Bill W

He probably has but just didn't spend the whole 72 hrs with them lol

I find a nice warm bath with a dripping tap on in a darkened room with a candle more effective than a cold shower.

How has it become fashionable now to distance oneself from masturbation? Have I missed something? All this FAP stuff on here and YouTube. Has masturbation become the new big cream cake that we all need to "discipline" ourself to not eat so that we are rewarded in some way with extra spiritual growth?

I guess one pitfall is deciding what you want to believe and then going around collecting "knowledge" that supports your chosen belief. "Knowledge" that contradicts your chosen belief is then dismissed, often dismissed in such a discreet way that you yourself don't even know you are dismissing it. I used to go around collecting knowledge. I still do. But I am trying (and often failing) to obtain or develop is a better word, the actual wisdom that makes the knowledge useful.

Thanks. I will read it properly tomorrow. Initially I was overwhelmed by its length but I've browsed it and it seems great. Will also look at the links and reply in more detail tomorrow if I can. Thank you.

My own journey with drugs and alcohol and then letting them go is that I was trying to fill an emptiness in my life through taking a short cut and not doing the work to achieve a better life without needing drugs and alcohol. Being drug and booze free is actually much easier than being an addict for me which is the opposite to what I always thought. I am only speaking for myself. If others want to use drugs as they believe it helps them then let them get on with it. Seems that many swear by it. You do anything regular enough it all just gets normalised.

This is a great topic. I'm trying to work out where I stand on prayer. I've been dipping in and out of it. I'm still working on this issue. In terms of some of the replies I think it's a touch sad that people who have different beliefs or practice their spirituality differently are labelled as delusional, almost as a diagnosis from someone who is possibly not qualified to give that diagnosis. I know we don't have to take delusional as an insult but still... If having a belief that is not backed up scientifically is delusional then so be it.

I like this topic. I am glad I persisted on this forum. Have been a lurker for ages. Kept telling myself to come off it because all I kept reading was endless debates about whose Truth was the real Truth. I speak the Truth. No I speak the Truth. I am God. You are God. No your not. Is it nothing or is it something? Who am I? I am not! Bit like pantomime. I like it better on here now as there are some real nuggets and game changers for me in some of the posts and topics. In AA we say it's a programme of ACTION. Totally agree on the ego. I am sure the ego will not be tamed simply through reading and typing.

We have a saying in AA of "carry the message". Why don't you just do the best you can do. You can't do the best others can do. If you develop it might help someone else develop. I don't know if ruminating on all that's crap will get us anywhere. Help yourself. Help others. That's what I'm trying to do. Not everyone can be helped. Some of the people or groups you describe would probably think we are the bat shit crazy ones on this forum. Who gets to own the Truth and say my way is best? I feel your pain somewhat. There are billions of idiots on Earth. I would imagine there are other planets watching us and using us an example of how to fuck things up. Hopefully we will evolve into something better.

When you say you have zero shred of judgement is that to say you never judge anyone ever? I'm not calling you dishonest. Perhaps you genuinely believe that. However I find it difficult to believe that someone can switch judgement off just like that. For me that's like someone proclaiming "hey I don't think anymore as I realised it's not logical". I think unless you are physically asleep or in a coma we will judge. We might even still judge then! My own journey and development revolves around intercepting this judgement before it causes me or anyone else grief. Some of my judgements will not be intercepted like that and I will let them play out naturally. I'm trying to learn what judgements need disputing and letting go and what judgements might be valid and useful. I bet the most advanced people on the planet are still capable of meeting someone and their first thought of that person is "what a c**t". It's what we do with the judgement that I think is key.

I just wanted to come back to this topic as I've been contemplating this quite a bit and trying to practice humility and more importantly BE more humble. I used to think I was the most humble person on the planet, as how can a shy, sensitive, introvert not be humble? Obviously I got this wrong. I am beginning to suspect if I can work toward more humility I will find it easier to practice forgiveness and compassion which are big themes in my life right now. Some definitions and meanings · The opposite of an over-inflated sense of self-importance · The opposite of entitlement · Humility is a quiet declaration of strength · Gratitude · Not self-righteous Some cognitive aspects · You have nothing to prove · You are aware of your limitations · You are aware of your failures · It’s not all about me Humility in behaviour · To put others before yourself · Building up others, rather than just yourself · You do not try and get revenge · You can apologise · You can win the argument but you choose not to · Less talking, more listening · You make the other person the centre of the conversation · You confront your prejudices What needs to be let go…… Blame, Anger, Resentment, Judgement, Denial, Superiority, Arrogance, Being Correct, Hypocrisy, Self-Righteousness, Pride, Entitlement, Greed, Perfectionism, Cravings, Selfishness, Intolerance, Impatience, Wanting To Control, Wanting To Manipulate, Expectations Of Others, Jealousy, Demands, Getting Revenge, Being Defensive, Being Childish.

