bazera

@theleelajoker That's a very good idea, I'll surely do that

Hey, For the last couple of days I've been experiencing a break-up of my 4 years old relationship (I'm 29 years old guy currently). Before that I haven't really had any relationships so this was a first time, and the breakup is also the first one. So as this was an unknown feeling, I wasn't prepared for it and it hurts like hell. For the context, she broke up with me, and she already had another guy in her life which she had feelings for, so the decision went against me. The reasons for that are pretty messy, it involved mistakes from both sides. Basically, insecurities, addictions, cravings, fear of truth and lack of consistent conscious communication and maturity are the reasons relationship fell apart over the months. I think we could have rebuilt it if she was willing but the trust is completely gone from my side because she literally started to have feelings for another guy and didn't stop seeing him for couple weeks before she told me what was happening. But anyways, at least she was truthful in the end. We weren't living together, nor we planned that, or anything basically, we were just going with the flow, and that flow took us to a dead end. There was not a conscious leadership from my part, especially over the last couple months. First few days was like a constant dagger in my heart with lots of crying (which really helped to be honest, I have not cried for so many years but now it really helped me). Now, I feel horrible emptiness, it's like part of myself is cut off after so much time and it's just emptiness there. I'm trying to fill it with friends, family, exercise and stuff to do but I also realize that is just an attempt to ignore reality of this emptiness and embrace it with just sitting in silence. Also, I have a problem of idealizing her, in my mind she had most of the things I value and want as partner, a cute girl with the same values as me, same interests mostly, great sense of humor, etc. But that didn't turn out to be enough for us to sustain a healthy conscious relationship. What I want to know is when will this wound be healed. I also know that it varies from person to person, but what is your experience? Also, I want to use this experience as an exercise to look into the existential part of it. I mean, I was fulfilled in this relationship at some level but I felt I still lack something. Even if everythig had gone well, I intuit that I'd still not be really satisfied. And now I think it won't matter in the future as well, relationships of any kind won't make me as fulfilled as I want, like existentially speaking. And I'm not sure what to make of that idea. Maybe I'm wrong. I will use this experience as one of the greatest resets of my life, and I'll make sure not to do the same mistakes in the future relationships, because if I don't make an effort towards that now, those years will be for nothing really. How do you cope with breakups? The reason for posting was also to just have some people to talk to about this who are aware of consciousness work, survival games and stuff like that, because I want to view relationships in that proper context, what really matters ultimately.

@Madhur Yes you are very young and I'd do it absolutely, considering that if it doesn't go as planned you can always find another job while your parents are supporting you. You just have to use and direct those feelings towards something creative, every day, and track your progress as well weekly maybe. 6 months is not as long as you think, it will go really fast, and make sure you have something to show for it, even if it doesn't get you any money. At the moment you don't have that many responsibilities (your own family I assume, kids, rent, loan, etc), which gives you the freedom to do it, as long as your parent are okay with it. The reason I mention responsibilities is that you won't be like that forever, things will add up as years go by and it will be more and more difficult to live without a monthly paycheck. So do it while it's easier. Share with us what you create after those months

@Ero Congrats man! I'm in software development, but not doing ambitious things (at least by my standards), I mainly do front-end for companies for the last couple years, the pay is good and I haven't really tried anything else. If I wanted to go towards entrepreneurship and working on a business, what field would you recommend? "AI" is such a buzzword today, but what would you say are it's usage in business world as of today that we can leverage as creators? Also, how would you compare working 9-5 (if you even have) to working on your business, effort-wise and also how fulfilled are you?

@UpperMaster I haven't dated much through social media, and I don't have Insta page set up but I know friends who had dates after chatting up girls on Instagram. I think it's not a primary, but something to have just because why not. Also, depends on girl, my last girlfriend didn't use Instagram that much, other then scrolling for some cute memes. You just have to try and see. Try couple months with (restricted access to not waste time) and then without it and you'll know. If you incline towards not having one, I'm sure you'll still have success with girls, I don't see a reason why you won't. Of couse if all the other things are in place from your side like socialization, talking to girls, etc.

