Nivsch

@Emerald could you give me an example of a question i can ask conservative person which is cutting the less visible walls of his belief? Your wrote to ask him about the value itself but it still difficult for me to understand what actually can i ask him.

@Zizzero thank you for the in-depth answer. I want to make Israel a country i can proud of, like marine-sided north european country (for the beginning deep stage green country is sufficient to me ? ) and doing more liberal policy for the citizens and minorities from any kind and LGTBQ rights. Right now 55% of the population in israel is blue-orange and force ALL of us right-wing depressive government which doesnt care of the micro problems of the citizen and cares only the macro things (like a machine ?‍♂️) and i want to make soft-right wing people to move just a little bit into the center and thats enough for them to change their vote in the next election.

@bejapuskas what did you do and what is the main stage of your mum and of yours? What did she start practicing?

What we have to do as a political group of young activists - to stop all our activities? Or only give flyers and show what our party did or planning? What would you do if you were in a political group and try to do yellow strategy?@bejapuskas @Zizzero

I understand but what to say to them?

? how do you know them?

Sorry for "flooding" its a special week. Next time i'll try to send one topic per 1-2 weeks. There are 2 main parties this election in israel: 1. "Blue&white" (our flag colors) - liberal pluralistic, soft capitalism orange-green values. my vote. 2. "Likud" - conservative very capitalistic blue-orange values. The dilemma is that i want my blue&white party to win, but than, i wont be able to teach our young activists the Spiral Dynamics model, because they wont be open to learn it, because - we won, so we dont need to learn something new... and it remain like this for 2-4 years! and it will dissapoint me. But if we loose, it will be perfect opportunity to make them open to the model and i want them SO much to learn it from me. So i will teach them yellow style of thinking to make us win the NEXT elections. There is a deeper question here - what will make our country progress faster in the long run - Winning now, or loosing? I dont expect you to know the answer but its very interesting. So i feel in like an inner conflict. Because in one hand i want to win, but in the other hand i want the model to flourish among my party friends and activists. And it will flourish only if we loose. middle-way scenario - we loose but still strong enough and the government will be 50% us and 50% likud. worst scenario - we loose and the government is gonna be the most religous and conservative EVER in israel! (New extremely right-wing parties in likud coalition). Can be a little dangerous for the independence of the supreme courte, and who knows what more. Depressive...

@Good-boy he will be back It is like an harmonic oscillation and it seems that now he need to also do other things... Its a phase, and we all like that. Just accept and flow with it...

Because i cant find any prove for it. Karl marx doesnt seems like a blue person. Maybe the phylosophy itself isnt blue, but that real implementation of this theory can only be done by blue regime? Because it written that karl marx communism was a response for the capitalism, which is the opposite to what spiral dynamics shows us. Because in this case it seems like blue communism was a response for orange capitalism... cannot be happen in spiral dynamics. I am arguing with a right-voter friend and trying to explain him that the extreme right (in the politics scale) were originally established communism, but he argues that the left is originally communist because when israel established in 1948, the far-leftists parties were inspired by the soviet communism which is true.

@Serotoninluv ? We lost the election ? Equality with the 2 main party seats but only conservatives can build a coalition (they have the majority of parlament members in all the cons. Parties). So right now, i want to start teaching as much people as i can in the left-center sector the spiral dynamics model. What is the best way to make classic right-wing people to move leftward? Is the best way is to teach them stage orange limits? Where can i find a big list of stage orange limits? Leo gave a nice list of some good limits but i want a bigger list.

@Joseph Maynor but what about stalin's communism? stalin cannot be green. He is so brutal he tortued and murdered people so the communism of stalin must be blue. Green in far more sensitive and aware of the feeling of other people that maybe green can be social democratic and thinking about communism as an theoretic idea but never really establish it in reality.

@Wyatt @SgtPepper thank you!

It can happen, for my opinion, when green is so polarized and deep in his agenda that his range of sight is narrower than the moderate half blue-half orange person. for example - an extremist leftist person can be naive and dont understand how our enemies are thinking and why blue-orange strategies are more efficient than green strategied in detering our enemies from attack us, and preserving our country strong enough to defeat our enemies. i can see it many times in Israel (im israerli citizen) and in the smart way which TRUMP understands the middle-east which is WAY better than OBAMA's very limited understanging. Just to know that 50% of the Israeli people are very developed orange-green people and they are not less developed than any european or american person. i say it because there is misunderstand israel (and israelis) many times and there are meny biased view about this state

@eleveneleven so SURPRISE - I'm green in many parameters and still think that the far-leftists are wrong. I believe in dynamic-centrism which use the good stuff from the right and the left, and thats why i think that exetreme leftists have a very naive point of view about the real intention of... (ok not enemies but) the violent ideologs of our neibours in the middle east. And when a terrorist regime say over and over again he want to destroy israel we dont have the privilege to be long-term thinkers about them because if we make even one tiny mistake they will reach atomic weapon capacities which is a hugh problem from the tiny piece of land we are living it.

