Phil777

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@Leo Gura Yo Leo, what makes you call it alien as in distinct from all your previous insights into God consciousness or absolute infinity? On the surface this sounds like an aesthetic thing but I can't imagine that that's what you mean by that. It's not an infinite state of alien aesthetic and vibe, right? If not, what is it and why is it distinct from God realization? Isn't God all of reality? Why draw such a clear distinction between human and alien consciousness? In case it's not clear why I am questioning your statements like this: I am hyper curious? Oh and please make a course of how to reach alien infinite consciousness lol. I would imagine the salespitch for that gives the impression of some Rick and Morty intergalactic TV advertisment lmao.

My post critiquing Leo's Leftist episode stirred a few heated arguments and even got an insult out of Leo. Maybe because I called him stupid in my initial post... but then again he called most of humanity stupid to begin with so he did it first haha what childish shit this is. Leo thought I am trying to gaslight him. What I actually tried to do is provoke him to reconsider his views and address my concerns through intellectual warfare (coming up with the best arguments and dropping them with ferocity). I was naive it would have the effect I intended. So what I was lacking was EQ, not realizing what emotions I would stir and being too unconscious of my own emotions while writing it out: Although I still think I am trying to do what's right, do the loving thing, I was coming from arrogance, pride, and anger I think if I had stated things more respectfully, maybe asking for clarification or further insight, I would have 1. gotten, better more useful responses for myself, and 2. maybe would have gotten Leo to think about my points a bit more seriously and 3. everyone reading it would have gotten more constructive perspectives, insights, and a better vibe out of it. Now I am just really curious how we can transcend this ineffective and hostile way of debating and come up with good communication strategies that are not only way more effective at communicating the intended meaning behind what we said but also induce a warmer "vibe" in the forum. I don't know about you but I appreciate a sense of acceptance and openness. So how can you talk about difficult, complex, and controversial topics in a warm, civil, and chill way without compromising depth or truth? If someone starts to become insulting, we address the emotion behind that with compassion instead of lashing out for example. I feel like we got a ton of IQ and SQ (spiritual intelligence) but maybe a lack of EQ going on. I am probably projecting a lot, I am sure, so I speak mostly for myself here. Does anyone have any good tips or maybe book recommendations that revolutionized your communication effectiveness and harmony in your relationships? Cheers.

@Tahuti Have you read the title of this threat? I critiqued him harshly and many agreed. Leo allowed it to happen and didn't censor anyone. The vast majority here are not blindly following him. So stop throwing around these accusations because you saw it in a video somewhere.

@Danioover9000 Am I open to being conservative? In theory I am open to it. But I never really adapt conservative positions for a number of reasons. I am interested in the truth and what gets me the best results for my goals and ambitions. For the first endeavour, radical open mindedness and non dogmatic thinking is a must so most conservative positions immediately collapse when looked at through this lens. And when it comes to being successful and reaching my goals, being adaptable and evolving with immerging knowledge and technology is crucial. Conservatism doesn't really bring much to the table in the context of success and navigating an ever changing society and marketplace. In summary, I am open to it, it just naturally doesn't happen that I ever seriously adapt any conservative positions. The only time it may look like I am being conservative is when I am in opposition to "progressive" insanity like transgender females (biologically male) in sports competitions with other women. The number one value of conservatism for me to polish the change coming from progressives, pressure test it and expose any bs. For example the DailyWire documentary "what is a woman" had some solid points and it exposed a lot of nonsense in the LGBTQ movement.

@DocWatts thanks man. You are dropping some serious value in this threat. Will check out your book recommendations??

@Bobby_2021 come on, soy is great. e.g. tofu is cheap, healthy, packed full of protein and not plastered with antinutrients and omega 6 like most factory farmed meats (about 98 percent of meat is low quality factory farmed garbage). It takes on whatever spice you stir it in. It's great. Does it taste as good as a grass fed Ripeye? Nah, and that's fine. Yeah, if you want what's best for the animal and for the consumer of it's flesh, it should eat grass and the byproducts of plant agriculture (leaves, stems etc.). And hey if you manage to efficiently do that, raising a happy, grass fed cow, amazing. The reality is that 98 percent of meat is factory farmed, where they get nothing but soy and corn. I grand you they also eat parts of these plants that we humans cannot digest which softens the disparity I mentioned in my initial post significantly.

@King Merk They ate significant amounts of meat. Yes. But most of their calories came from plants. As a non civilized human, meat is essential to get certain micronutrients and enough protein. I give you that. Today things are different as you can probably imagine.