@UpperMaster Just put up some blocker app, the way I use Instagram is that I have an app called "Stay Focused" on my android phone, and I have the following settings set to Instagram: only allow me to use 10 minutes at a time, 30 minutes in total daily. That will restrict you to not spend too much time like crazy. If you start messaging a girl on the app, you can deactivate those settings later, but if you want to avoid doom-scrolling and wasting time, and still want to have app to follow girls, you can do what I do.

@theleelajoker Dreams are strange, overlooked phenomenon. It's cool that you've been using them for resolving life issues. Yeah seems to be something similar. Going through that chain is the bulk of the emotional work I think. But at the moment I'm so exhausted emotionally, I don't event want to frame that as "work". For some time, I'll spend 80% of the time in solitude contemplating on my past, actions, this relationship in particular, attachments, pain, heartbreak, etc. And I'll feel everything that comes up. And I'll spend 20% of my time researching stuff, maybe there is something I miss, like an approach that helps with something, or some way to distance myself from all this and look at it objectively. Again, thanks for sharing, helps a lot.

@theleelajoker Yeah...you are right. There is no rush of improvement either. I also take my time, sit and think a lot on what has happened. Not only in the last 4 years but before that as well. I think one thing that ending this relationship will cause for me is that I'll become more contemplative in general, because without that I'm like running hamster on the wheel, towards next relationship and next hobbie and next XYZ. I need to slow down. Thanks for the advice. One thing I didn't anticipate are dreams. When I think that emotions cooled down a bit and I can concentrate on work for example, and then take a nap and dream about some scenarios with her, I wake up super anxious and the circle starts all over again. But I trust that that will also fade away with time.

@theleelajoker Yeah, pretty much. Somebody said this on reddit which made me a bit more hopeful: "there will be a day when you realize that she's the second thing you think about when you wake up. then soon she will be the third. and the fourth. then soon enough it will be hours, days, a week even and you realized you haven't given her one bit of thought." Yeah that's exactly what I do. But sometimes I want none of those, just my own judgement and contemplation, which I often ignore and postpone, because I guess it's scary to confront truth about the self. But without this I can make same mistakes in future relationships. That's what is twisted about this situation. Simultaniously it's really painful and benefitial at the same time. It's a huge growth oppotunity, with multiple pillars like having all this emotions and attachment on the surface to work with, planning and hatching a plan of getting better in different ways and actually executing on those bit by bit daily weekly monthly, etc. So yea, I think when I look back after 5 years, I'd be glad that this happend. But that will require some years.

For me sharing my plans and goals with people causes some dopamine hits and feels that I've actually accomplished something, and later I might not take much action towards them. I don't know if that's actually a dopamine but it comes with a satisfying feeling, it's addictive. And then when I plan to do something, I get an urge to tell somebody, which is not healthy I think. Also, it might also be a hidden motive of wanting to validate your plans and goals with others before you commit to it. Just observe why you tend to share your plans and goals, really look into what are you trying to do there, is that net positive or negative. Now I personally don't share much, I prefer to show them results if anything.

Have you guys tried any supplements that help with lucid dreaming? I think the ones that help with meditation should also affect dream clarity at some point, shoudn't it?

@theleelajoker I just did that today, literally 4 days after the breakup. It was clearly a mistake I need to wait a bit more, couple weeks at least to allow emotions to cool down. Another trap is reading old loving messages, that shit hurts. I want to start meditation as explained in Culasada's book The Mind Illuminated. That's also basically breath-watching and constant mind-redirecting. I did it on and off for the last couple years, now I really need to make it consistent to see the actual results of what it does to psyche and my experience of life in general. That will feel nice. Yeah and all of them give advice, not realising that their advice is hugely biased with their life experience and nobody is aware enough to be careful with that. Which is not bad per se but might be confusing at times.

@theleelajoker Thanks man One thing I like to do and that I'd add to that list is just sitting alone in silence (maybe in darkness as well), and reflecting on life in general, the decisions and actions made that led to this place right here. Really trying feeling and reliving old experiences, especially the hard ones. Tears and laughter are also common when I do that. It's not as flashy as breathwork or dancing but it brings some melancholic feelings as well. I haven't gone to therapist yet but I think I will and tell him / her everything that I am keeping to myself now. It's really hard for me to cry in front of somebody, but therapist would be a nice choise since it's kinda her job to allow me express anything, and that will be conforting. A good place to start. How does meditation help with that? In what particular ways?

