RevoCulture

@Nahm Its interesting that you seem to hold the position, correct me if I am wrong, that if you are self-realized that you somehow can't retain an ego identity? As if you can't know the illusion of the ego and yet at the same time allow it to function and enjoy the presence of it. That makes me sad, because it is possible, people do do it and i find those people to typically be more humble, enjoyable to be around, and rather insightful. I see your responses in the forum continually push hard for one thing, the unnameable, the unknowable, Logos, Parabrahm etc... You don't seem to make much space for the life between here and there. It is usually about obliterating any acknowledgment of the division and consistently driving to the unified position. Obviously you are correct, however, it isn't challenging to burn everything down and continually claim the unified peak, as if it was a race to the top. I believe there is a trend, those that racing to the peak enjoy the thrill for some time. It is a position know one can refute. After a while racing to the top becomes unfulfilling and we climb back down and give life back to all the pieces. It is a process, another stepping stone in the journey, and there is no rush and no preferred place to be. One family member sharing stories with another. Thanks for yours. I am a fan of the unified field, everything else isn't real, any aspect outside your true self is not real, duality doesn't matter mind game and you have got some real skill for it breaking it down..

@Nahm So are you saying that those figures were not self-realized? I actually have seen plenty of people be cynical with themselves. Is there something wrong with being cynical? Does being cynical exclude a person from being self-realized? Do you hold a belief that being self-realized would require a person to act a particular way? How does a self-realized person act? Appreciate your responses..

@Nahm 13 hours ago, OmniYoga said: can you be self-realized and cynical for example or toying with people? No. That’s conflation. Question then... I have read the Vipassana literature where Gautama The Buddha refused to let women join the Sangha. He held opinions about women and their place, regardless of the social norms at at the time, that is a position a self-realized being took. A person generally accepted as being beyond the confines of meaning held within the expression of culture (which might need to be reconsidered, maybe being self-realized doesn't elevate people beyond life but, more humbly and simply, shows them life). I'm sure you are well aware that there have been numerous other self-realized beings who have also fell from grace. If you think these people where not self-realized because of the acts or positions they took we have two options. 1) None of these master were actually self-realized, including the Buddha. 2) Your notion of what it means to be self-realized is out of alignment with what it means to be self-realized.

@OmniYoga "that's true after asking the question, I've noticed I lose intrest for answears that doesn't come from me, and rarelly if ever those answear of others leads to my deepr understanding".. The videos you watch, the books you read, the conversations you have... the things that don't come from you... rarely, if ever, leads to deeper understanding.. wow.. do you truly feel that way?

@traveler Sweet... Right on.. Thanks for the clarification. I am totally one to check in with people when short comments that consist of a couple sentences are left. I can totally admit that I was digging in and questioning your position, with projections in mind.. based on what was left.. There wasn't much direction for anyone not inside your brain when it was written. As you can see from your original comment it would be easy to think you were saying "relax on the thinking, there is no answer going to satisfy you"... This is more of a writing exercise for me.. but from your last comment and the first I could mix the two and come up with.. Bruh, I am all about thinking, diggin into questions and working the discovery process but it can wear me out at times too. I have found for myself that other people's answers don't often satisfy what I am looking for, consider that. If you are feeling worn out, feel free to take a break.

@iamme Thank you, your kind words are filled with warmth. I would be excited for you to stalk, read, contemplate, integrate what works, continue to question and propose possibilities. I share with the hopes adding to other people's journey. I have been consciously cracking away at this game for almost 25 years now. My life prior to these studies was still heavily touched by these feelings but i didn't have a conscious framework for understanding. That is this life, who knows if there was something before that was built upon. I do believe there is a general path that most people follow. How it manifests in the physical form can vary greatly but the underlying meaning the fabric that weaves us all into the story is the same. In the beginning of our awakening process it is only natural and proper to be rather obsessed with the idea of enlightenment. The best of intentions are driven into the concept of becoming enlightened. People will continue to seek enlightenment and as they do what enlightenment means will gradually shift. This is the way. There is no bypassing. Only engaging and continuing to active in the process. William Q. Judge wrote essays on the The Bhagavad-Gita and there was a quote that went something like, "The path is like an abyss, except the abyss is behind you." Once you have entered there is no going back. I have tried on multiple occasions, I have begged and pleaded to be allowed to return to "normal" life. My dream is that we have greater support networks for this development in the future. The videos that Leo provides are some of the best available at this time. There are plenty of videos that dig into deep concepts of the esoteric wisdom schools. Not that many are addressing duality and the shadow work that is mandatory and crucial to our next steps. Leo is doing exactly that. He is imperfectly perfect, a being who has walked the walk and is doing a grand service by sharing stories of the path in contemporary language and style. Expose yourself to many thinkers & feelers. Frustration is motivation, their are times when it seems debilitating and others when it is force that keeps you moving. I have been to edge and almost slipped, I have been to the edge and almost cast myself into dark. I wish I could say that it doesn't hurt and that you won't be pushed to edges of your limits but that has been exactly how my life has been. You have a forum of people here to connect with, if it gets heavy and dark reach out and communicate. If you dig through my posts you will find me commenting on "letting go". Find those and after ingesting feel free to compose a piece about your thoughts and questions you would like to discuss. Blessings! Journey Strong. We are family..

