Apparition of Jack

Just because they’re not openly advocating for the extermination of Latinos or whatever (although go on Twitter and you’ll see countless accounts expressing that exact sentiment), doesn’t mean their worldview isn’t fundamentally baked in anti-human white supremacy. A Nazi who “only” wants to deport every black and brown person from America regardless of the human cost is still a Nazi, they don’t need the death camps and swastika logos to prove this. A radical Islamist who calls for the death of the West and the final victory of Islam is still a radical Islamist, even if they don’t openly try to suicide bomb people (but then again they probably have obvious connections to groups who do.) It’s a sinister game of deflect and deny and I’m honestly tired of pretending that illegal mass ethnic deportations are “ok” just because the people doing so aren’t also waging war on Poland or whatever.

Maybe the US is broke. I don’t know. But a lot of that is just due to mismanagement of resources rather than an actual lack of financial / material capacity. If America can find the money to spend over a $1 Trillion of its Army, couldn’t it use that even just a fraction of that money investing in infrastructure, healthcare, etc? It would be one thing if America had an equitable tax system and it was broke, it’s another thing entirely when most of the wealth is being funnelled to the top and yet it still refuses to fix its most glaring issues. We can’t keep exempting taxes our way to prosperity, especially for the massive, unaccountable corporations that, like you say, are only focused on quarterly profits and not long-term nation building. EDIT: America should’ve spend the last 40 years heavily investing in education, healthcare, infrastructure, etc if it wanted to avoid social collapse. Instead we got the complete opposite, with less and less civic funding and more and more control to corporations who couldn’t give less of a fuck about the health, fertility or stability of the people in their society. It’s a spiritual sickness at its core; a delirious belief that profit alone will save us from death and that collective cooperation and nation building are… evil? Idk. It’s straight up Anti-Christ shit.

I don’t know, whatever I can? Resist? Organise? Get involved in anti-fascist and pro-democracy groups? Look out for my non-white friends? I’m just one guy, I can’t solve this alone. But I do know for there to be any justice on this earth Trump’s Nazi bullshit and his den of pigs need to be brought down for good. I don’t know the answer but I’m not going to stand by on the sidelines in the meantime.

Stephen Miller is a white nationalist using federal forces to illegally expel integrated Hispanic people from the country. There’s no other explanation for this other than he’s a Nazi who wants to promote white people at the expense of all other races.

If it walks like a Nazi, and quacks like a Nazi, it’s probably a Nazi.

You’re a Nazi apologist. It’s so obvious that you are but you’d rather die than ever admit this to yourself. Trump and his cabinet are unequivocally Nazis. Stop trying to go to bat for them. It’s pathetic.

https://www.splcenter.org/resources/hatewatch/stephen-millers-affinity-white-nationalism-revealed-leaked-emails/

Exactly this. Stephen Miller, Steve Bannon, Elon Musk, etc are legitimately all outright Nazis. As in, they have well-documented ties to neo-Nazi groups or have openly made statements favouring white supremacy. Neo-Nazis attacked the White House. Trump told the Proud Boys to “stand by.” MAGA is literally a Nazi movement. This isn’t controversial to say. The Shadow of Hitler still haunts the minds of selfish white Americans everywhere.

You mean like Jan 6th?

The same state that won’t even pay his son’s bills when that son comes down with epilepsy? How does that help his survival?

Unlike the wolf chasing the rabbit that ICE agent’s survival doesn’t depend upon locking up that school teacher. He could instead just go home and watch the football. I feel like this is basic logical induction, Leo.

Doesn’t seem like to me. That Mexican gym teacher being locked up isn’t meeting their survival needs.

Survival for who?

SMH. You’re a lost cause dude. I mean that sincerely. You’ve broken a sacred trust between the powerful and the powerless for the sake of your own egoic gain. For shame. For shame. For shame.

I mean, money is a lie anyway. The entire world is basically built off one entire phantasm. Call that looney Marxist talking points if you want but it’s also kinda true. Also, I’ve tried to see it from the other side, but am I really wrong for saying these deportations are literally unconstitutional? Regardless of emotional feelings, isn’t that just an objective fact? Or the fact that the vast majority of the protests have been peaceful? Or that Donald Trump led an insurrection? Again, ignoring personal bias, are any of those things false? I’m really not sure what it is you’re trying to teach me. If you’re saying I need to take a grounded, more realistic approach to politics, I’ve tried that, I’ve genuinely tried to see the case for harsh enforcement, deploying troops etc, but it’s genuinely been hard to come to any other conclusion than this is just massive right-wing overreach, even when taking everything into consideration, and especially when considering the hypocrisy of who’s committing them. And isn’t there also the case of defending individual rights, no matter what? Even if 99.99999% of the people detained are the worst criminals on earth (which isn’t true but let’s say it is), if even just one person was a law-abiding citizen or, hell, even a long term resident who just doesn’t have documentation, isn’t that an injustice to that person personally and their family? It’s easy to take a big picture perspective of all these, but does that really justify ignoring the personal, human cost of all these? Do individual humans count for nothing, or are we all just mere pawns in a game played by much bigger forces none of us can comprehend?