@BlessedLion Nice. How did you start? What is your story, were you extroverted since your teenage years or introverted and had to develop those skills in a hard way like most of us. How did you overcome all the fears? I guess with just action, trial and error and experience and not giving up. I'm sure all those relationships and lovers would bring lots of drama in your life, didn't that distract you from other activities you were doing?

Got it

@Someone here I was referring to a concept from Leo's video called "Burning Through Karma - How To Exhaust Material Desires" Why do you think that? I'm also at your age and thinking about these stuff, considering different life scenarios. When it comes to having family and kids, in my mind it interferes with the possibility of doing lots of consciousness work, who knows what comes up. Maybe after having kids I regret them, or maybe if I don't exhaust my need of being with different girls, I won't be happy in any kinds of marriage. Just thinking along those lines. But at the same time, time flies.

@theleelajoker Yes, I kinda think that is true, but not sure. Do you know any other ways of experiencing and expressing that pent up emotions in a safe way? One thing that comes to mind is shamanic breathwork, because every time I did it some emotions would come up, maybe some tears as well, some laughter. But I'm not sure if I'm bullshiting in that moment or something fruitful is really happening. I guess psychedelics would be another option, but I don't have access to them at the moment (or near future)

@trenton I'm not sure what love is at the moment. I haven't experience being love as you mention, but I loved this girl, but I'm not sure what I mean by that. She told me she loved me and then chose other person. I guess what we call love there is basically a combination of attachment, satisfying needs, companionship, friendship, value alignment and may other things. I also have a small cute dog who jumps up and down licking my face every time I see her, and gets very sad every time I'm not around. To me I feel loved when that happens, even though it's "just" a dog. But maybe if she had an ego of it's own and we had conflicting biases, it won't be that simple, which is the case for two human beings. Oh man, relationships are messy, at least I figured that out.

@StaraX I realize that the reason my mind comes with thoughts like that is due to inexperience. If I had experience with lots of women, I'd probably not idealize her as I might be doing now to some degree (she had her own obvious flaws, but still). The key for me now it to gain more experience, that's the next best thing I can do in this case. First of all, iron out all the flaws that messed up this relationship from my side (will take couple months at least), contemplate the experience of the last 4 years A LOT, and hatch a new plan of socialization and all the stuff Leo talks about in that 3 part series. It's scary to be honest, but in couple years when I look but, I will be very grateful I'm sure.

There is also this constant regret and "what ifs". What if I did this, what if I did that, etc. Everything would go great. But I didn't, and it didn't. The only thing hopeful is the possibility of improving myself. That's the source of a real motivation. I guess handling this emotions, not becoming desperate and miserable and staying hopeful is part of that process.

@Someone here When I became an uncle, I had an exact opposite feeling, like I didn't want that hustle of having a kid and orienting my whole life and priorities towards that one thing. Not sure why, but I think the main reason is that I have some things to do first, some karma to burn, and I think family / kids lifestyle won't suit me. Don't you have some feelings of that "karma" that you need to burn before commiting like that or you already burned through enough that it was enough. And before when you didn't want kids, how did you envision your life? like what did you image you'd do instead of having kids and family? Btw, how old are you?

What are your motivations of having kids? Have you even considered not having them?

@trenton I saw your other posts in other threads about God Realization and spirituality. Doesn't that help? I mean, you seem to have some spiritual and existencial understanding of reality, how does that change an experience of breakup if it does? I mean, doesn't that help shift a perspective from self-centered to a bit more objective, thus making coping with suffering easier? or maybe that's just my fantasies about spirituality speaking.

@theleelajoker yea, thanks man. Exactly, my dad passed away last year and I wasn't able to cry, I am not sure why because I loved him very much. But now I went to his grave and cried my eyes out, and that felt really good, it felt like I emptied a year or pented up emotions in 30 minutes. Even if she did, I would refuce to get back to her because I can't trust her no more. And for me trust is very important in a monogamous relationship. Yeah of course she has her set of problems, I had mine. I try not to blame either of us because that was the point of maturity that we were on at that time. Maybe if I met her older, I'd be more mature to not do stupid shit that I did. But it was what it was. Thanks for the advice

@TheGod I can't unfortunately, and lots of places that we hung out are still around, so I have to deal with the memories all the time. Yup, I already started / resumed. That's hard to hear, but it is what it is. Thanks