Nivsch

hamas is projecting out his original disorder that would be expressed anyway, and got triggered and worse after Israel has established.

The Positive Link Tree 🌲 🌅 😃 some notes: 1. This link tree will be relatively short and will apear in an only one concentrated message per day or per couple of days, to not flood the thread, 2. This is NOT aimed to do an IDF propaganda. idf does make mistakes of course also in Gaza, and have to learn from them and develop himself. 3. However, sometimes an unjust skewed picture that is built from a cherry picking strategy has to be balanced out by a counter picture, even if you can claim it is also cherry picked. 4. I will try to not only show IDF goods here but also and even more than that, to show an authentic picture as much as I can of our society. 5. There is no desire to push an agenda to anybody here, but just to balance out what I think and feel as quite unjust and distorted picture being created here and to let everybody to judge the situation by themselves from a more balanced and stable position 🙂 https://www.i24news.tv/en/news/israel/society/1701708399-survey-shows-almost-half-of-arab-israelis-support-idf-response-to-hamas-in-gaza

@zazen You are free to think whatever you want. I can cherry pick five cases of murder everyday in Canada and flood the forum with them and you will be sure that canada is a medieval place. Your critisism is not really fair and decent becasue you take isolated cases and project them on Israel as allegedly this is the real character of Israel, which is far from the truth as west is far from the east. when pretending to take extreme cases and from them critisize an entire country, the critisim must be taken in a proper proportions and relative to realistic outcomes in a western world average context. Otherwise the critism will be misleading and hypocrite.

@kenway hamas strategy is all about being assimilated between civilians. You can suggest better ways to annihilate this terror organization if you have.

@hundreth I agree with you but the empathy to the other side is reduced to approximately zero when nobody here is willing to understand our side.

I can admit about myself, that my anger about the Gazan's support of hamas and their celebrations after oct 7th made me also think about them differently. Not to mention that those poor children are poisoned and brainwashed by hamas for the rest of their lives. Why isn't the world shaken by that? If your village was under pogrom and your friends were taken to behind the border being held with a gun to their head you would also say nasty things about the other side.

@zazen Criminals there are everywhere. Isolated cases of criminal activity when you have 10,000s soldiers operate there will always occure. This doesn't prove anything, sorry. By that logic, Canada is a murderous toxic masculine tyranni because sometimes women are being murdered by their husbands there, just like in everywhere else.

This is at most a too loose tactic to hit a terror target and you can critisize that but keep in mind there are 10,000s terror targets to attack and not sure if this is really possible to avoid this. But this is not at all a proof of an intentional attack on civilians. hamas uses civilians homes as its regular strategy.

They are not. Unless you have a proof of an intentional killing of cilivlians and you don't have that.

@kenway What I understand is that you and most of the people here care about the palestinians point of view much much more than the Isrealis point of view. That is for sure and beyond any doubt.

When people you care about will be held in Gaza for 80 days with a gun to their head after your village went through a pogrom, then a displacement of Gazans from their homes won't be exactly a top priority of your concerns.

To say they are just simplistic is an assault. Is like saying that flat earthers are just simplify the real picture, no, they are more like turn it upside down.

The complex relationships between the data are that matter. About the difference in casulaties see what I think here: There are no "executions" but isolated more rare cases of criminal activity by idiots can always be when you have tens of thousands of people or soldiers who are also people by the way, anywhere.

If Israel would harm civilians intentionally I would agree with you, but this is not at all the case.

@Raze Not true. hamas will not release the hostages without the military pressure. Imagine your friends and family were hostages in Syria and think whether you would not flip Syria upside down to release them. Part of the actions are aimed also to psychological purposes in order to rise the pressure, but you guys are so judgmental when it comes to Israel when you know quite well that you would do the exact same.

@_Archangel_ Think seriously about what would you do if you have for 15 years to go through countless operations that lead to nothing and when one day your entire village were killed or kidnapped while Gazans citizens are celebrating giving out toffy candies.

@_Archangel_ To understand something logically like an history lesson is not enough. It is interesting that when it comes to the palestinians responsibility to the problem, the "understanding" here is conceptual and logical almost like to understand dry data and numbers. But when it comes to Israel responsibility it is really enough to just read an article about a stupid soldier who robbed a grocery store, to be so attached to it emotionally and throw it on the entire military forces, that by the way, are now sacrifice themselves and their lives in one of the most dangerous and trapped war zones in the world. Part of them are half kids that are not less deep or less loving than me and you. Oh no but they are "soldiers", they are just "IDF". No they aren't.

I am not admitting any "massacre". I admit an intention to kill only terrorists but a more lose outcomes because of the explanations I wrote. Every country would behave the same and most likely more if cornered in such a way as France just admitted for example. The inability to see Israel's point of view here is amazing to me. But what can I expect when stage red highly manipulative propaganda like al jazeera gets probably high rating from here. At least if the discussion was fair and every claim was accompanied by an earthly wording explanation. But no, 95% are slogans and cloudy words.

@Leo Gura Also the evacuation from Gaza in 2005 and all the offers to the palestinians to have more than 95% of the west bank area, adding to that the other agreements in the 90s including Oslo, Y and Hebron all of that are a big hole in the "Long term ethnic cleansing" theory.

This is a sum of: 1. hamas's number one survival strategy to hide between and disguise to civilians. 2. The huge amount of terror targets (10,000s) to attack what makes it impossible to think every time how to not hurt civilians even if you really want not to. 3. Israel's patience that over after cornered in such an extreme way physically and also psychologically in a way people here I think highly underestimate and miss out, what makes her to behave looser.

@Breakingthewall That is not at all what I said.

@Leo Gura I am against the settlements, but I still can understand why after 15 years of countless quite surgical operations and exhuastion, and after that horror in october that was celebrated by Gazans citizens in the streets, Israel's patience will be over and it will explode on them.

@zazen But they were offered, and by many mediators (Anapolis conference for examples) and almost the whole world was trying to generate a deal for them and they didn't want to hear. About the conditions, would you let the far more violent side a full access to maritime and air ways from the beginning?

@Bandman Maybe because there are people who still want to hear an authentic first person perspective composed from 36 years of actually living in Israel that maybe can show you some raw insights that aren't cherry picked, aren't distorted and aren't polluted by who knows how many hands that touched it before it came to your eyes. Try to listen also to the other side it won't kill you.

@zazen They have got countless offers to have a state that would stop the settlements expansion right away, and they refused.