Some Fella

Here's my take: mental silence (jhana) x maximum possible mindfulness (vipassana) x maximum possible loving kindness (metta) x 5-15% of time (arbitrary percentage) daily high intensity physical exercise flawless diet blast ego-death doses of psychedelics every single day until tolerance becomes insurmountable, wait for tolerance to go back down, repeat. basically: - don't think ever, lengthen the gaps between thoughts as long as possible, try to stay in the deepest jhana that you can, all day long. - be mindful of as much as possible at once, whilst simultaneously as focused & precisely as possible (may require alternating between the two for best results), all day long. - include some form of loving kindness or other feel-good meditation so you don't burn out & also to practice being loving. - physical exercise keeps the brain nice n oxygenated or however that works. high intensity = less time training the body = more time training the mind. - the psychedelics blast is based on Leo saying that they are the fastest method, but I'm worried this might become a crutch at such a high frequency. I also think it might be a cool idea to include this as well: pain x maximum possible (either daily or once every 1-4 weeks). this could serve as a way to measure our progress towards becoming imperturbable super-beings, lords of the earth & sky. Thoughts on my method? What's your method? Is the psychedelics blast a fast-track to mental illness?

@Moksha Mind = Blown!!! U put a smile on my face

@Quantum Toad I like this idea a lot.

@Atmagyani Very cool!

@Byun Sean Very cool! I also have had good results from contemplation. I got an enlightenment experience from contemplating where my sense of self is located, but it wasn't permanent!

Thank you all for so many amazing replies! I look forward to experimenting with the techniques & methods that people have recommended. I also would like to apologise for such a late reply to my own thread. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ @Fran11 1. I plan to do a deep exploration of the world of energy work, thanks! Any advice on places to start? Books, meta-sources? 2. Do you have any practical advice for dis-identifying with the I-thought? Would it look something like a mindfulness-based 'if-then' habit, i.e.: thought arises, such as a pre-verbal judgement or something with the word 'me'/'I' in it, & as soon as I notice it, I think this thought: 'this is not me/this is just an impersonal phenomena' & try to notice that e.g. by forcing myself to feel more like a listener of it rather than the active participant in thinking it? If my interpretation is misguided, how would it look like to dis-identify from the I-thought, moment-to-moment? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ @Moksha I will investigate all of these. I loved your explanation of Karma Yoga, it's about time I included more of this than just basic morality practices. Makes sense that if I'm going to do anything, it might as well be what I would do if I was identified with the whole. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- @RedLine Not yet. I'm brainstorming methods & trying to predict which will be the most effective. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ @RendHeaven Firstly, thank you so much for this amazing reply & for taking the time to point out so much of the self-deception going on in my current thinking. I have only ever had one ego-death/enlightenment experience on psychedelics, which was terrifying, so I am still a novice in this area. I like this idea of personifying the psychedelics. In my next trip, I will take on the attitude that I am dealing with an alive teacher, as opposed to my previous/current more materialistic approach, where I only consider them as inanimate chemicals causing changes to my brain for the purpose of assisting me with MY motives, exactly like you said. No doubt, if I took such an attitude to learning with a human master, they probably wouldn't want to work with me at all. Makes me wonder if this old attitude contributed to me having such a challenging trip. I have contemplated this on many occasions since my first ego-death experience. Sometimes I like to do a thought experiment where I imagine that someone has a gun to my head & is about to pull the trigger. I try to make it as vivid as possible, to try to convince myself that it's really happening, then I try to accept my fate or imagine what I might actually do in this situation. Sometimes I think I can accept it, but usually, if I'm self-honest, I'm shit-scared & would try to do anything I could to escape physical death. I would never commit suicide (kill the body). What have you realized from contemplating this yourself? But how will I be able to make progress if I'm distracted by my thinking? Surely the rejection of certain parts of reality is necessary for any of this to work? Isn't doing this the lesser of two self-deceptions, with thinking/monkey-mind being the greater? Further, isn't the thinking that I wish to silence, ITSELF a form of self-rejection/rejection of the present-moment? When my mind is silent & I am in deep jhana, it feels like I can appreciate [everything] far more than when I am following along with some train of thought about the past or future, solving my problems, etc. I understand that I am acting hypocritical & unenlightened by choosing to silence the mind at the expense of other phenomena, but isn't this the lesser of two evils? You're 100% correct here, I am in pain & I see enlightenment as a way out, this is my main/strongest motivation in this work. Me no like suffering! P.s. Yes, the lords of the earth & sky bit was intended as comedic. Finally: What do you suggest I do instead? What has worked well for you? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ @electroBeam What happened when you tried this? Do you have any theories as to what went wrong/why it didn't work? What's your story, Mr. Beam? Also, what do you do now instead that's more effective? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ @SirVladimir Very cool reply & thanks for the headsup. It's true, I do goal-ify enlightenment probably more than I should. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ @Jonty I like this practice too, very relaxing

