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@zazen Even if the war was 100% pure the collateral damage was super high anyway. I do agree that there is an extra material damage that isn't necessary to eliminate hamas and I can't negate some sort of (material) collective punishment. But this is still an hypocricy. Israel did huge efforts for 18 years during its surgical 10 operations in Gaza. The civilian population also hold some responsibility and part of them are not really entirely seperated from hamas (but the human target has to be and actually is of course only hamas), what doesn't justify the amount of damage and I think a more moderate governemt would lessen the damage. But even with all the good intentions, Gaza would have been mostly destroyed as an inevitable outcome of destroying its terror organization.

@zazen Of course you will react dis-proportionally after trauma.

@zazen Ok if you want to judge a nation 5 minutes after it got the worst trauma since its establishment. Every sane person would react this way. Presidents are still human beings.

@Vrubel Gantz is also very moderate and I hope he will replace Bibi. He has the best chance right now and has a great support from the Israelis.

@zazen This is the most triggering conflict to the average reader around the world because this is the most tangible example of so different and far from each other values systems clash.

They take their privilege of living in a democracy totally for granted. They have too much free time to fantasize on the bad guy who represents their lower stages values they subconsciously crave and symphatize with him unproportionally. They can only learn in the hard way.

We were especially loved and hugged by the world in 7.10 and 8.10 and 9.10. Until we invade Gaza. World's opinion is like a roller coaster and it will be changed once again to Israel's favor once the terror reach their doorstep.

@Raze 2. If your family and friends were hostages in a nearby country which its citizens allowed it to become a terror base, you would also, likely, do maximum material damage that would put the best pressure as possible to release them and you easily would have no sympathy in this heated moments to those citizens property. 3. An extreme minority of fanatic French people attacked German people, what causes Nazi Germany ideology to be created (an analogy) but not before they declared they want compromises (what they really said) and don't want war 4. Sometimes war is necessary, like the current example.

1. The suicide as a method started then but the explosions (without suicide) attacks of Palestinians against Israeli civilians started long before that. 2. hamas and fatah are both responsible since 90s. 3. You will have to add examples of such intentional "massacares" of civilians (not terrorists).

This is a low intensity war against hamas in the west bank since 2002 until this day, the only thing that stopped the suicide bombers came from there. No massacares at all. You conflated civilians with hamas.

This tactic won't work. The initiated or intentional violence coming from Israel is promil in comparison to that of the Palestinian's terror organizations.

@Bobby_2021 Which means all the so called developed countries like UK, Sweden and the like are indeed very developed relative to the muslim countries, but in the broad sense even them are still only half-baked developed because, among other things, the reasons you mentioned.

@LSD-Rumi But it didn't. This was just South Africa government who invited hamas leaders to their office during the same month in when they submitted their claim to the court. The court did nothing tangible/operational because it also understood this "genoc*de" legend isn't a serious thing.

@Raze Actually many proofs for that has been displayed by Israel. To deny the human shield is like to deny oct 7th. This is the ABC of a terror organization most basic behaviour who has no other chance to survive against a powerful military but through this way.

+1 🧡

This is true to Ben Gvir party. Not to 90% of the Israelis who are westerners average and developed just like the west. This paragraph goes very deep (in my opinion) into the psychological complexity of all of us but seems the strongest (on average) in the west left. This is not to say we don't have to be humane as possible in this war, we have to. But this is still a worth thinking and learning from statement.

Northern East Europe and South America.

Blockage 🤣 But seriousely, if Saudi and Amirates (or some similar version with moderate Arab countries) will take the charge then Gazans life will be much better than all of the tragic last 20 years under hamas. But Netanyahu is terrible and always run from any geopolitical creative thinking what makes US to now seeth with anger on him for a good reason.

@Carl-Richard The west, today, honors the individualism way too much above the other values, unproportionally, what creates many problems. 2. The west emphasizes one's strenghts also too much, and overlook the importance of working on the person's weaknesses, from them even more important development can occure.

@zazen Enough with the naiveness. UNRWA has been proven to be connected to hamas and giving blind eye to terror behind any doubt.

+1 ❤

@Merkabah Star For me to deny the human shield issue as number one strategy and effort of hamas is similar to deny oct 7th. You are free to think whatever you want, anyway.

@Merkabah Star 5 minutes ago you denied that hamas hides behind civilians and use them as a shield and dismissed it as a "cool story". Then of course that Israel and hamas will seem to you as equal, when you design the reality however you want.

I really don't understand the tactic of focusing on the borderline/problematic 5%+ and doing such efforts days and nights to make the other side to look as monsterous as possible. This is a cold calculated stragety the pro palestinian side is champion in. This is so toxic, just in analogy to how the bully child in school make everyone else to laugh at the shy quiet kid. I could also use this tactic on Canada and people here will be sure at the end of the day that Canada is the darkest place on earth with the worst people. But I won't. I don't believe in this evil way.

So lets not react at all and let the PTSD poison our society and destroy us from inside. You are holding Israel to a tier 2 trauma management tools. How easy is to demand unrealistic expectations from the side you don't like.