I can't remember where I read this but it goes something along the lines of..... we don't love other people, we love how they make us feel, and we love what they do for us.

Great topic. Lots of varied advice. I'll echo some of the others. What I've learned the hard way in my recovery journey is... 1. I am too limited to do it on my own. I had to humble myself and connect with others who have similar problems and have recovered or are making some progress at least. This has meant being careful with who I connect with though. It's no good me being around people with too much of a victim mentality (not linking that to you). I have needed to be around people who are suffering but are taking responsibility for their suffering. 2. I have eliminated all mind altering drugs that are not prescribed by my doctor. I have eliminated all alcohol completely. 3. As others have said above. I have realised I am not the exception to the rule. No one is exempt from recovery and making some degree of progress with their mental state. No one. We all think at first we are sicker and more damaged than all these other sick people who seem to be making progress. 4. I have accepted that all my fruitful attempts at therapy (in one guise or another) are a lifelong process if I want to feel better within myself. There is no quick fix for me. There is no 3 month programme or 12 month programme. The programme is forever. 5. My peace of mind is directly linked to how well I can transcend my ego and animal instincts each day.

This is a really good question. I've been wondering the same thing. I'm a guy in my early 40s and been single for 5yrs. Not even a date. No sex. Nothing. Introvert issues and unable to take a risk has played a huge part in that though. I have been in several relationships and have a grown up son. Normally after about a year of being single I would start to force myself onto internet dating but now I have lost all of that drive and feel like I've shut up shop and am destined to be single forever! It doesn't bother me. But the fact it doesn't bother me feels strange. It's like I have lost that inner need to have a companion. I kind of hope people will reply "yeh it's fine to be single and you can still be fulfilled". It must be possible, but will you only ever get to a certain level? Like 90% fulfilled at the maximum as a single person? The last few relationships I've been in I have ended up wishing I was single and then eventually I was single. I am a little scared. The wrong person can f*** you up. The right person could possibly f*** you up as well! You can see why I am single.... I don't think my perspective on this issue is normal though. I'm shit scared of approaching girls and putting myself out there. I'm probably biased here because i know i don't currently have the mentality to change my situation. Sorry to hijack your thread....

Sometimes simple is best. Thanks for this.

Thanks loads for this. Looks excellent and I've downloaded the full file.

Lol - Yeh considering much insomnia is anxiety related why not brush up on some worse case scenarios and catastrophising!

I love this book. I don't agree (or find useful) some of his theory and I've struggled with all his other books but the bits I do like in Letting Go I really love! I've seen a few reviews and comments of this book on here. One factor I have not seen referred to much is that he explains that part of letting go of a negative mindset or feeling is to (1) identify the pay off's from that mindset or feeling and (2) focus on surrendering these pay off's. That's my take on the whole thing in a nutshell. Well that's what I choose to focus on. If I don't correctly identify the pay off's, any surrender or letting go is hampered. There is a lot more to his teachings in that book than simply sitting with the emotion until it runs it's course. If it was that simple then everybody would just need a one off therapy session lasting 5mins and told to do this. He did also say that one of his issues he surrendered took him 11 days. All day, everyday with surrendering. I think it was 11 days. He said the negative mindset then disappeared and never returned. I'm not sure I personally believe you banish the mindset/feeling forever, but I'd settle just for making progress on it and using Letting Go to further degrade my ego. This comment is not directed to the OP, it's just I sense that the reviews on this book I've read seem to not refer to the pay off's element of his teaching.

I don't accept that religion causes wars. Human beings cause wars and if there was no such thing as religion I'm pretty sure we would find some other "reason" to go to war.

Hi, In Alcoholics Anonymous, I don't think it's an exaggeration to say it's one of the most important principles of our programme. It's another one of those "principles" that doesn't really mean anything unless it's practiced. Personally, within my own goals and meditations I lump humility & ego together. In my own understanding, moving toward humility, moves me away from my own ego. If I move away from humility, I am moving closer to my ego. For me, my ego needs to be pushed back and kept at the back. In AA there is a wonderful quote from our Big Book along the lines of "Every time we played the big shot, we turned people against us. We concluded that whatever price in humility we must pay, we will pay it". I also like to remind myself of something I learned from Don Miguel Ruiz, along the lines of "You are the most important person in your own story but a secondary character in everyone else's". These are the thought patterns and behaviour I try to bear in mind each day to help me move towards being a more humble human being; Displaying a low sense of self-importance If I become agitated with another person's intention I have to ask myself "Am I sure?" (of their intention) I am aware that my thinking is limited and biased and always will be If I have any obvious power in situations, I try not to exercise it unless I absolutely have to More listening, less talking Try not to come across as defensive Staying out of all arguments Not taking things personally (that's hard work, but vital to my growth!) Saying sorry