@bejapuskas you are right. I was in vegan protests in 2013 2014 2017 and i was never violent but i saw some of the activists entered macdonalds and did provocation it was funny i dont know if its effective but its not my style. Just a month ago i was very overwhelmed and even crying after my father said he is capable to kill a caw (i asked him hypotetically) but i dont think he really capable we are liberal family (but not in every topic as you can see...) *But* last month i discovered spiral dynamics and it just solved my emotional problem about it and now i am not frastrated anymore that my family eat meat because i know they just havent reach yet to this stage so it has very liberated me psycologically ☺ they are orange-green people but not vegan (yet... ?)

@Serotoninluv good explanation thank you and i agree with you

@kieranperez I meant that trump understand better the middle east than obama. If i was an american, i probably would vote obama/hilery and I can totally understand why to support obama, but as an israeli citizen, i will trust more a president who understand the middle east and dont do risky agreement with a terrorist regime of Iran that only postpone the nuclear problem for 10-15 years but not solving it at all.

@Truth Addict i know that obama is more developed but i think he fails to really integrate the healthy sides of blue (because if he is yellow he have to do this) in setting a clear red line for Iran for example. He though that 150 million dollars will make their regime moderate but the excact opposite happened. So obama is green and mybe yellow but not enough into yellow yet. He is really "on the clouds" on this topic.

@Leo Gura of course i mentioned and credited you in my summary.

@Leo Gura Hi Leo thank you for your response, I really understand why you think what you think about me (it indeed may look from my message when someone is reading this when not knowing me) but i have to say that you are missing me because i have never voted for any right-wing party and in tuesday there is election in israel and i will vote for Centrist party. I am training mindfulness for 2.5 years so far (not sitting but doing it 20 minutes a day when walking) and also the "do nothing" method and last year i started to read books about happiness and positive psycology and budhism for the main goal of improving my mental health (ocd and anxiety) and all of this really help me I am vegan since 2013 (because of animals right), i am very emotionally against deforestation and polution of the sea. I think that health system is terrible (not the emergency health care but the "everyday" health care) by damaging our health and i believe very strongly in natural health and 801010 raw diet. Im not fully 801010 but try to embrace its principles in some degree and more and more during the time. I am against the "only money" thinking of trump and against the only macro-economi agenda of our prime minister netanyaho and i think he doesnt really understand the citizens. He doesnt pay enough attention to disabled person - physically and *mentally* of course that in that subject our society is still in medieval era (in mental health understanding). Of course i support LGBTQ rights but it also because me myself is gay (not sure that fully gay but mostly fore sure 80%-95%) and my parents accepted it very quickly and positively and my father often asks me how is going with my dates and if i have dates and etc. And i was *SO* excited by Spiral Dynamics that just one week ago i finished summarizing all your lectures Leo in hebrew and of course credited you in my summary - nemtioned your name and links to all your spiral dynamics lectures in youtube and mentioned your website - and also a little from another sites and articles of some other people, to send it to everyone in my family and friends I hope to win the election but I know that even if we loose, it may help for the longer run so i am going to use this model a lot in trying to teach the political activists of our party the YELLOW style of thinking and strategies trough the summery i did. I emphsize for them than only yellow strategy can be effective in their activities. It will take time to them to read and response to that (not easy haha) now they are so busy in their activities of elections so they are not going to read it even if i really want them to do so Yes i have passion to succes and orange stage is not going to leave me so fast but i think i have a lot of green and iam trying to be more meta thinking to raise our country in the spiral (this is now the main goal of my political activity).

Especially when i am with people and suddenly the anxiety appears (not because of them but because other themes that i have fears or obssesive thoughts from - fear of flying for example) and then i try to do the awareness method or "do nothing" method and nothing happen. My mind is so noisy so i cannot even do the "do nothing" or "accept" the emotion, and i feel extremely lost in that moment. my brain is so overwhelmed and cannot do any technique at all! And it just make my anxiety worse. What can i do in this situations? What helps you from your experience? Thank you

Thank you for your answers

State coral comes when turquoise cant flow anymore because reality become too chaotic that it overwhelm his ability to live in harmony, or there are new threats on his survival or that some turquoise just want something fresh to happen and then starting to manipulate the system to behave more as they want it to behave and it actually starts to occur in cyber attacks. Tier 2 manipulates tier 1 urges to change the system like it wants. I just hope that in the next stage (violet) Life will be even more spiritual and spontaneous then turquoise, or that maybe it still be theocracy of systems (one octave above blue) and be less spiritual than turquoise (or even so more spiritual??) Its very confusing in this far point.