@purerogue Mind is a wonderland place, truly. I feel you touched on a key component in that learning process, the humbling moment when we realize how immense the whole thing is and that our ability to grasp the totality isn't present and more importantly that it is ok, it is how it is supposed to be, that there is no failure or injustice in the fact. In my heart and mind I believe total awakening is inevitable and the time it takes is irrelevant. The joy is in the process not in the accomplishment. There is nothing to rush through, if we rush we miss the magic held within every step of the story. When we sell being present to be fixated on something we imagine in the future we are still lost without insight. There is no shame in our development process, no shame in being lost, no shame in lusting after enlightenment, no shame in thinking we have the answers, no shame in every step that we all must pass. There is no bypassing only knowing.. The journey is the destination, destination is the journey.

@traveler Do you know the OP? My comment was related to the potential expression of his/her reality. I don't know if people projecting their desire for less mental activity on others is the most productive or supportive approach. The idea that "There's no answer that is going to satisfy you" doesn't seem to hold much water... If the OP was give the answer about "how it is" would they be satisfied at that point? If they knew the answer, which there is an answer, that they would then relax and be satisfied.. Sometimes I feel like people like to project onto the OP or another person in ways that isn't kind or supportive for a position of understanding. I assume they must be filling some need of their own. I am not guilt free. I have my own way to pushing, as I am here, asking you to consider something. Blessings..

@traveler Its not always thinking bruddah... It is also feeling, for some of us it is predominately feeling. We are feeling reality and trying to make sense of what we feel, we don't have the luxury of making it purely intellectual. Maybe that is how it is for you, only intellectual, thereby it is a choice... Bittersweet.. Must be nice and a little sad at the same time.. Everyone isn't the same.. Journey strong in your own fashion.. We are all in this together..

@astrokeen Don't let any story that seems to be wrapped in ease fool you... Like your profile picture, the grass is always greener on the other side. If someone glides into a state of advanced "knowingness" that is like a unicorn event.. Not common.. The majority of seekers pay the price in blood, sweat, tears, and continual commitment to the practice... Move at your own pace.. Know you are loved and respected for what your are and what you do. Journey Strong!