Sure, willpower is useful to help us build habits like silencing our mind or meditating in the morning, but what role does it play beyond this (beyond facilitating the techniques needed for spiritual insight & integration)? How important is it in & of itself? To what degree do you prioritize it personally? I remember reading a comment from my favourite guru @Leo Gura on this that really surprised, but also intrigued me! Here's the direct quote: "Personally I don't like practices where I have to force myself to do something. To me harsh discipline doesn't feel loving or right. I don't like that brutal Zen approach to spirituality. But some people do. These days I prefer effortless approaches. The danger with that is, you can get lazy with it. So I certainly see the value of discipline. But ultimately I want my life to be so smooth and effortless that I don't have to force myself to do anything. So that's what I'm working towards. If I have to discipline myself all the time, to me that isn't the highest level of being. Life should be effortless." Source: What are your thoughts on this? Sounds like some very deeply considered & VERY high-level stuff to me! In all of my personal contemplations, willpower/bravery has showed up time & time again to be one of the biggest factors in living a happy life. In my personal experience, I would place this as third place in terms of contribution to my happiness, when compared with other self help techniques/principles/values. First place is the degree to which I can silence my mind (the result of which is sustaining jhanas throughout everyday life & control over my emotions). Second place is kindness & compassionate living, which certainly sounds sexier than having an empty head all day, but the belief-based/desire-based nature of it (for me at least) puts it in a similar lane to having lots of willpower. What role has willpower & it's aquisition played for you guys? Thoughts on Leo's take? Did it surprise you too? What about silencing the mind? How important has that been for you guys? More so than discipline? Less so? Do tell :D. What is the ratio of time you split between increasing your willpower vs enlightenment work? Do you even bother with the willpower stuff? To take this a step deeper, what IS willpower/courage/etc? After all, if fear is the opposite of love & courage is an antidote to fear...all the more food for thought! Respectfully, Some Fella

@dvdas Moved to the top of my list! Thanks!

I forgot: What would happen if you or someone did 5MeO every day for a year straight? Would you ever try this or something like it? What is the fastest path to blast your way to enlightenment?

How long can you go without thinking a single thought? Give us an estimate of your best time Are you enlightened? Was your enlightenment gradual or sudden? What is the highest dose of LSD or Magic Mushrooms or 5MeO-DMT that you have ever done? What is your daily/weekly routine? (or morning/evening) How many books have you read? How many hours per day do you meditate? What is your favorite form of physical exercise to stay fit? If you HAD to try to quantify it, how much has your net suffering decreased over the course of your lifetime so far? (or 'since starting your spiritual path'). How do experiences of depersonalization/derealization relate to enlightenment? Have you experienced either of these as a side effect of psychedelics, meditation or other spiritual practices? Thank you & best wishes!

@Leo Gura Were you on any substances? Was it a sober total awakening? Thanks & best wishes!

@Johnny5 It IS lovely, Johnny5! What a diverse & beautiful world in which we get to live!

@Recursoinominado I agree & second this, but let's not forget that Leo's income is tied to his reuptation. If too many people think he's a quack, he makes less money, which means actualized.org has less funding, which means less content, which is bad for our own self-agendas overall! He might even get removed from YouTube, after all he already openly promotes illegal substances, so let's not push our luck with the social media overlords!

@IAmReallyImportant badabapboom, ____. I think you cracked it! Classic (that oh how I wish never got old) My answer for the blank is defninitely snickers bars & sides of fries with things ?????, don't know if it's worth swapping to be perfectly honest, but that's probably why I'm still str8 snoozin?

For immediate relief, I would go for a good samatha meditation technique (or any meditation technique that relaxes you). A technique such as watching the breath & then just focusing on feelings of calmness/relaxation is quite fool-proof & it's my personal go-to for alleviating any momentary mental or emotional discomfort. I find that I can't really go wrong with meditation, but that it always helps me, no matter the particularities of todays struggle. Sticking with the basics (but not to the dogmatic exclusion of other methods) has taken me a long way. Longer term, a good place to start is delving into some yummy research on all the leads people have shared in this thread! Some examples that I can confirm as having worked for me: nofap, mushrooms, surrendering, goals, life's purpose. Hope this helps!

