth based on an investigation into your own being. You could say all is God's will or The Absolutes will. People often wonder well how do I take action if there is no Free-Will or No Entity, well you now actually have The Universe/Absolute as the power behind your actions, not merely a separate self that didn't ever exist to begin with. If by Altruistic, you mean the more loving you become in general then yes. But, love isn't simply just donating all your money and feeding the poor, it can be, but doesn't HAVE to be. Holding the door open for someone is love, treating all others as if they are your very self is love, even these simple acts are acts of love, it doesn't have to be grand gestures and huge donations. I really wish I could link you a Satsang but it's paid content and I'm not allowed, I might PM you the link and it's down to you if you wanna purchase it. Love has no end to how deep it can go, God=Love=Consciousness, love is literally reality. Teachers who haven't had an awakening into love haven't gone deep enough. However, awakening doesn't mean you have to live a life of poverty or donate all of your money, as I have said you can be awakened and manifest your dream 'life' simultaneously, and act more loving. You don't have to choose Wealth (or any other form of 'Worldly Success') or Awakening, @Nahm has a thread on this I believe. My best piece of advice would be stop creating beliefs and idealizations of how Awakened beings have to act and behave, have true, deep awakenings, Realize the nature of your being and the nature of reality, Abide as that understanding and then find out yourself. Also remember, this understanding is expressed uniquely in each being, as each body/mind is unique, while we are simultaneously all one. Another fun paradox. I posted this on another thread, and it may help

@JonasVE12 Bro that's insane, how many days are you in the Gym?

@mandyjw I agree. What are you feeling pulled towards out of interest? @Nahm Yep! Anyone doing what they love, in a way that benefits and inspires others to pursue what they love is doing a selfless act, whether they know it or not! People think AI taking jobs is so terrible, but to me it allows for the jobs that nobody wants to be done for us, so we are free to explore our true passions and purpose. @VeganAwake <3 Yes man! I loved that story, it's similar to a billionaire donating millions, only to have his name on the plaque of the new hospital! Compared to the guy doing it out of love and to genuinely help the community The motivation behind it is key! I like to use sports examples as that's one of my passions. The guy wanting to be the best footballer in the world for the money, status and recognition it brings. Compared to the guy wanting to be the best footballer he can be, help his team the most, all because he loves and enjoys the game so much and wants to help his team as much as possible! (Same could be said for the coach wanting to solely win for his own ego, and the coach wanting to improve his team as much as possible and become the best and win for the enjoyment of it) One coming from an egoic agenda, one coming from love and understanding and joy. I could go on and on and on

@TrynaBeTurquoise This is the approach I'm trying to go down, currently shedding excess fat from a few years of Bulking/ Cutting as I used to be incredibly skinny. So, now do you just Train with the aim of improving strength and then keep your calories/ amount you eat the same all year to maintain a low BF and steadily build muscle?

@Leo Gura was this full awakening during a trip, and how has it effected Day-To-Day life?

@mandyjw Glad it helped This understanding can be expressed beautifully in so many ways. Rupert's an amazing teacher, to me, the 'best' Western embodiment of this understanding, as is his teacher Francis. What also helped me relate to them, was how 'Normal' they are. I love Ramana and Nisgardatta but it can sometimes be hard to relate as they Eastern Gurus, from Eastern Traditions of the last century, Rupert is a western teacher in modern times who has a Wife, Child and lives in the UK, very relatable

https://non-duality.rupertspira.com/watch/what-is-the-right-job-to-do

@Gili Trawangan Time to add in some more maybe? @Shiva99 Awesome. Training for anything like a race?