isabel

god isn't a thinking being that does things or looks for things god is perfect stillness that never moves but we see movement the question "what is god looking for?" is movement the movement that we experience is god as seen by the mind

I've not experienced it just read about it, so maybe someone else can correct and refine this but that's what happens, there is the seer, the seen, and seeing but that's an illusion there is no seer and no seen object - you can tell because each one cannot exist without the other so whenever you have two things that cannot be separated, you have one thing but it isn't a thing, it's only awareness/seeing there is nothing to you or any object that is more than your awareness of it when the distinction between the seer and the seen collapses (becomes one) there is nothing left but seeing (awareness being aware of itself) or just appearance - you are gone like you're saying as far as anyone can describe... byron katie said she tried to describe it as zero but even saying zero was too much there is no point of view because you're not located you need to view the world through the mind in order to be somewhere infinity is space/location as seen through the mind and eternity is time as seen through the mind, so you can't have a location or time without the mind pretty cool, how did you bring that about?

your saying that the distinction between the seer and the seen can collapse and leave nothing but seeing? someone in another thread told me it's less like seeing, more like just appearance, like that?

what is happening in the moment that causes the mind to tell a story? what is the mind reacting to? thank you

I don't actually know, I just read this in a book but the person is the world, each one cannot exist without the other and there is more than one world, each person is a world so if experience is seeing, you need both the seer and the seen to have seeing so the color red continues to exist with no seer? then what is it if it cannot be seen?

thank you for saying that, it makes sense I think, so at some point, stop wondering, stop asking questions and just be still? I've heard people say things like that before, I guess this is what they mean...

just appearance - ok, I sort of understand that but not deeply, what do you recommend I do to really understand that? thank you so much

idk what you mean by that but it makes sense, if the person disappears then the world also disappears, if the person reappears then the world reappears, you can't have one without the other

so everything is appearing, there is seeing - and then the mind says "I see" and creates the belief of a separate self in itself? hmm or when you say there is no mind, does it mean there is not something separate from everything else called a mind? but there is the appearance of a mind? thank you

yes, the story of the past is "false" meaning the idea that we are the people in the story is an illusion - real just not what we think but something is happening...I wonder what that is...?

thank you, I will try

thank you that's what I'm getting...but how can that work? for example I see myself just now a split second ago taking a sip of coffee, so that's the story, in the past but what did the mind interact with to get that story?

@Bluff I can't find anything between two thoughts, that's why I'm wondering what is going on? I do see a story being written in the emptiness of awareness - it's the past, even if it happened a split second ago, it's the past so what is happening before it becomes the past?

we are all awakened already...

the "abuser" is in their own world of pain, doing their thing to what they believe is another person but really they're only abusing themselves and the "victim" is only abused if they believe that the abuser is actually talking about them but the abuser is literally only talking about an image that they have in their own mind/world so they are literally not talking about the victim, they never see the other person, they only talk about the image that they see which is made from their own mind/knowing so you look at the abuser and see them hurting theirself, not hurting you and the victim, IF they are a victim, is actually also the abuser because we can only abuse ourselves by believing that we are the image of the abused person that appears in the mind as a memory and it's no one's fault is this real?

physical pain can happen but I'm finding that it's not necessary to label that as abuse and then suffer with that mental pain of being abused for years and years and the reason is because at this point the bully IS completely imaginary

but me first, lol

it could be lol but I'm not sure because I wouldn't use that against myself to stay in an abusive relationship or to convince myself that another person's behavior isn't abusive it means (partly) that all anyone knows of me is an idea, so what are they abusing? an idea?

ok

do thoughts just rise up on their own? then how is it possible to direct thoughts because choosing which thoughts to follow is just another thought, realizations are just more thoughts...even the idea of being enlightened is just a thought, isn't it? I see thoughts just happening without me trying, the mind runs on it's own, but I can also choose to think or not think about certain things, but then where does that choice come from - am I not really making that choice? does awareness choose or am I really just watching thought patterns happen? thank you

this is intensely amazing that this information is appearing right now in this forum, just want to thank everything and everyone here I feel like I'm getting everything up to these ideas "choice without chooser" or "I am not doing it, but it's not happening to me either" so that's what's next I think, I see everything happening, still seems like I'm some sort of a "me that's choosing" but I will follow all of this advice, thank you <3 I'm very interested to see what I find next

thank you leo, what does beyond the mind mean? can I experience beyond the mind and then after that experience have thoughts about what just happened?

@Tim R thank you! so strange because I understand very little if anything about that yet I feel like I do understand, I will read it a few times and keep going, thank you oh but wait, if I have a realization beyond my mind, how will I know that it happened if there are no thoughts about it?

@peanutspathtotruth yes, very funny, because as far as I can see right now, what are realizations? I see thoughts running on their own - that's a realization but a realization is just another type of thought, ok lol I'm just confusing myself at this point...

@Tim R so this is a process that happens by itself, I (awareness) just watch and that's it, so that's why they say things like to "just allow things to be as they are" because there is no way to do anything else? but I could have the thought, "I should get a better job" and then the thought "yes I will or no I won't" so that "choice" happens just based on patterns and programs running in my mind and in the world?