@OmniYoga Here is my attempt to throw some biased expressions towards your inquiry. are those term real or that's just dualist mind at work? Both.. real and part of the dual expression. They are also not real... Have you ever had an event that started out negative but later turned out to be positive? This happens often, we have something happen and we place judgment on it from our ego perspective and later it shifts and we then redefine its quality. Which was it? It was both the whole time and so is every other event in life. Some people will come up with some extremes and say how could this be anything but this... right.. dig in.. go deep. cause it is in there.. and they don't have any sense from non-dual perspective ? I would say that within the nondual nothing else exists other than the unknowable and unnameable.. but if attempting to embody that nondual perspective and viewing a dual concept like negative positive they do make sense, how they function is different, how they are seen as working is different from that vantage point. The teeth are taken out it a way, the bite isn't as vicious. we should care about it? I will say absolutely, others will argue a nondual point and maybe brush it off as it doesn't really exist... I am here, I am in this state and how the framework functions is crucial to my participation.. that scale of consciousnes from apathy - to enlightmen is it real or a joke - looks judgmental for me higher/lower good/bad better/worst state - dualistic isn't it? Both again.. real but not real.. matters but doesnt... In a nutshell this is one of the paradoxes to be grasped... It is always both at the same time.. functioning like it matters while knowing that is also not real.. this is the game... why it is funny when people try to make it one or the other. The idea that totally opposite realities can exist at the same time is hard for people to embody... by accepting this truth, by knowing it viscerally not intellectually, your whole reality changes, the world changes... it is like being unplugged from the matrix and that frightens people.. You literally give up your life in your ego.. your ego life can be incredibly spiritual, filled with all kinds of knowledge and spiritual prowess.. you can be a guru and still not let go.. can you be self-realized and cynical for example or toying with people? Absolutley, and happens more than any of us would like to see.. Why it is up to us to be cautious.. can the consciouness differ or it's just consciouness - one - same - no divided Both, same time.. always one and layered into expression that appears to be divided, which are experienced as divided.. can we actaully raise or expand consciousness? It feels like that and could be described like that but to me that is a misleading interpretation in general.. It is already there and we move closer to it which feels like "raising" or "expanding" what was previously to the thing it is now.. it is more like removing ignorance, layers, blocks... becoming unified.. don't know how well i did with that.. tricky.. that doesn't make sense if its the ulitmate thing, you can't add to it or fix it, can we Agreed.. thefore what the psychodelics do? They allow insight, they "remove some barriers" they "open our eyes" they allow us to experience aspects of life that we haven't developed prior to taking them. Not that people can't and don't develop those abilities its just not common. there is this bittersweet experience of being in places and the return journey begins and slowly piece by piece we lose the knowledge of where we are/where, trying desperately trying to hold onto the beauty, the insights, the knowledge, the knowingness.... but we return with what we could retain and then a crucial opportunity... implement, use, practice, reflect, on what happened..

@kellyon Sure was... those long shots that just kept going.. Birdman had some really long shots like that... Like a dance, so cool. one of the best war flicks since Saving Private Ryan.. I just watched Honey Boy and really enjoyed that as well. Parasite was awesome..

@Consept Totally how I was receiving your insight. Much appreciated. Thanks for sharing..

@Yog I, personally, don't resonate with the quote. If I try to imagine a lifestyle or mental position in which it makes sense it would be... A life that doesn't see human existence as having any direct connection to divinity internally. That any meaning or creative divine force, if that is even being considered, is beyond human ability is somewhere out there. It is a life that is defined by what you do in the world. Physical achievement through the egoic identity is paramount. You create in the world and let that creation define you. There isn't an ownership of an internal life, doesn't really exist in this life. It has its place in the developmental psychology models. So great living in an age where we have models that represent our thought / feeling processes. I don't think many people in the forum will resonate with the quote as representing them. What is amazing is how many people could probably place this thought process on the developmental evolutionary spiral. To be able to place it without disgust or shaming, simply it is what it is. Can you be upset with a 10 year old for not being an 80 year old sage, no you can't. We are where we are and by having models of growth we can begin to place people in stages and states. Anyways.. I don't resonate with it from a personal sense of expression but... big thanks for the opportunity to step to tap back into a part of myself that isn't as active anymore, still their, but not as dominate.

@Consept I like to think the issues with science are also the strengths, it is when we ask it to be something that it isn't that the problems arise. I like the practice of observation when it is quantifiable and repeatable, establishing a sense of truth through consistency with measurement. Science has already been able to show us how we, regardless of our desire or commitment, do not experience reality as it is. The table is solid, no actually it is predominately empty space. You will see me continue to beat a drum for the celebration of opposites, how they complete one another. I value a diverse and competing set of approaches where some seek to define the approach, a single perspective that answers every potential. Thanks for your insight, much appreciated!

If you want to see a video "Ego Gone Wild" click on the first video above.. Whoa... Lets say you had a dog, a black lab. Would you let the lab organize and run your life? Does that mean you can't make the lab one of your best friends? Is it an all or nothing scenario, I don't think so.. I question the merits of people who are advising to reject aspects of life simply for the sake of rejecting them without proper knowledge of what is being rejected. Are they rejecting the thing or are they rejecting their notion of what the thing might represent, thereby not rejecting the thing but their notion of it. I like watching people who engage in what would be certain death for other people. The people who "know" the situation, who are trained, dedicated, well practiced, educated can navigate through a position of knowing that those who don't cant. Someone who knows stands outside and is like a conductor while a person who doesn't is consumed by the situation and is blindly treading water reacting to the situation which is calling the shots.. Wild animals Explosives Race cars Stunt people Anesthesia LumberJack etc. etc. etc. Someone who understand the ego from a position outside the ego can "befriend' or work with this creation from a superposition.