@dyslexicCnut I'm not an expert at this stuff by ANY means, but from what I personally have learned, here is my advice. 1. Honestly, just chill out, bro. I struggled with similar contemplations for months & really worked myself up into a lot of emotional turmoil over them. So my advice to you & my former self is first of all just to relax. We will get through this, it will be ok. Suffering exists? Ok, suffering exists. It's here? Ok, it's here. Cool, we have noticed that suffering is here. That's a good first step. That's step one completed. 2. Stop thinking - All the questions that you asked. What are they? Thoughts. - All the desires to have them answered? What's that? If it's not thoughts, we can probably agree that it exists in the same sort-of sensory substratum that thought does, i.e. this kind of mental-thoughty-emotiony sensory field. We might even call this a/the 'mind' per se (not metaphysical super magical mystical mind, but rather more akin to just the traditional definition of mind or what our culture tells us is mind). To make it more specific, we could instead replace 'mind' with this label: the sensory field in which mental phenomena (the senses: thoughts, emotions, feelings too subtle to be called emotions, etc) all are occuring within. Think of this like how if sights happen in the visual field, sounds in the auditory field, tastes in the taste field, etc, etc, then emotions & thoughts happen in the mental/mind sensory field. The point is not the title of this sensory field, but just noticing what I'm trying to point to & then kindly putting a cork in it. - So what happens when we stop thinking? That's where you come in, @dyslexicCnut ! You have to stop thinking & see what happens! - How to know when you've stopped thinking long enough & deeply enough: this issue of sufferings existence doesn't bug you anymore & you can get on with your life. ^if you're wondering what i mean by 'deeply', continue to not think until the afformentioned mental/mind sensory field drops into a state of barren & spacious emptiness. The more barren (the less thoughts/feelings), the 'deeper'. 3. Observe what remains. 4 (bonus). Read Nahm's first reply, it's very spot on, based on my personal experience. I'm almost a TOTAL novice to this work, but I truly believe that meditation is one of the best gifts that we can give to ourselves. I find that, once I go 'deep' enough into meditative states of mental emptiness & clarity, suffering basically just stops bothering me pretty much all together. I still suffer, but it becomes so small in intensitiy that it just doesn't get to me anymore. Instead of an 'absurd/sick/twisted/psychopathic cosmic joke of an existence', I get a feeling of calm contentedness & a more optimistic outlook! One of my favourite things about meditation is it's accessibility. You don't need illegal drugs or enlightenment or even advice, but can get some good practice at 'figuring this existence business out' instantly right now or with any spare time! If you want more help with meditation, I recommend downloading the Sam Harris Waking Up phone app (*whispers* if u ask nicely, he gives u the full version for free). Please, please ask away if you have any questions & I will answer!

@4201 Cool perspective. I think you pointed out something really important, but too easily overlooked: The need for willpower implies a lack of integration/wholeness to begin with. Good technique. Feels compassionate. Me likey. In my contemplations, courage & willpower show up to be identical. Fear=resistance/undesire, Love=acceptance/desire. As you know, ironically we discover that maximum undesire (desiring nothing at all) turns out to just result in maximum love (desiring everything exactly the way that it is). harks back to that theme of things coming full circle that Leo always talks about. Unconditionality deletes duality.

Hi, what are some of your favorite or the most effective ways you've discovered to build concentration skills/muscles? For me: 1. high intensity exercise in which I push myself to my limits (especially group exercise for that reason (pushing myself more)). 2. Anything that increases willpower / makes me suffer (why the exercise works so well). To be perfectly honest, it might be sloppy distinction-drawing, but I can't really seperate concentration & willpower in my direct experience, kinda seems like exact same thing. As a bonus question: What do you think? Looking forward to seeing some cool methods! If u want me to elaborate on anything, just ask & I will answer! Stay cool, homies???

@Mirko Wow, that's quite the technique-stack! That does suck that it didn't do much to help you reduce those useless thoughts though. :(. Good luck & I hope you pull through the dark night & get to somewhere better...

@Red-White-Light He touched a trans-reality bubble, pretty standard god-mode.

@Leo Gura what do you mean by "so conscious it starts to hurt"? Surely more consciousness would mean more love & peace & bliss? Are you only referring to the physical pain from the intense body-load? Thanks :).

oh my lawd some of the gold in this thread ? bellow is an excerpt from Leo's new manifesto

Thats great to hear! Looking forward to going a little no-mind on the 5MeO & seeing where I'm taken!

Is this the same as the ordinary verbal thinking done in Actualized.org's "how to contemplate" & "how to contemplate with a journal" videos, or is it more akin to thoughtlessly probing emptiness in self-inquiry or during no-mind meditation or samadhi? Or is it some kind of cutting-edge vision-logic post-verbal thinking that you have developed? If it's the last (I hope so, sounds exciting!), do you have any advice on how to develop this? Getting some 5meo for the first time soon & I want to get the most bang for my buck! Thanks.

@Nahm thank you for such a wisdom-dense answer, I've re-read several times & get more juice out of it each time. This reply is basically just me organising my own thoughts on what you said, but if it evidences there being something that I've misunderstood or any details you would like to add, replies are deeply appreciated. My take-away from what you said is: a process of "repeated" letting go of what arises/occurs, such that one becomes increasingly awake, sinking deeper into insight. Contemplation as "bringing a condition to what is without conditions" gave me a lot of food for thought. I have already noticed what I think u mean by this, whilst I was meditating on the nature of sound. I suddenly realised that all "sound" was, was a non-verbal thought that I was holding in the back of my mind (one might say; a belief in sound). When this thought was dropped, there was no sound, but I could still hear, only now what I was hearing (being) was samadhi/pure being, which turned out to be the answer I was looking for all along. This same process occured during self-inquiry, only it was with "me" & not "sound". Thank you for mentioning that word "utilize" to describe the way i cling to my thoughts, I didn't notice until now, but that's the exact rationalization I use for my clinging just about every time. In summary: Truth as the teacher...& we the pupil need take no notes, only shut our mouths and listen!???