I'll go do that over the weekend. Next week should be amazing???

@Leo Gura You got this❤️

Tip. If you feel the need to use profanity, try doing ten push-ups first.

@Leo Gura I get where you are coming from. I agree that we need a more spiral wizard approach but we also need a growing and increasingly strong left. So let's not demonize stage green tendencies but aim to transmute them. We need to keep pushing for the right thing but do so intelligently. The right is winning the culture war and it's looking rather scary. So we need a fire under our ass, a desire for a better world. And this idealistic drive is what green is all about. But you are totally right in that it needs to be done in a calibrated and intelligent way. With increasing development comes increasing responsibility @Godhead Leo doesn't dispute that the right is to blame for its own antics and corruption. His video on the left is just for us lefties to better deal with them without making the problem worse. What can we do to actually and effectively understand the right and help it evolve? Cause if we help them evolve, we can evolve better ourselves cause - democracy.

@Leo Gura Strong! very strong! I am in.

@Thought ArtYou can categorize me how you want if that is helpful to you. I won't argue this point any further. I have some food for thought from you. I'll let that simmer a bit. Hopefully you will too and haven't shut down due to my conduct. I think we need to be careful not to demonize green tendencies within us and aim to let them flourish in healthy way under the guidance of tier 2 If you are curious about my self reflections, go see my post about effective communication. I reflect on my mistake with starting the initial post in the way I did. I made a lot of mistakes and I will aim to do much better in the future. So, this was helpful to me, your reflections were helpful to me. Thank you. And if my perspectives and suggestions seemed rude or condescending to you, my apologies.

@Thought Art @Thought Art What I am quite certain of (learning to phrase things in less absolute terms here) is that, first of all, Leo's assesment of vegans in terms of spiral development is limited and that you only think "but you argue about it" is a valid indicator for green, rather than yellow because it's the vegan issue and people have gotten so used to associate it with "annoying vegans" pushing their vegan agenda. It's a relative cultural groove, part of the current Zeitgeist. This topic is culturally at the tipping point where the majority just wants to be comfortable and ngaf about animals and a fast growing minority is willing to push for change. It's working, the numbers don't lie, at least in first world countries. How come that it's only really with the vegan issue we are seeing this kind of rhetoric where simply mentioning it, let alone some respectful arguments in favour of veganism and in opposition to meat consumption, will cause one to be labeled as angry, annoying or in stage green, not respecting others preferences. There is nothing inherently stage yellow about not engaging in productive debates. I don't do this in real life with anyone who isn't at least a bit curious, that isn't willing to listen or who doesn't argue in good faith. I let people live how they want to and sprinkle some facts in here and there if it makes sense in the context of the natural flow of our conversation. I was eating omnivorous for 19 years so I know what it's like. I sympathize. This forum however is an open marketplace of ideas for people who want to debate things with intellectual curiosity. I am not arguing under the illusion that I will change what you, Leo or anyone puts into their bodies but simply to test and to hear what other, smart and curious individuals have to say on the issue. And if in this space, where we want to find truth with a capital T, arguments about plant based dieting are discredited with "you annoying stage 1, green vegan", we are missing the mark. I get that that's not how you think in particular. It's not so much about veganism specifically either but the motivations behind it, the worldview and level of development that creates a drive and concern beyond oneself, beyond ones species even. And it is to a large extend indicative of typical leftist values. And those were in my humble opinion, at some points a bit unskillfully questioned in his first video. He brought up the topic of veganism in his video, and he made arguements that don't hold up under scrutiny. So according to your own criteria for categorization "actively arguing about things", Leo with his take on veganism in his video and his responses in this chat, isn't coming from tier 2. If veganism is the best diet from a purely harm reduction and ethics stand point, where is an argument against it and in favour of eating meat positioned? Orange? See where we are starting to tread in murky waters with sd? Only cause eating meat is default doesn't mean that arguing for it isn't as annoying or uncalibrated as vegan arguments. If Leo has a gut condition and needs to eat purely meat to feel good, he should go for it btw. I think that's his motivation behind carnivore if I am not mistaken. Also look at what you see in me and look at Leo's responses. He called me a jackass? I am not certain about many things but that's definitely not the result of tier 2 cognition. So, let's use spiral dynamics as it is intended, as a guideline for better understanding our fellow humans and a tool for humble self reflection rather than a way to feel superior, special or elite.