I suggest you drop the hard shtick and consider an opposite soft compassionate perspective, for your own illumination.

America has way, WAY more than enough resources to provide all of that to whoever comes to its borders. America is so absurdly productive it would feasibly house a billion people and not even break a sweat. The problem isn’t lack of resources, it’s where they’re distributed. When America collective decides its work is best used to provide countless private yachts, islands, jets, mansions etc for a handful of out-of-touch billionaires than provide for the needs of the people (both citizen and migrant), that’s when you get scarcity. Your average working American has more in common with that Guatemalan food packager than they do with the vultures circling the White House.

I mean, if we’re being as ontologically honest as possible Hispanic people have a greater claim to the land than white people do. Where else do you think the name “Los Angeles” comes from? But that’s beside the point. Migrants are a net economic positive for America. Like I said before, countless businesses literally rely on their cheap labour to be profitable. Why is no one going after those businesses? From all economic points of view the idea that undocumented migrants are a drain is observably false. The only “true” argument I can see against letting them in is just cultural and racial arguments, but I think white America has forfeited any claims to have a decent culture worthy of protection when they vote for a murderous rapist pedophile criminal conman traitor to the White House who, again, will not even give his own citizens healthcare.

This is an is/ought problem to me. It IS true that most Americans want to see brown people beaten with a stick and sent back to Mexico, but is that OUGHT how it should be? Do you really think there’s no room for ethics or human values in this equation?

Sure, but consciousness can be developed to, and I like to believe all of human history and experience is a way to increase that consciousness, even for the most racist of rednecks or violent of cartel members. Slavery used to be a fact of life for human consciousness, but now it sees it as abhorrent. Large-scale warfare used to be as basic as getting married or sowing your field but now overwhelming people reject it (a few notable examples not withstanding.) Humans evolve. Humans grow. Sometimes there is a better way to act, and a worse way. Can’t we be a part of helping human consciousness grow in a compassionate direction?

Yes and that’s wrong.

And who gets most of that value? Your average postman? Librarian? Nurse? Doctor? Or does it all go to an increasingly small number of elites who have more money than God and the desire to control and dominate the world as they see fit? Productivity has been exploding in America for decades and yet even the most basic human fundamentals like housing and healthcare are increasingly out of reach for the vast majority of the population. What’s the point of being productive if you never get to see the fruits of that productivity? And no, iPhones and Netflix shows aren’t a replacement for heathy, prosperous communities where no one goes sick or hungry. Plus, those things are often a function of natural professions in technology, you don’t need absurd extractive economics to develop them.

I think this is where you and I disagree. Call me a naive optimist but I do think there is some fundamental force for good operating somewhere out there in the universe. I don’t think that means the world will all be sunshine and rainbows but I do think that means there are certain ideas, policies, movements and energies that can fundamentally lead to a better, more just world if not opposed by the forces desiring a more sick, hateful and selfish world. People can be fallible but surely there’s some true source of goodness out there in the universe no?

Immigration happens because of economic imbalance. You can’t have a city of rich country club snobs drinking margaritas and spending all their time trying to bang their Mexican secretary a few dozen miles from a city of impoverished farmers and workers constantly trying to pay for food while dodging cartel bullets and not have at least some of those poor workers make it to the rich city, regardless of the risks. Not to mention much of the wealth from that rich city comes from directly exploiting that poorer city. People will go where the money is. If America wanted people to stop coming to its borders, it would use some of its insane reserves of wealth to build up communities in other nations. You know, things like USAID, which has just been defunded by the Trump administration

Do you really think the way America currently exists is a fundamental force for good in the world, Leo? Do you not see the supreme inequality, racism, division etc it promotes on a global scale? Without wanting to be too critical, you are a rich white guy who benefits from this set up. I don’t think you are personally racist or uncaring but the evil the US state is inflicting across the globe affects hundreds of millions of people, including countless of its own citizens, not just a few “illegal criminals” as the current conservative zeitgeist would have you believe. Millions upon millions of lives have been killed under its insanity (Iraqis, Palestinians, South Americans, Indonesians etc), not to mention the countless more lives ruined through debt, oppression, racism, etc, again, even within its own borders. Are you really OK with the way things are? How can you not see the overwhelming injustices being committed in its name?