Danioover9000

@RebornConsciousness I agree, in this issue I'd be conservative minded no matter how the online progressives/socialists call me a Nazi for being concerned.

@Enlightement Maybe historically, but recently it has spiked and gotten worse and out of hand, thanks to the internet.

@ZoweeZoe From my perspective, transrace and transgenderism is an ideology, just like all human concepts and human ways of life, from political, to religious, to group ideology and conformity around cultural beliefs and societal values, they all are ideologies fundamentally. Therefore, I treat them as such, that they are foundationally ideologies to start. Like all ideologies, based on SD stages of development, cognitive and moral development, personality type and traits, states of being, ego development, life experiences and other lines of development in life and societal domains, all ideologies are also developmental, meaning that they start off as thought forms, then servitors, then Tulpae, then egregors, and finally becoming god forms, that millions to billions of souls here on earth worship as dogma and ideology. When an idea finally becomes an egregor is where the problem starts, because an egregor is a psychic being fed with attention, time, energy and emotions of that group, overtime each member's ego creates attachments to that idea, which gives it more realness. When it becomes real, then followers and the preachers proselytize and proliferate this egregor, and similar to memetics the idea memes and infects outsiders into being convinced, persuaded into converting as a follower. Finally, at some point this egregor will have amassed enough psychic influence that it uses it's followers and the preachers as proxies for it's SURVIVAL against other egregors and god forms that walk the astral realms, infecting each human with it's ideas. Talk about these ideologies here in the forum, as unbiased as I can be despite my assumptions, and try to talk from a systemic view as a start. When I said that it's irreversible, I'm talking about when you remove the balls and penis of the child aged 1-7 and 7-14 years old, up to teenagers aged 14-18 or 19 depending on age of consent. Unless you know of how to reverse that surgery, of putting back the testicles and penis of the prepubescent child to post pubescent teenage male body? Same scenario with female bodied prepubescent children to post pubescent adolescents. The reason why I say age of consent is that on average that's when most adolescents can conceptualize and logically make sense of their desires close to age of consent. To me, my perspective of your view, I'm sorry, but it's insane to think you have a position that ALL CHILDREN KNOW WHAT THEY WANT. They haven't developed enough in terms of value systems, cognition, morality, personality, psychology, ego, life experiences and other lines of development, even conceptual understanding of the consequences and implications of their desires. They're mostly blank slates that ideologically driven parents, households, and social environments that have right-wing ideologies, to left wing ideologies can indoctrinate into them That's where I have issues with Transgenderism and transrace, when these egregors start affecting millions of minds, trying to compete with other ideologies and ideas in the ethers, trying to become gods themselves, trying to infect and convert others and assimilate them into the egregor's influence. When it becomes a meme on the internet, on public discourse, and isn't treated with care and consideration, without critical thinking, without consciousness, that's when it's problematic.

@abundance It's because of SD stages of development, cognitive and moral development, personality types and traits, states of being, ego development, life experiences and other lines of development in personal life to societal domains, and ideological indoctrination from upbringing. Musk's upbringing is from an upper class family in South Africa, and due to his white privilege, high status, and some fame even then, this has effected his development into staunch stage orange/blue, some red. Cognitively bias and development is that of a rich person, in terms of money and material value and more left brain thinking, whilst morally he's at least egocentric and only concerned with family maximumly otherwise why align with alt-right wing ideology? Personality traits from my observation is openness-introversion/extroversion-conscientious-disagreeableness-high in neuroticism and narcissism due to inflated self image and self importance other others due also to his billionaire lifestyle., personality type to me is sentinel or logician. State of consciousness is simple- a business man, views the world in transactions and money value, has to feel self aggrandizing. Ego development to me he's mostly opportunist, may be conformist but if it's convenient to appear so to other CEOs and powerful people. This is why we need to develop systems and checks in place to deal with those higher in the hierarchies of society, because the higher you climb or start, the increase in narcissism, neuroticism, and personality traits from the dark Triade(psychopathy, sociopathy, narcissism, Machiavellianism, sadism, masochism, deep jealousy ect.), because, while these traits exist for good reason within the structure, sometimes in the wrong context and misalignment can be detrimental to those involved or those underneath the rungs.