@kag101 Thanks sooooooo much for sharing. Anyone who is suffering and questioning what to do, this is a light, a sign of hope. Things can get better. Congrats on your new found sense of life & ability to exist within it in greater comfort..

@VeganAwake Totally appreciate what you are sharing here, and it resonates undoubtedly. For fun.. Wouldn't "this" be dependent on "that" thus not examples of oneness? For there to be one, something measurable, wouldn't there need to be at least two to reference one? Are the shapes within the sand nonexistent or are the waves on the ocean non existent? Or are waves only the ocean and shapes only the sand? or is the ocean really just waves and sand really just shapes? Or is it possible that nothing is something and something is nothing? If the unified, unknowable, unnameable... never had desire for expression why would it express in the first place? Is it expression or separation that we are observing in the act of becoming? Is it possible that separation never occurred but expression did? Some thoughts that come to mind.. Just thoughts.. nothing serious..

Neutral implies a position between two or more points which would exclude the idea from non-dual. Non-dual is the unified field, a difficult concept to begin to take form within the mind but with practice and contemplation it will come about. It is challenging when mixing concepts of dual and non-dual and trying to establish a singular point of supremacy. I believe I see people say something like nothing, no-thing, matters and they are stemming the sentiment from a place that exists beyond the ego identity. They negate the ego and the life they live. The people who say nothing matters live daily lives where they make value judgments from moment to moment. I would say a more accurate, more inclusive, statement would be everything matters AND nothing matters at the same time.

@Keyhole I noticed that after my post... Good eye.. Good call.. Totally possible.. Time will tell..

Think a good argument could be made that nobody makes it own their own. We are influenced through relationships, of all kinds. When people begin the journey they tend to lean on others with some extra weight, it is natural, and should be advised against but at the same time it happens and we continue to remind. IMO people are fortunate to receive insight through this platform. The information here is in may other books and it isn't new or original but what is original is the voice and delivery that Leo brings, that is his and it works. The idea of not using psychedelics, for a mentally stable person in the right set and setting, is like someone breaking their leg and saying forget the hospital and those advanced methods of modern medicine, grab my those two sticks off the tree and some vines... we will just wrap it up.. and ya their is a chance you won't get infected, the bone will fuse in some fashion, you will have a limp but gosh darn it you did it on your own... if the goal is to figure something out on your own, again is that even possible to begin with? My thing is we, the collective human race, need as many people to get to a particular point of conscious understanding as soon as possible so we can form new culture, new society from that pool of ready and available beings. To me the goal isn't to see a degree of truth, it is to see that degree of truth so we can get back to being human with new insight and build a better tomorrow.. This new platform that will ensure continued human existence and a prominent focus awakening / actualization. Small numbers of people have piercing duality for thousands and thousands of years but what hasn't been happening is it being done in massive numbers of people. When this happens then the ability to redesign through new intelligence is here... to me this is the goal. The way we get there is through platforms like this, and the substances that assist. Blessings..

@Consept Have you read any Rupert Sheldrake - the idea of morphogenic fields? Donald Hoffman is putting mathematics to consciousness too, The Case Against Reality.. I believe they say we are familiar with like 4% of matter in the universe, leaving 96% as dark matter? Tough looking for something non-material with a material science. I a pro science, no question. At the same time is meditation science, do psychedelic experiences have credibility as research? I find it interesting look back at the attitude of science and how something ins't real until verified by science. How many "real" truths have turned out to be BS that were verified. How many things were ridiculed or shamed and then became real and legitimate. Maybe things that carry weight that aren't in the scientific club deserve some credibility and things that are in maybe should still carry some skepticism?

@Lento Whoa that would bring out a variety wouldn't it?

@Shiva Appreciate the openness you delivering. I thought maybe you and Mu knew each other and maybe i jumped on the "she" after I saw him say it... haha.. Dude.. man.. guy... lol.. I am a sucker for humor, I have a couple replies in here where I use the phrase "cosmic comedy" or "cosmic stand-up" something like that. I enjoy picturing the whole thing as a giant circus, seriously not serious while being incredibly serious at the same time.. Feel free to hit me with any cosmic jokes or if you have something you wanna intentionally workshop with a comedic bent for fun... I'm in.. Have you ever seen this video:

@lmfao Nice post... Appreciated..