VeganAwake

It also felt unsettling, like free floating or free falling, or being stuck between 2 realities for a while. But it became very clear, very fast, that there just never was a "me" from the start. There never was a VeganAwake character attached to all these conditioned concepts/beliefs......there seemed too be.....it was certainly assumed to be......but it wasn't really there. It was an attachment to self referential thinking or identification as the thinker. So it never was a certain way for "me" because "me" was an illusion.

Totally, That's what I refer to as conditioning. Jim's not trying to put forth additional concepts to believe in........he is pointing out that anarchy is the best word to describe the apparent reality when all these beliefs/concepts are recognized as BS. Liberation isn't a new concept or belief or paradigm for someone to live by. It's the end of the someone that seemed to identify and believe in those concepts altogether. Even the concept that there must be an ultimate creator/controller (god) of everything collapses. And that realization can be very unsettling.........Jim often talks about how terrifying it was initially.

Nonduality isn't saying that there isn't apparent separation between physical objects like, humans, trees, and rocks. It's referring to the internal self illusions which seem to suffer psychologically. That which seems to suffer when it's called an ass hole or that which seems to suffer when it believes it's not good enough. There are not 2 of these, there's not even 1

I had never heard of Jim until after seeing through the self illusion. Interestingly it was one or two of Leo's self inquiry/introspection videos and then a couple lines from an Adyashanti video that seemed very meaningful at the time! But these catalysts have to be taken with a grain of salt because there was already an openness and a feeling like there was something right under my nose that was always there, but being overlooked. Like an examination outside of a personal perspective. An empty and innocent introspection. "When the student is ready the teacher appears" - multiple philosophical traditions

We are just like the grass growing and the salmon spawning, just like a wildfire or disease spreading. It's not crucial or important. It just happens. It doesn't matter if it continues or stops. It doesn't matter if reality is understood or not, or if you keep trying The fame and fortune won't matter or eating healthy and exercising. The meditation, yoga and spiritual practices neither. Nothing will save us, not knowing, not enlightenment, not not knowing It's totally hopeless, but in this understanding there is also a sense of relief, a relaxation glimpse, a sense of unconditional freedom maybe. An invitation to inevitable hopeless freedom

I understand your theory! Do you believe there will still be the memory of the life of Breakingthewall after that body dies?

Death Bypassing Syndrome

I do enjoy your optimistic attitude about the topic. I do believe you may have a serious case of DBS.

"Humans and squirrels share roughly 80% to 85% of their DNA, as both belong to the superorder Euarchontoglires. Despite this high genetic similarity, profound differences exist in how their genomes are organized and expressed, reflecting about \(90\) million years of distinct evolutionary divergence". The divergence part is way over rated 😅

Every single living organism within the infinite cosmos of this incredible phenomenon called reality, will eventually be dead. And when there is an end of life, there is simultaneously an end to knowing life or anything ever existed. It will be identical to prior birth or deep sleep. Absolute nothing. Not even absolute, just nothing. It's in that realization that nothing matters or is important. Even saying that it relatively matters and is important, doesn't make logical sense. It either ultimately matters or it doesn't. It could be said that it temporarily seems to matter and is important but temporary and permanent both equal nothing because nothing is permanent. Infinite impermanence is the reality 😳

Totally, It wasn't a recommendation to do or not do anything in particular, but I can understand how it might sound that way. It's more like a: do whatever you want without the additional stress/concern of it being inherently important message. It's not necessarily a: nothing is important, so turn into a depressed, fat, couch potato, although that would be perfectly fine also message.

Reality is complex in the sense that it has had an unfathomable amount of time to become what it is today. Like an anteater didn't grow an elongated snout and tongue overnight or the honey badger didn't start having immunity to certain snake venom in a few months....... It's complexity is that it's had time on its side sorta speak!!!

@Breakingthewall Almost like that conditioned imagination is running rampant and there's nobody available to stop the identification with it!

I'm pretty certain what she means is, "could this entire belief system being described, simply be a concocted story stemming from the spirituality conditioned imagination of the body/mind organism of Breakingthewall".

Where is it then?

What was seen?

@Breakingthewall Most are deathly afraid of looking within closely. They subconsciously already know it's emptiness appearing as a knower. "I" doesn't want to see clearly the empty reflection. The only thing that should be feared is fear itself!

Thank you! I love reading about the self illusion over and over. Keep it up!! 👍

I doesn't realize that the self isn't real. It just becomes obvious if it's looked at closely enough. That which attempts to claim ownership of this introspection, is nothing more than a habitual thought process. An assumed self reaffirming/circular logic illusion ♻️ I have been plenty serious over the last few years. If that isn't obvious, what can be done? It's a hell of a stubborn illusion 🤷‍♂️

@Breakingthewall Its not important. In fact, I want "you" to keep calling everything "self", it's fun! I hope to never again read a single paragraph without "you" describing it as the self, capissh! You could even make a catchy little jingle. 🎶 🎵 "I am you & you are me, but if you don't agree, I will kick you in the knee. You have to see that everything is we, you have to feel the process is real, you have to know that I am the GOAT!!! GOOOOO SELF!!!

We? You got a twin brother Smashingthefence or Kickingtherock? 😉 I get what you mean though. But then, why even say "being aware" "you" "self" ? Awareness implies a someone or something "being aware". Same with experience, experience implies "an experiencer". It was clearly recognized that this identification, (the aware experiencer) wasn't actually real and/or there at all........it was assumed to be there, but upon close inspection, it ultimately lacked in reality and had never been from the start. It just never was. It had only seemed to be. (thats why referred to as self illusion) Anyways, that sense of awareness/experience, was later realized to just be the 5 bodily senses: sight, sound, smell, taste, feel.......coupled with the spiritually conditioned imagination..........yahtzee, feels like a someone/something is aware and observing.

Thats because "your" projection of "him", is a real "separate self" with its own theory of reality, which doesn't obviously match "yours" But "he's" not pushing a conceptualized theory like "you" are! "He's" attempting to point out that the identification as the conditioned "thinker/knower", is the main misunderstanding being overlooked. There is no real content to what "he" is saying because "he" is pointing out the content free nature of reality, once the thinker has been surrendered. Basically he's not in the business of having a conversation, and going back and forth with that which is caught up identified as the knower! When the mirage of the ice cold Dr Pepper machine in the desert is recognized to be unreal, you don't keep endlessly chasing it! Unless it wasn't seen through!

But "you" aren't ultimately the reality! That's the apparent issue with being identified as/with the spirituality conditioned mind. Sure the conditioned imagination is unlimited, but there isn't a real Breakingthewall character period! That exact character that believes it's unlimited, is an illusion!

Unknowing 🙏

This reminds me of the freedom of unknowing or not knowing. When it's an actual humble realization that certain things cannot be understood or known.......it can be a huge sense of relief.......& interestingly other things become better understood.