@ZoweeZoe Trans children? Don't you mean children suffering from gender dysphoria? Do you not see transgenderism as an ideology? Do you not see that the medical industry benefits and profit from confused dysphoria children? They start taking puberty blockers, or undergoing physical transitions, removal of the penis and balls, adding boobs, HTR treatment that alters the natural hormonal and endocrine system in the biological male body, and biological female body, such that it can sometimes have knock on effects that may be negative and sometimes irreversible? That's a cash cow for the pharmaceutical company because some percentage of the population suffering like this, is likely to need to seek a therapist, maybe a psychiatrist, and buy pills to relieve whatever depression or mental stress caused from prior treatments have. I don't care as long as your body your decision is from age of consent, and that you're adult and are responsible, here I'll accept it's your choice and hope it's right for you. Below age of consent, especially the age range of children 7-14 years old is when it's tricky and we need to be more careful. I'll never accept and willingly suffer disagreements if you think ages 2 to 7 years child can go through the full treatment, too early, and they need more life experience and actually go through developmental stages, and develop in SD stages of development, cognitive and moral development, personality typing and traits, ego development, states of consciousness, life experiences and other lines of development.

@JJfromSwitzerland I don't think so, he had a stage accident where his hair caught fire, and suffered third degree burn of his scalp. Had to take medications to alleviate the pain, and around this time he was having some kind of dysphoria, and decided to spend a lot of money to undergo surgery to change his skin color. Definitely other factors involved in him changing his race, mainly psychological.

@Juan Oh, okay then, so you've actually agreed with my position from the start?

@Hardkill I think it's complicated, and we don't know enough to determine whether Noam Chomsky is hiding something in the closet or not.

@Juan How is ALL and AVERAGE different here? Aren't you using AVERAGE as a generalization for most conservatives? That's the thing with you citing from Jubilee and The Cut about Muslim conservatives vs Muslim Liberals, Liberal teens vs conservative parents, and feminists vs anti feminists, I don't see how these three subjects, in there own contexts, have anything to do with Steven Crowder, can you elaborate what being a Muslim conservative/liberal, being a teenage liberal vs old conservative, and feminist/anti feminist have to do with being Steven Crowder? Again, correlation/=/causation, and extrapolating from other contexts into one context/=/causation. If you consider Steven Crowder to be the average conservative, why then don't we have the average conservatives as wife beaters, white Supremacists and more right wing alt extremists then? Steven Crowder seems to me, my observation, is more stage red/blue and less orange, cognitively biased and lower in moral development, personality typing is extroverted-close minded-conscientious-disagreeableness-higher in neuroticism and sociopathy, a dysfunctional relationship with his wife, other life experiences and lines of development that to me isn't a great representative for average conservatives. If Steven Crowder is conservative representative to you, then that means to me you have a distorted bias that makes you think he's representative of conservatives, or because @Leo Gura said so so Steven Crowder is conservative representative? I agree that you do the best you can to study in your own area, but that begs the question, especially if you live in an area with more extremists which exhibit unhealthy conservative views, or even liberal views, then the sample and selective bias and survey here would be wrong/distorted no? That's my question to you. I'll ask the questions again: We should take claims from a conservative with consideration, but not liberals? So, when progressives/socialists and liberals make claims that if children state they're transgender that we should automatically transition them, without further determination that they're suffering from gender dysphoria or are peer pressured by the trans community? Same with transrace?

@Juan Yes, I know you're talking about the averages, but I'm asking why did you cite YouTube videos from the Jubilee and The Cut? What makes them credible enough to back your general claims that Steven Crowder is representative of all average conservatives? I'm asking about how you socialize, and know that the people you've interacted with are also representative of average conservatives? So, because there's correlation and patterns of behavior and opinions equals causation? Which means that people you're interacted in your area, that talk like Steven Crowder, are therefore White supremacists and Nazi? You're wrong, you're responding to @Roy and me. We should take claims from a conservative with consideration, but not liberals? So, when progressives/socialists and liberals make claims that if children state they're transgender that we should automatically transition them, without further determination that they're suffering from gender dysphoria or are peer pressured by the trans community? Same with transrace?

@Juan How is Jubilee and The Cut credible YouTube videos enough that you'd use them to support your claim that Steven Crowder is representative of all conservatives? Out there socializing? What if the area you're in has more far right nationalists than conservatives? Does that mean when I interact with a small sample of that population, that then I can claim that Steven Crowder represents all conservatives? Have you interacted with Steven crowder then? So, because there 'tends to have' which means there's a pattern, is sufficient justification that one person represents an entire group? Which means, by implication, that any claims against transgenderism and transrace isn't valid?