To balance things out: Leo appreciation post coming soon

@Thought Art Nah. I don't see that here honestly. I used to be a bit obnoxious in my starting days 4 years ago, Quickly learned that that's not effective one bit. Eating meat doesn't have special protection against criticism and no, vegans are not automatically obnoxious stage green vegans for bringing forth good arguments in a proactive and respectful manner. I am chill with people eating meat in front of me, I enjoy eating meat. I just don't do it for reasons ABC. I even know someone who studies meat processing specifically and am really cool with him. You misjudged me prematurely... which isn't very stage yellow. Be careful not to misuse spiral dynamics to confirm your hunches. My arguments made you uncomfortable. So you put me in a lower tier down the spiral. Easy checkmate, It's the move Leo mentioned in the left episode, where you put someone in a category: racist, orange, tier 1, whatever. You miss the substance of what's being actually said when you do that. But hey, now you learned, if you are open, that you may have some blind spots as well Hit me with more. Let's grow together through civil discourse I'll hit the mat and do some qi gong now as well. Working on the Dragon Orbit again Do you practice semen retention as well alongside your Qi Gong practice?

@Thought Art I have seen all videos on spiral dynamics on Leo's channel including yellow and the taken-down turquoise, so I am familiar with the idea of tier 2, the concept aware, spiral-stage aware , and systems thinking, higher consciousness stages. So tell me about the three major behaviors I do, that a stage yellow person wouldn't engage in? Just short bites are enough. I am genuinely interested in my blind spots and where I can grow more

@Thought Art And I don't think you've really studied tier 2

@RareGodzilla Very sensible take. I get where a lot of you are coming from, thanks for the encouragement! "Die Linke" is not as developed and integrous as many think though. I would say, ironically the green party is the most stage green in our government haha. And they use a lot of stage yellow approaches. They are for saving the environment, investing heavily in renewables and ecological preservation, yet are now buying gas from Qatar because we need it rn to meet our own "selfish" needs. No "idiot compassion" here. Also they are adamant supporters of the Ukrainian war effort.

Ok, but let's say I would do it right now, what happens to my conscious experience when I kill my body?

@Leo Gura I am not a Jackass, Leo. Watch your tone. If you stood in front of me, you wouldn't talk to me like that. So be civil. False equivalency: The current situation with meat consumption is more comparable to the US in the 19th century if we wanna draw the analogy to slavery. Why? because we have a significant vegan and animal welfare movement that is growing exponentially (this includes food tech like lab-grown meat). And to see that slavery is wrong and not do something about it because it may take a long time or is very difficult is not what a tier 2 person would do. You would get creative and still clearly advocate it, but calibrated and tailored to the person you are talking to (culture, stage of development). I am in favour of animal welfare and social security and promote it clearly and precisely yet I accept the current situation and do not let it affect me to the point where it sabotages my effectiveness and inner tranquility. I am not naive to think that it will happen overnight. But change only comes when we keep pushing for it. EVs only became viable because Tesla pushed for it with determination, skill and excellence. Innovation needs a kickstart. So to sit in your armchair, advocate complacency (300-year timeframe) and call yourself an advanced thinker in the process isn't doing any good. You are not doing any good with that. That's my claim. If you don't care about that we can't make progress.

@LordFall You do realize that your mind is powerful. What you focus on and what you envision has power. Look into manifestation teachings for more info on this. You can test this hypothesis. More key words: reality transurfing, law of assumption/attraction, Neville Goddard This is where spiral dynamics reaches it's limits. If you look through it's lens, you will come up with horror scenarios like you just did. You basically believe that the worst possible scenario that could emerge with the new technologies will be our future. Why, why do you do this? This isn't rational and based on your bisaes and selective attention. How about you stop misusing your mind and train it to come up with more holistic and promising scenarios? Of all possibilites you have chosen this. Why? Because you are looking through fear, you are looking through limited models of reality, because your mind is unconsciously running wild and you are not controlling it. Let me tell you another reason why Leos 200 to 300 year time frame is not sensible: Until then we have reached the technological singurality with general prupose AI exceedeing human intelligence by a million fold. How do you think spiral dynamics, that nice, little cozy, linear model holds up to predict what will happen at this point?

@Leo Gura So what happens when you harm the body to the point that it "dies", if it's not death?

You will probably live another 50-60 years, I even 60-70 years. So what will happen in our lifetimes is like 90-95 percent mix of electric and hydrogen (and better future technologies). No one is expecting perfection or absolutes. Same with veganism, social security and healthcare reform. If you americans fail to do it, you won't be competitive long term as your populations creative and innovative capability is locked up in a dreadful and fearful rat race of unsafety and existential angst.