Dylan Page

@Inliytened1 Why did god choose suffering as the medium to understand truth? Why does suffering exist at all? Again, even if its a duality, its real.

@Inliytened1 @Leo Gura Who cares who is determining the life is terrible. It's a perspective that is possible within reality. I don't see the love in an existence that is fundamentally bad. You could say that dualities are an illusion, but the illusion does in fact exist. You can't just explain suffering away as an illusion or a duality. It is real, even if it is a trick or a construct, or it stems from some sort of point of view. I see absolutely no reason for the existence of suffering. It is fundamentally bad and it is the ultimate non-self justifying thing.

@Leo Gura what if the ego never realizes its true nature and it has a terrible life. Isn’t that the ultimate tragedy? Where’s the love in that? Assume it’s delusional and all.

I think the question is why would consciousness (or whatever you wanna call it) create an illusion of hell, or a situation in which the existence for any particular ego is akin to hell. You could say that it doesn’t actually exist and that everything is love, but in the eyes of the limited ego, that simply isn’t true (even if fundamentally it is). There is no justifiable reason to have an existence that is bad, and I mean bad from a certain perspective, and almost all egos if not all egos are limited to a specific perspective, enlightenment not being inevitable. @Leo Gura

Uh, question. In that Martin Ball video he said that you can’t think your way into enlightenment because well.. who’s doing the thinking? The ego. He said we have to do nothing. But.. in that case. Who’s trying to do nothing? Also the ego, no? From what I’m understanding, the ego is literally any desire we have or any action we take. People talk about the ego as if it isn’t them, or their thoughts as if they’re not theirs. If anyone is to ever have a desire, it has to be through an ego. If reality is nothing, it wouldn’t ever want anything. Our desire to become enlightened is an egoic desire, as it must be.

Given that reality is infinity, and it’s everything, why does everything have to actualize, or become real? Why can’t it just be a concept or something? I remember Leo saying that reality wants to know itself, and so every possibility exists, but why does that need to be the case?

@Shin Fair enough. I have a lot of respect for him too, but I always remind myself to never take anything as true just based on the fact that he is saying it as well. Another question though, what are the main things you disagree with Leo on?

@Shin what are your opinions of this forum and actualized .org? You seem to not be a fan based on where I’ve seen you. Why?

I am very interested in pursuing enlightenment but I’m really having trouble fully locking down science and math as incapable of discovering truth. So many people that surround me believe this and I just want to be able to confidently say that it isn’t the answer. If anyone can deliver the TKO, please do so here.

Most of them don’t think about it. @Preetom

LMFAO DUDE

@Joseph Maynor The point is to make a better world for our egos. Bypassing the more transcendent truths and functioning as the egos that we are now. Leo just might have strong opinions on how we are to go about doing that, not sure, I think that’s what he means by style.

Psychedelics are used for enlightenment/non dual experiences generally. My question is, why certain compounds rather than other ones? Why is it that smoking dmt sends you into the 17365th dimension and weed just kind of makes you feel funny. There is obviously a difference in brain chemistry but is there anything more than that? If you gave 5-meo dmt to a lobster or something would they experience the same thing? Anyone have any thoughts on this?

@Inliytened1 well.. you know what I mean lol. I’m talking about what he is trying to teach/communicate.

@Leo Gura Yeah, I should really keep a journal for myself and write down every time I think someone is saying something stupid. I absolutely don’t want to kid myself when it comes to truth. I want to research all of the greatest thinkers that have opinions on this kind of stuff and rigorously find flaws in their arguments. I want to cut out bullshit but I don’t want to be too quick to write people off either. It’s just amazing that people can believe certain things that are so logically inconsistent and stick with them. I’m constantly looking for truth because I’ve never remained satisfied with anyone’s answer, ever. Not to say I’m not satisfied with yours, because I haven’t wrapped my head around yours yet.

@Leo Gura Yeah it looks like I have a long ass way to go. All I really care about is truth and love. My only problem is that when I come across people that say something that I don’t know how to disprove, I freak the fuck out because of the possibility that they might be right, and the following implications. People like Dan Dennett or Lawrence Krauss literally made me lose like 10 pounds because my anxiety was preventing me from eating. I don’t understand how they can be comfortable with believing the things that they believe.

@Jkris One of the things I used to comfort myself with about death is that lack of awareness is not an active process as there is no one to experience nothingness. If you were to ever wake up again, it would happen instantly, because you have no perception of time in a consciousless state.

@Leo Gura what does truth is prior to evidence mean? Also, what do you think of anesthesia? Or sleep? How would you explain lack of awareness?

@Enlightenment What is your view of science and logic? Theories and models can never encompass reality without contradiction.

@Enlightenment I'd like to hear @Leo Gura 's response to this. It does seem he is claiming solipsism, but I also don't see why solipsism is bad. There are a lot of axioms to believing that it is bad.

@Enlightenment also, his claim isn't even an attitude, it's just a claim, the whole like, hardcore serious ultra rigorous scientist approach you are taking is really close minded, you should watch more of his videos on science.

@Enlightenment What's your opinion on it? Also, the problem with trying to understand Leo's claim by asking for evidence is that that isn't the nature of the answer to the question, no amount of science or math is going to show this.

Anyone buying Sean Carroll's new book on QM? I'm excited to see what he says. It's called Something Deeply Hidden released in early September.

@Leo Gura Right, there is no reason that the brain CAUSES our experience, we can just say that there are correlations that are useful for medicine, understanding behavior, and everything else, etc. It would be the perfect illusion for creating a self, and especially a body.

@outlandish Yeah it's interesting. It would be nice to know why we experience what we do on DMT, and if that experience could be replicated in animals with a different compound. There is the biological view of why we experience what we do, but changes in the brain don't seem to have any like, detectable CAUSE for why we have some experiences, just really strong correlations, which could just be another part of the illusion of self and body.