@Juan How is Crowder the representative of the average conservative, and not representative of the average white supremacist? How are conservatives more angrier than liberals? How are conservatives only close minded? How are conservatives the only ones with limiting beliefs, but not liberals? How are conservatives more neurotic, and not the online left?

@ZoweeZoe I think @Roy and I may agree on the starting premise that it's existentially pointless when or when not transgender people transition, or that transgenderism and transracialism is fundamentally pointless. However, I think both of us would disagree over the specifics, contextualization and relativity of the factors needed to make sense of whether transgendered people should or shouldn't transition, and whether transrace or transgenderism are pointless when some are emotionally attached to these ideologies. For example, how do you know when a child really has gender dysphoria, by birth, or just because saying their gender dysphoric/trans is another way of getting attention from their in-group or it's a result of peer pressure? When is it the right time to transition physically, undergo surgery, remove male parts or add female parts? I assume @Roy's answer will be the same as mine: that the child should go through therapy for a couple of years to determine if that gender dysphoria is genuine, then after that they can go to HTR, and if that's successful, after reaching age of consent, as an adult you can apply for physical transition. That's my position and @Roy's. The same line of reasoning with race, how do we know the child really wants to be white, but is born with melatonin that makes him appear African American or some other ethnicity/nationality? I think here both @Roy and I may disagree more with the concern is pointless argument, because this is such an easy way to write off actually concerns to half concerns of events and people effected by certain ideologies, and concern of whether behaviors and actions that were taken were wrong in context. If we encounter someone who has transitioned, but in retrospect is now regretting their decision, should we not take that into account for future cases going forward? Should we take more precautionary steps, instead of rushing a confused teenager/child, suffering from gender dysphoria/other dysphoria, into transitioning more out of ideology and less out of that person's genuine well-being?

@Roy I think it's one of those trolling tests, he's testing our common sense again.

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Interesting podcast we'll be listening to and sharing our thoughts:

Can we talk about Michael Jackson here? I feel he's nearly the perfect example of transrace, and maybe transgenderism, but nobody is pushing back on if this is a goad example or not. So, is he, or is there a better one?

@RebornConsciousness Never give up questioning. He gave up on me when he can't answer anymore, see?

@Leo Gura I'm centrist conservative, yet I don't think, feel and behave like Steven Crowder, so is he really a good example of the average conservative? Especially when we factor into Stage of development, cognitive and moral development, personality types and traits, states of being, life experiences and other lines of development, and different ideological indoctrinations? I feel that demographically he might be representative of conservative, but psychographics might be more diverse here, especially if we factor in other countries and environments as well.

@Blackhawk Why would you answer my question 'why wouldn't you judge?' with an 'I don't know?'? Are you assuming that saying 'I don't know' is enough reason to support your claim of not judging nor caring about the net negative of people's actions, along with transrace and transgender issues?

@Blackhawk If this is true, then you've judged, and generalized that all people compete in sports because they expect a fair game. A man that's a transgender competing against a woman is not a fair game, although it's important to specify the type of sport. I said combat sports which for example is boxing, wrestling, MMA, so under these types it's highly unfair. Which means all this implies that you're assuming, and drawing distinctions and judging one group of people versus another, so you're contradicted what you've stated as you don't care about others and that you don't judge, seems like you do. Is my assumption of your conclusions you've drawn accurate? What do you mean sports can never be unfair because people are born differently? Do you mean that sports unfairness is universal? If it's unfair universally, and if there's fairness then it's a tie, then would this be you judging and caring and creating distinctions?

@Blackhawk Why wouldn't you judge?

@Blackhawk What do you mean not the same thing when others are involved? Letting people do stuff implies people are involved. Letting trans people into women's combat sports, with their higher testosterone levels, implies multiple trans people competing with multiple women. So, if it's only with them, with the outsiders, and you don't witness or know, then it doesn't matter? So, until you're involved with fighting a trans person, until you're getting beaten, then it's not that important?

@Blackhawk You don't care when a Trans person is beating a woman in a sport, and having an unfair advantage due to higher testosterone?

@Blackhawk Do you those fears are ungrounded, when Transwomen compete in women's combat sports?